Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[ChairmanPoo]

Spoiler: the Far Right is now the second largest party

[TheDarkStar]

I find it more than slightly worrying that the far right is getting so popular everywhere.

[Helgoland]

Spoiler: the Far Right is now the second largest party

In Sachsen-Anhalt. Big whoop.

[ChairmanPoo]

Dont worry guys, I've got this. What we need is to infiltrate the party, maybe use some kind of likely figure to do so (an exsoldier of some sort maybe?), in order to keep a tab on them.  Its a solid plan, without any fissures!

[Antsan]

Or it makes pilots fear seeking psychological help because they could face repercussions at work, and now there are more pilots with issues going completely untreated.

I know this is actually already happening in countries where there is extreme social stigma against mental illnesses. People are already choosing not to seek professional help because they would be out of a job immediately.

Yeah m8 in today's world of mass data collection they have nowhere to hide if they don't want help

That's got nothing to do with mass data collection but with how hard it is to hide where you are going every Thursday at 15:00.
Oh, wait, misread. The people who do mass data collection aren't psychologists and even if they were that's hardly enough for a real diagnosis.

[Loud Whispers]

I know this is actually already happening in countries where there is extreme social stigma against mental illnesses. People are already choosing not to seek professional help because they would be out of a job immediately.

Unnamed countries
Unnamed stigmas
Unnamed illnesses
Unnamed jobs
Unnamed people
Source of knowledge anonymous

I agree with the principle but that's because I already agree, don't take it for granted that people do

Yeah m8 in today's world of mass data collection they have nowhere to hide if they don't want help

That's got nothing to do with mass data collection but with how hard it is to hide where you are going every Thursday at 15:00.
Oh, wait, misread. The people who do mass data collection aren't psychologists and even if they were that's hardly enough for a real diagnosis.

You're right, that's why you get psychiatrists on board, identify which of your pilots are high risk or even just have all of them undergo mandatory psychiatry examinations and if they don't want to disclose the results then relax patient confidentiality so a suicidal pilot doesn't walk on board after having been determined as extremely depressed by doctors and end up killing hundreds of people with him

[Antsan]

Source of knowledge anonymous

Exactly, for obvious reasons.
I don't know the exact country, but it's probably one of the Balkan route.
Concrete disease is depression, but I doubt the stigma is this differentiated – probably it's just about "mental illnesses".
Jobs are any. It's not only about the possibility of loosing their current job, it's also about not being able to ever find another.

I agree with the principle but that's because I already agree, don't take it for granted that people do

There's nothing I can do about that.

You're right, that's why you get psychiatrists on board, identify which of your pilots are high risk or even just have all of them undergo mandatory psychiatry examinations and if they don't want to disclose the results then relax patient confidentiality so a suicidal pilot doesn't walk on board after having been determined as extremely depressed by doctors and end up killing hundreds of people with him

Or proper safety measures are implemented so a single person cannot just decide to crash the plane.
Or even better: Replace human pilots. The digital ones are already better than the ones who don't plan to crash the plane.

[Loud Whispers]

Exactly, for obvious reasons.
I don't know the exact country, but it's probably one of the Balkan route.

Your vague geography is painful to europol thread where we obsess with geography's finer details and do not place the Crimea in Pakistan, we leave that to the Yanks

Concrete disease is depression, but I doubt the stigma is this differentiated – probably it's just about "mental illnesses".
Jobs are any. It's not only about the possibility of loosing their current job, it's also about not being able to ever find another.

Probably, possibility, speculation on a good track but without fact to sink teeth into

I agree with the principle but that's because I already agree, don't take it for granted that people do

There's nothing I can do about that.

Except have an argument that doesn't hinge on the premise of everyone already agreeing with you and accepting your anonymous, vague, general claims as fact? It's not too hard to get demonstrable proof for most things in life these days

You're right, that's why you get psychiatrists on board, identify which of your pilots are high risk or even just have all of them undergo mandatory psychiatry examinations and if they don't want to disclose the results then relax patient confidentiality so a suicidal pilot doesn't walk on board after having been determined as extremely depressed by doctors and end up killing hundreds of people with him

Or proper safety measures are implemented so a single person cannot just decide to crash the plane.

Beyond having two pilots in the cabin at all time (which they now do), you cannot make a cabin both pilot-proof and hijacker-proof. Also I don't understand this either-or mentality where you cannot do one smart thing in addition to another, you can only pick one for some reason. This is not smart, this is very stupid. Do all the smart things.

Or even better: Replace human pilots. The digital ones are already better than the ones who don't plan to crash the plane.

But not better than the pilots who don't intend on committing suicide via plane; if your worry is mentally ill pilots being discriminated against by employers making all pilots unemployed is an interesting response which I don't think would be all too good for their health. And as in most situations, the correct response would be why not have all the smart things. Pilots and autopilot, not pilots or autopilot.

[Antsan]

But not better than the pilots who don't intend on committing suicide via plane;

This is exactly what I was not saying. Automatic pilots are better than human ones, no matter whether they want to commit suicide or not. They are solely not used because most humans would be more afraid of flying with the (better) digital pilot than with a human one.

Except have an argument that doesn't hinge on the premise of everyone already agreeing with you and accepting your anonymous, vague, general claims as fact? It's not too hard to get demonstrable proof for most things in life these days

Well, then go out and get some. I'm too lazy. I'm perfectly fine with not convincing anybody who doesn't already believe this. I cited is as a reason for my assessment that you can see at the bottom of this post.

Beyond having two pilots in the cabin at all time (which they now do), you cannot make a cabin both pilot-proof and hijacker-proof. Also I don't understand this either-or mentality where you cannot do one smart thing in addition to another, you can only pick one for some reason. This is not smart, this is very stupid. Do all the smart things.

I'm not saying this is an either-or thing, I am saying that taking away patient confidentiality is a bad idea.

[Loud Whispers]

This is exactly what I was not saying. Automatic pilots are better than human ones, no matter whether they want to commit suicide or not. They are solely not used because most humans would be more afraid of flying with the (better) digital pilot than with a human one.
Well, then go out and get some. I'm too lazy. I'm perfectly fine with not convincing anybody who doesn't already believe this. I cited is as a reason for my assessment that you can see at the bottom of this post.

Assertion without any quantifiable evidence. This is the problem with lazy argumentation, who cares if no one is convinced, if you act as if everyone is no one is informed - even those convinced
Otherwise it's just an argument because for because

Beyond having two pilots in the cabin at all time (which they now do), you cannot make a cabin both pilot-proof and hijacker-proof. Also I don't understand this either-or mentality where you cannot do one smart thing in addition to another, you can only pick one for some reason. This is not smart, this is very stupid. Do all the smart things.

I'm not saying this is an either-or thing, I am saying that taking away patient confidentiality is a bad idea.

Yeah, but taking away some patient confidentiality for commercial pilots is a good idea

[Antsan]

Otherwise it's just an argument because for because

Using physics jargon: It was a postulate used to argue for my point. You agree with the postulate. There has to be a disconnect between that postulate and my conclusion, why don't you focus on that?

Yeah, but taking away some patient confidentiality for commercial pilots is a good idea

1. It makes people less likely to go to the doctor and get their illnesses treated. That is a bad thing.
2. Forced evaluation by a psychologist is not nearly as effective as evaluation that is accepted by the diagnosed. Forcing people into therapy/diagnosis in exchange for a situation in which they are more likely to get it on their own volition is a bad thing.
3. Having more of these evaluations is a good thing, yes. You can also get these by requiring a psychological evaluation before hiring.

[Loud Whispers]

Using physics jargon: It was a postulate used to argue for my point. You agree with the postulate. There has to be a disconnect between that postulate and my conclusion, why don't you focus on that?

I'M ANGRY
ABOUT WORDS

U2LAZY4ME

1. It makes people less likely to go to the doctor and get their illnesses treated. That is a bad thing.

Assertion and generalization without evidence and does not address mandatory psychiatry sessions as in other professions

2. Forced evaluation by a psychologist is not nearly as effective as evaluation that is accepted by the diagnosed. Forcing people into therapy/diagnosis in exchange for a situation in which they are more likely to get it on their own volition is a bad thing.

No not psychologist, psychiatrist, and allowing suicidal people who are known to medical authorities to fly planes by disallowing doctors to warn them resulting in mass assisted suicide is a bad thing; paid sick leave and mandatory psychiatry evaluations would solve this pretty neatly

3. Having more of these evaluations is a good thing, yes. You can also get these by requiring a psychological evaluation before hiring.

They already have mental and physical health evaluations in addition to intelligence evaluations before hiring, they also do self-policing in regards to their pilots suffering from trauma such as family deaths, divorces or alcoholism, ever since the 90s when they stamped out pilots drink-flying. This is not the first time as well mentally ill pilots have popped up, with pilots getting berserk after getting locked out of cockpits for example - this one was notable for the berserk pilot being the one locking everyone else out. This is pretty much the only loop left unclosed

[Helgoland]

Hey Ant, how many people in the East would be down with de-unifying Germany? The idea appears more and more appealing to me...

[Ukrainian Ranger]

Hey Ant, how many people in the East would be down with de-unifying Germany? The idea appears more and more appealing to me...

Start war with Poland. Let them occupy East Germany. Job is done.

[Kot]

Hey Ant, how many people in the East would be down with de-unifying Germany? The idea appears more and more appealing to me...

Start war with Poland. Let them occupy East Germany. Job is done.

I, for once, agree with you, though I wouldn't mind if Ukraine started a war with Poland and let us occupy western Ukraine.