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[FallacyofUrist]

Oh I see. I don't know what would happen if a player died in this game and then tried to play a game on the Mafia subforum.

Good man.

I support Proposal 75a.

[Elephant Parade]

Proposal 76 - Tokens, Expanded: The following sources of tokens are added:

• Mafia Master: Winning a game of Mafia gives you 5 tokens.
• Professional Proposer: Whenever a proposal of yours passes, you gain 1 token. If two of your proposals fail in a row, you gain 1 token.

The following uses for tokens are added:

• Bonus Proposal - 3 tokens: Create an extra proposal this turn.
• Colour Change - 1 token: Your name will be coloured in the inter-turn status block. You must choose a colour.

Tokens gained from Mafia Master and Professional Proposer are added to a player's status within the inter-turn status block in which they are earned; if, somehow, they are earned within a turn, they are added to a player's status in the next inter-turn status block.

To purchase something using tokens, a player with at least enough tokens in their possession must state that they are doing so.

Oh I see. I don't know what would happen if a player died in this game and then tried to play a game on the Mafia subforum.

Good man.

I support Proposal 75a.

Actually, I was more concerned about the initiation of a second Nomic Mafia game combined with the older-is-stronger rule. I don't know if Mafia is going to be a recurring thing, but it'd be best if making it one didn't require an extra proposal.

[FallacyofUrist]

mafia isn't exactly a mini game...
If someone wins via Mafia, it's a full win.

Plus there's the other loophole in Mafia Master, which is that if you win a game of Mafia of any kind(not just in this game), you can take tokens from that.

[Elephant Parade]

mafia isn't exactly a mini game...
If someone wins via Mafia, it's a full win.

Plus there's the other loophole in Mafia Master, which is that if you win a game of Mafia of any kind(not just in this game), you can take tokens from that.

That's dumb.

Proposal 76a - Tokens, Expanded (Fixed Version): The following sources of tokens are added:

• Mafia Master: Winning a game of Nomic Mafia gives you 5 tokens.
• Professional Proposer: Whenever a proposal of yours passes, you gain 1 token. If two of your proposals fail in a row, you gain 1 token.

The following uses for tokens are added:

• Bonus Proposal - 3 tokens: Create an extra proposal this turn.
• Colour Change - 1 token: Your name will be coloured in the inter-turn status block. You must choose a colour.

Tokens gained from Mafia Master and Professional Proposer are added to a player's status within the inter-turn status block in which they are earned; if, somehow, they are earned within a turn, they are added to a player's status in the next inter-turn status block.

To purchase something using tokens, a player with at least enough tokens in their possession must state that they are doing so.

[crazyabe]

I Support Proposal 72a.

[Person]

Fyi Nomic is sort of its own self contained universe. Without the consent of all players, things that happen outside the game shouldn't effect things inside the game, and vice versa. Otherwise we'd have to call "Lord Uln 'Proposes Uselessness' the eighteenth" by their title outside this thread.

I haven't brought this up until now because I wasn't really sure if it would come up.  This isn't an explicit rule by any means, but it's kind of critical in the grand scheme of things. Feel free to correct that with a proposal if you like.

In any event, while this game takes place on the Bay12 forums and all the rules of said forums obviously continue to apply, we certainly can't enforce the rules we create in this thread anywhere else. What players do outside this thread has no effect on their participation, barring any actual breaking of the forum's rules. For example, did a rule saddle you with a dumb post restriction? You don't have to type that way outside the thread. Simple as that.

Anyway, onto more related matters, I still can't think of a good way to word how a proper inventory would work. I'll leave that to someone else I guess and do something ambitious and doomed to failure.

Proposal 77-Resources: After this proposal passes, every active player must declare the name of their Native Resource. Once they do so, they receive 1 unit of that resource. The name of a Native Resource must be unique to that Native Resource. At the start of every turn, a player gains one unit of their Native Resource, up to a maximum of 10. Any additional resources past this amount are discarded. A player can only declare the name of their Native Resource once. The native resources of other players can be owned, but are not produced on their own at the start of each turn. Players can exchange (henceforth referred to as trade) resources by making a valid trade offer to another player. If both players agree on the trade offer, the judge enacts the changes listed in the offer. A valid trade offer fulfills all of the following requirements.
1: Resources can only be traded or used in integer values.
2: You cannot trade less than 1 of a resource.
3: A valid trade offer can use the word "nothing" for either the receiving for the giving party, but not both. This means that no resources will be removed from that player.
Some examples are as follows. These examples use the native resources "wood" and "stone" for the purposes of demonstration only. These resources do not exist until a player declares that one of them is their native resource.
1: "I trade 1 of my wood for 1 of John's stone." The player is offering to give 1 of their wood for 1 stone owned by another player, John. If John accepts, 1 wood is removed from the offering player and given to John, and 1 stone is removed from John and given to the offering player.
2: "I trade 1 of my wood for nothing from John." The player is offering to give 1 wood to John, essentially. If they accept, 1 wood is removed from the offering player and given to John.
3: "I trade nothing for 1 stone from John." The player is asking John for 1 stone and giving nothing in return. A valid trade offer, but not one that many would accept without a good reason. If they do accept, 1 stone is removed from John and given to the offering player.

Wee, are we Civilization yet? This probably has loads of flaws so feel free to iron it out with variants. Also, I support proposals 75a and 76a.

[crazyabe]

I support proposal 77.

[TopHat]

Support Proposals 75a, 76a and 77. Oppose Proposal 74.
Oh, and Person, as far as I know you can no longer vote on other player's proposal with the removal of the Land Tax rule (cannot remember the number; perhaps we should have a Removed Rules spoiler in the OP?)

Proposal 78 - Minor Changes To The Judge
Remove Rule 36. Amend Rule 43 to include the following sentence: 'The player with the role of Judge may not join an alliance, and should leave any alliance they find themselves in at the earliest opportunity'.

[Person]

Hm. Looks like you're right about that TopHat. Well then, I'll just correct a few things. Also turn incoming soon.

[Person]

Proposal 74 - The Big Bang: If this proposal passes: All other proposals are rendered invalid; all rules not created by this proposal are unmade, then reset to the game's defaultm after which this proposal and all rules made by it become 'Deactivated'; and all proposals made before this point in time are 'Forgotten' by the Judge. This proposal can be 'reactivated' if 3/4 of the players support reactivating at any point in time, Re resetting the game. this proposal, and any rules directly pertaining to it, are valid in any circumstances; can't be changed by any proposal other then proposal 72, which will always be this proposal; and can not be removed.

Proposer: "Lord Uln 'Proposes Uselessness' the eighteenth"
Supporting: "Lord Uln 'Proposes Uselessness' the eighteenth"
Opposing: Elephant Parade, FallacyofUrist
Total: Fails 1 to 2

Proposal 75-Death Loves This One: Players that are Town or Mafia may freely place Lynch Votes on other Town or Mafia players, by stating the target player's name(or a close approximation, defined by the Judge) in red text. Each player may only place one Lynch Vote, but it may be moved freely. At the end of a turn with a number evenly divisible by four(the turn number divided by four equals an integer), the player with the most Lynch Votes on him/her is killed. In the event of a tie for the player with the most Lynch votes, no players are killed by this method.

At any time, if all the Mafia players state a desire to kill a Town player, to the Judge, via PM, and the turn number is evenly divisible by four, that player will be killed. This may only be done once per turn.

The Judge cannot be killed.

Whenever a player is killed, he/she is not removed from the game. Rather, he/she is no longer Town or Mafia, and may not become Town or Mafia again in any way. Then the Judge posts what his/her(referring to the killed player) alignment(Town or Mafia) was.

Proposer: FallacyofUrist
Supporting: FallacyofUrist
Opposing:
Total: Fails 1 to 0

Proposal 75a - Death Loves This One, Nitpicked: Players that are Town or Mafia may freely place Lynch Votes on other Town or Mafia players, by stating the target player's name(or a close approximation, defined by the Judge) in red text. Each player may only place one Lynch Vote, but it may be moved freely. At the end of a turn with a number evenly divisible by four(the turn number divided by four equals an integer), the player with the most Lynch Votes on him/her is killed. In the event of a tie for the player with the most Lynch votes, no players are killed by this method.

At any time, if all the Mafia players state a desire to kill a Town player, to the Judge, via PM, and the turn number is evenly divisible by four, that player will be killed. This may only be done once per turn.

The Judge cannot be killed.

Whenever a player is killed, he/she is not removed from the game. Rather, he/she is no longer Town or Mafia, and may not become Town or Mafia again in any way except the initiation of another Mafia game. Then the Judge posts what his/her(referring to the killed player) alignment(Town or Mafia) was.

Due to variant rules, FallacyofUrist counts as this proposal's proposer.
Supporting: Elephant Parade, FallacyofUrist, TopHat
Opposing:
Total: Passes 3 to 0

This is now a proper game of mafia. There isn't really a night or day phase, but all the most crucial factors are there, more or less.

Proposal 76 - Tokens, Expanded: The following sources of tokens are added:

• Mafia Master: Winning a game of Mafia gives you 5 tokens.
• Professional Proposer: Whenever a proposal of yours passes, you gain 1 token. If two of your proposals fail in a row, you gain 1 token.

The following uses for tokens are added:

• Bonus Proposal - 3 tokens: Create an extra proposal this turn.
• Colour Change - 1 token: Your name will be coloured in the inter-turn status block. You must choose a colour.

Tokens gained from Mafia Master and Professional Proposer are added to a player's status within the inter-turn status block in which they are earned; if, somehow, they are earned within a turn, they are added to a player's status in the next inter-turn status block.

To purchase something using tokens, a player with at least enough tokens in their possession must state that they are doing so.

Proposer: Elephant Parade
Supporting: Elephant Parade, TopHat
Opposing:
Total: Passes 2 to 0

Proposal 76a - Tokens, Expanded (Fixed Version): The following sources of tokens are added:

• Mafia Master: Winning a game of Nomic Mafia gives you 5 tokens.
• Professional Proposer: Whenever a proposal of yours passes, you gain 1 token. If two of your proposals fail in a row, you gain 1 token.

The following uses for tokens are added:

• Bonus Proposal - 3 tokens: Create an extra proposal this turn.
• Colour Change - 1 token: Your name will be coloured in the inter-turn status block. You must choose a colour.

Tokens gained from Mafia Master and Professional Proposer are added to a player's status within the inter-turn status block in which they are earned; if, somehow, they are earned within a turn, they are added to a player's status in the next inter-turn status block.

To purchase something using tokens, a player with at least enough tokens in their possession must state that they are doing so.

Due to variant rules, Elephant Parade counts as this proposal's proposer.
Supporting: Elephant Parade, TopHat
Opposing:
Total: Passes 2 to 0

Coin flip time... 76a passes, 76 doesn't.

Proposal 77-Resources: After this proposal passes, every active player must declare the name of their Native Resource. Once they do so, they receive 1 unit of that resource. The name of a Native Resource must be unique to that Native Resource. At the start of every turn, a player gains one unit of their Native Resource, up to a maximum of 10. Any additional resources past this amount are discarded. A player can only declare the name of their Native Resource once. The native resources of other players can be owned, but are not produced on their own at the start of each turn. Players can exchange (henceforth referred to as trade) resources by making a valid trade offer to another player. If both players agree on the trade offer, the judge enacts the changes listed in the offer. A valid trade offer fulfills all of the following requirements.
1: Resources can only be traded or used in integer values.
2: You cannot trade less than 1 of a resource.
3: A valid trade offer can use the word "nothing" for either the receiving for the giving party, but not both. This means that no resources will be removed from that player.
Some examples are as follows. These examples use the native resources "wood" and "stone" for the purposes of demonstration only. These resources do not exist until a player declares that one of them is their native resource.
1: "I trade 1 of my wood for 1 of John's stone." The player is offering to give 1 of their wood for 1 stone owned by another player, John. If John accepts, 1 wood is removed from the offering player and given to John, and 1 stone is removed from John and given to the offering player.
2: "I trade 1 of my wood for nothing from John." The player is offering to give 1 wood to John, essentially. If they accept, 1 wood is removed from the offering player and given to John.
3: "I trade nothing for 1 stone from John." The player is asking John for 1 stone and giving nothing in return. A valid trade offer, but not one that many would accept without a good reason. If they do accept, 1 stone is removed from John and given to the offering player.

Proposer: Person
Supporting: Person, "Lord Uln 'Proposes Uselessness' the eighteenth", TopHat, FallacyofUrist
Opposing:
Total: Passes 4 to 0

Everyone must now declare their natural resource. If they don't, they don't count as an active player until they do.

Proposal 78 - Minor Changes To The Judge: Remove Rule 36. Amend Rule 43 to include the following sentence: 'The player with the role of Judge may not join an alliance, and should leave any alliance they find themselves in at the earliest opportunity'.

Proposer: TopHat
Supporting: TopHat
Opposing:
Total: Fails 1 to 0

Thus begins turn 16.

Player Statuses:

Person: A player. The judge. Holds the title of Lord.  7 Holy Imperial Elector Votes. 1 token.
Iituem: A player.  0 Holy Imperial Elector Votes. 1 token.
Sensei: A player.  1 Holy Imperial Elector Vote. 1 token.
crazyabe: A player. Holds the title of "Lord Uln 'Proposes Uselessness' the eighteenth". 2 Holy Imperial Elector Votes. 1 token.
FallacyofUrist: A player. 4 Holy Imperial Elector Votes. 1 token.
TopHat: A player. 4 Holy Imperial Elector Votes. 1 token.
MonkeyMarkMario: A player. 3 Holy Imperial Elector Votes. 1 token.
Elephant Parade: A player. 5 Holy Imperial Elector Votes. 1 token.
NAV: A player. 0 Holy Imperial Elector Votes. 1 token.

Rules Lawyers Alliance:
 Person Does not Support alliance proposals by default
 FallacyofUrist Supports alliance proposals by default.
TopHat-Elephant Parade Alliance:
 TopHat Supports alliance proposals by default.
 Elephant Parade does not support alliance proposals by default.

[crazyabe]

My resource is Slaves.

[Person]

So, first things first, my native resource is Iron. I now receive 1 unit of Iron as a result of my naming my native proposal.

Yes, I probably picked something boring. Resources currently have no use, of course.

Now, this is a turn divisible by 4, so at the end of it, lynch votes will be properly counted, and the mafia can choose their kill target whenever they like. How this will affect any votes, I'll have to wing it I guess.

My resource is Slaves.

Well, that's a valid resource, I suppose. I'm not sure what I expected from Bay12, but something like this was probably inevitable.

[crazyabe]

PROPOSAL 79 -Uses for resources: at Any time, the judge may PM a list of structures that could be built with the currently avalible resources each player has To each player. these structures may: increase the max resources that can be held by a player; increase the amount of resources gained each round; increase the amount of structures that can be built each round; Or Decrease the amount of resources required. players may build a maximum of 2 structures each round to begin with.

I Support Proposal 79.

[Elephant Parade]

PROPOSAL 79 -Uses for resources: at Any time, the judge may PM a list of structures that could be built with the currently avalible resources each player has To each player. these structures may: increase the max resources that can be held by a player; increase the amount of resources gained each round; increase the amount of structures that can be built each round; Or Decrease the amount of resources required. players may build a maximum of 2 structures each round to begin with.

I Support Proposal 79.

Oppose 79 for being exponential. We literally just escaped money; do we really want to dive into this stuff again?

[crazyabe]

Consider: the Judge has FULL control over how much things cost; when things come out; What they do; and what is needed for them to be made...