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[Meph]

Wait, zombies are now friendly if you don't explicitly give them OPPOSED_TO_LIFE?  This is good news!  Obviously it needs to be fixed for this, but that opens up a whole bunch of new possibilities.

Ups, completely forgot to report this, but yeah... I found both blood men and wine men dropping their gear. They were local residents, while the necromancer himself was hostile.

It would also be nice to add lockpicking to them, or buildingdestroyer1, otherwise you can embark on a tower and simply lock the doors.

[IndigoFenix]

I updated for DF 43.02.

Pretas have been nerfed further, making them possess less frequently, removing their ability to occasionally kill a host when leaving them, and spacing out their berserking so that they have a smaller chance of actually starting a fight.  (Without going berserk for at least one moment they will not jump hosts.)

The *mancer minions should hold onto their equipment and be properly opposed to life now.  The liquid ones are still probably pushovers, but maybe with weapons and armor they might pose a slightly bigger challenge.

Also I added Pegasi.  (I wanted to call them pterippi, but nobody would know what that meant.  Pedantic...)

[pikachu17]

Regarding the pretas... Could there be a "burn magical incense" reaction that creates a magic boulder that gives dwarves the syn_class of preta interactions,so they can't be possessed, for a while?
wouldn't help a fortress that already has almost everybody is possessed, but it will be a preventative that makes some sense.

[Rumrusher]

Wait, zombies are now friendly if you don't explicitly give them OPPOSED_TO_LIFE?  This is good news!  Obviously it needs to be fixed for this, but that opens up a whole bunch of new possibilities.

Ups, completely forgot to report this, but yeah... I found both blood men and wine men dropping their gear. They were local residents, while the necromancer himself was hostile.

It would also be nice to add lockpicking to them, or buildingdestroyer1, otherwise you can embark on a tower and simply lock the doors.

or wall up the doors, or build fortifications or... wait won't this mess with player necromancers as those creatures would be knocking player camps stuff over constant destruction of the carpentry workshop?

[ungratefuldead]

Those pretas are still fortress-killers even after the updates (I think this is after the updates, started the fort the day before yesterday). They only berserked a couple dwarves but they turned 50/80 dwarves in my fort into vampires.

[IndigoFenix]

Those pretas are still fortress-killers even after the updates (I think this is after the updates, started the fort the day before yesterday). They only berserked a couple dwarves but they turned 50/80 dwarves in my fort into vampires.

What?  How many were actually bitten?  Also, are you sure they are actually vampires?  Due to the way the switch works it may cause some false positives when scanning with a third party tool (they technically have the bloodsucker tag, but it is removed by a seperate syndrome).

[ungratefuldead]

Hmm.. the 50 number was from DFHack, so could be some false positives, but dwarves were dropping like flies from exsanguination so there had to be at least a few running around at once. There were also dozens of pretas visible at any given time in the fortress.

[Meph]

I had other reports where the entire fortress was flagged as vampires.

[ungratefuldead]

EDIT: Wrong thread.

[Meph]

EDIT: Wrong thread.

Right thread.

Just had some Undead Water Men show up in a siege and drop all their gear (though they were still quite hostile, until some Giant Alligators shredded them). Not sure if that's a bug or if they simply lack the capacity to use equipment due to being liquids. Oddly their various animated parts (heads, feet, etc.) that were left behind were Friendly to me.

[IndigoFenix]

That's... really weird.  The elementalmen have the EQUIPS tag and the interaction adds OPPOSED_TO_LIFE, so what could cause that?

As for the pretas... I'll need to know more details.  Being flagged as vampires makes sense, but that's more a problem with DFhack's scanner; I suppose it checks whether the creatures have a BLOODSUCKER tag but not whether or not they have an anti-BLOODSUCKER effect active, since one doesn't exist in vanilla.  Due to the way pretas jump around, it stands to reason that they'd wind up flagging the whole fort, but you should only have one 'real' vampire per 'possession' event (and the game should warn you with a message when that happens).  So the question is, is there something wrong with the jumping interaction or are possessions still just too common?

If the problem is with the jumping, that's a significant bug that needs to be fixed.  If it's the latter problem, there are two solutions: either reduce the bite probability (again) or make them VERMIN_GROUNDER instead of VERMIN_ROTTER.  The latter will make possessions much, much less common, since they'll show up randomly scattered around instead of hanging around the food stockpile where dwarves tend to congregate.

[endlessblaze]

I'm playing masterwork with mancers on and none of the spells are present. world gen will make the minions, but the mancers will never do so in game play and reading the slab gives only the "secret learned" message, without giving a power.

[IndigoFenix]

I'm playing masterwork with mancers on and none of the spells are present. world gen will make the minions, but the mancers will never do so in game play and reading the slab gives only the "secret learned" message, without giving a power.

Are you an elf, vampire, or otherwise immortal creature?  The spells are restricted to mortals, same as vanilla necromancy.

[vjmdhzgr]

I'm playing masterwork with mancers on and none of the spells are present. world gen will make the minions, but the mancers will never do so in game play and reading the slab gives only the "secret learned" message, without giving a power.

Are you an elf, vampire, or otherwise immortal creature?  The spells are restricted to mortals, same as vanilla necromancy.

I'm pretty sure all those can become necromancers, they just never do in world generation. I know for sure that vampires can at least, as it's a common strategy for easily becoming a necromancer as the zombies will ignore you.

[IndigoFenix]

I'm playing masterwork with mancers on and none of the spells are present. world gen will make the minions, but the mancers will never do so in game play and reading the slab gives only the "secret learned" message, without giving a power.

Are you an elf, vampire, or otherwise immortal creature?  The spells are restricted to mortals, same as vanilla necromancy.

I'm pretty sure all those can become necromancers, they just never do in world generation. I know for sure that vampires can at least, as it's a common strategy for easily becoming a necromancer as the zombies will ignore you.

Oh.  So I suppose the example interaction in the raw/interaction_examples folder is not actually an accurate representation of the necromancy secret...?  I based them off of it, and it has the IT_REQUIRES:MORTAL tag.