Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Shazbot]

Do you play chess against yourself? That's what Dwarf Fortress has become. Single-player chess, all white pieces, no time limit.

[cochramd]

A while ago, the game used to play like the following:

*Poof* evil has appeared! Many evil nameless things! Fear the night because EVIL!

But now it has become:

Evil wakes up in the morning like everyone else, puts his pants on, and goes to work. Evil knows there's a much more exciting world out there to explore, but he's so bound by his daily comforts he very rarely has time to do the things he'd really enjoy...He's got kids to take care of, he's a married man now. Maybe he'll go ransacking a little village a couple times through the year, but he knows deep down he's a shadow of the former man he used to be.

That's a lot harder to program, but a lot more personable/dynamic. It's not fun, but hopefully within time Evil will get a little more free time in his busy schedule.
(And learn how to build siege equipment)

This. In a previous fort, my first 2 or 3 big sieges had goblins, beak dogs and trolls. The 2 or 3 after that only had goblins and beak dogs,  and after tht the sieges were smaller and only had goblins. Now, I'd observed that trolls and beakdogs took higher casualties than the goblins did, and were often wiped out entirely. I can only conclude that either I had destroyed their domestic populations completely or had reduced them so drastically that the goblins weren't going to risk losing the entire population by using them as warbeasts. Point is, now the enemy has resources of his own to manage as well, and sometimes that means he won't give you his all, or as much as he used to.

[mirrizin]

Do you play chess against yourself? That's what Dwarf Fortress has become. Single-player chess, all white pieces, no time limit.

Figured out how to build a lifelike dragon out a chessboard?

[Detros]

Nice story.

Do you play chess against yourself? That's what Dwarf Fortress has become. Single-player chess, all white pieces, no time limit.

Of course I do form time to time. But I often have hard time not to lose against myself.

And sure, one can play DF-like games on a chestboard:
You are a bishop. You go out in the wilderness where you find an enemy camp with three pawns. You manage to kill them all with your trusty longbow. You go back to your town, tell all knights in the castle about your deeds. They praise you and offer you a free drink. Then your pawns come with a new dance style they learned in the east rook and invite you for a round.

[Shazbot]

Do you play chess against yourself? That's what Dwarf Fortress has become. Single-player chess, all white pieces, no time limit.

Figured out how to build a lifelike dragon out a chessboard?

Yes, its called the Sicilian Dragon. The entertainment value is rather limited if nobody attacks it.

[mirrizin]

Nice story.

Do you play chess against yourself? That's what Dwarf Fortress has become. Single-player chess, all white pieces, no time limit.

Of course I do form time to time. But I often have hard time not to lose against myself.

And sure, one can play DF-like games on a chestboard:
You are a bishop. You go out in the wilderness where you find an enemy camp with three pawns. You manage to kill them all with your trusty longbow. You go back to your town, tell all knights in the castle about your deeds. They praise you and offer you a free drink. Then your pawns come with a new dance style they learned in the east rook and invite you for a round.

Well, yeah. I gave up on adventure mode pretty quickly. I hope it turns into something more playable.

[mirrizin]

Do you play chess against yourself? That's what Dwarf Fortress has become. Single-player chess, all white pieces, no time limit.

Figured out how to build a lifelike dragon out a chessboard?

Yes, its called the Sicilian Dragon. The entertainment value is rather limited if nobody attacks it.

I don't have enough imagination to make that a lifelike dragon.

[Stragus]

Do you play chess against yourself? That's what Dwarf Fortress has become. Single-player chess, all white pieces, no time limit.

Figured out how to build a lifelike dragon out a chessboard?

Yes, its called the Sicilian Dragon. The entertainment value is rather limited if nobody attacks it.

I don't have enough imagination to make that a lifelike dragon.

If you want a lifelike dragon, fire up Blender (3D modeling software). Or grab a box of Lego.

This. In a previous fort, my first 2 or 3 big sieges had goblins, beak dogs and trolls. The 2 or 3 after that only had goblins and beak dogs,  and after tht the sieges were smaller and only had goblins. Now, I'd observed that trolls and beakdogs took higher casualties than the goblins did, and were often wiped out entirely. I can only conclude that either I had destroyed their domestic populations completely or had reduced them so drastically that the goblins weren't going to risk losing the entire population by using them as warbeasts. Point is, now the enemy has resources of his own to manage as well, and sometimes that means he won't give you his all, or as much as he used to.

A good DM (Dungeon Master) should always have new challenges ready for his players. This new world simulation should never lead to :
"Congratulations on being so successful! The enemy is now too weak to present any threat forever. Grab the dice, roll a new character fortress, and start over."

And this can all be done while still acknowledging the player's success. Has the goblins threat really been eliminated? Fine, well done, congratulations. The immense wealth of your fortress has attracted the attention of greedy Dragons. Savage hordes pillaging the countryside arrive from another continent. Your earthly arrogance of building a tower that reaches the heavens has drawn the ire of deities. A creature from the underworld seeks your artifact X and is advancing with its armies. Extra-planar entities envious of your riches have opened a portal from their world. A tarrasque has awakened from its 8000 years slumber, for a new iteration of a cycle wiping out all civilizations.

I hope something is planned beyond that world simulation. It should never lead to getting the upper hand (perhaps totally independently from the player's own actions) and the fortress now being safe forever.

[cochramd]

A good DM (Dungeon Master) should always have new challenges ready for his players.

Dwarf Fortress isn't a game of D&D.

[Urlance Woolsbane]

A good DM (Dungeon Master) should always have new challenges ready for his players. This new world simulation should never lead to :
"Congratulations on being so successful! The enemy is now too weak to present any threat forever. Grab the dice, roll a new character fortress, and start over."

Yes and no. Yes, I agree that the player should be incapable of extinguishing all the challenges of a particular world (at least not by accident.)  No, Dwarf Fortress oughtn't to function like a Game Master. The program isn't interested in going out of its way to challenge you. Finding challenges tends to be necessary in Dwarf Fortress, but they aren't hard to find, in my experience. It is, foremost a simulator of worlds, not of adventures, not that the two can't intersect.

I should also note that Toady plans to add optional embark-scenarios, at some point in the not-so-distant future. Prison colonies, for example, will be a thing. I suspect that challenges will be even easier to find, once that happens.

Dwarf Fortress is, I think I might in saying, the 2001 of video games. It employs the same medium as something like Ultima or Dungeon Keeper, it shares a number of aspects, but it's ultimately a different, rather independent beast.

[Niddhoger]

This. In a previous fort, my first 2 or 3 big sieges had goblins, beak dogs and trolls. The 2 or 3 after that only had goblins and beak dogs,  and after tht the sieges were smaller and only had goblins. Now, I'd observed that trolls and beakdogs took higher casualties than the goblins did, and were often wiped out entirely. I can only conclude that either I had destroyed their domestic populations completely or had reduced them so drastically that the goblins weren't going to risk losing the entire population by using them as warbeasts. Point is, now the enemy has resources of his own to manage as well, and sometimes that means he won't give you his all, or as much as he used to.

A good DM (Dungeon Master) should always have new challenges ready for his players. This new world simulation should never lead to :
"Congratulations on being so successful! The enemy is now too weak to present any threat forever. Grab the dice, roll a new character fortress, and start over."

I hope something is planned beyond that world simulation. It should never lead to getting the upper hand (perhaps totally independently from the player's own actions) and the fortress now being safe forever.
[/quote]

Why not? As mentioned, DF is first and foremost a world simulator.  After establishing a successful fort and managing to "pacify" a region, you go to a new frontier and "settle" it.  Infinitely generating enemies out of thin air goes against the base nature of DF, why else are FBs tracked and Titans/megabeasts get lairs? Even werebeasts are individually tracked and come from nearby caves.  Personally, I feel like its a sense of accomplishment.  The goblins have broken themselves upon your bulwark, and are a pale shadow of what they once were.  Congratulations! It gives a sense of accomplishment. *shrugs*

If you really want "limitless" sieges, just go settle next to a dark fortress.  You can check with legends viewer to make sure the population is redonkulous, but they are almost always stocked with 10,000+ enemies in worlds with longer histories.  Their demons are often still alive too, and can take the field leading armies.  Human towns often have nearly the same populations, so if you find their first one you can settle nearby and provoke them (once the human caravan is bugged, or use an older version).

[FrisianDude]

The problem with a game like Dwarf Fortress is that it can be hard to distinguish bugs from features. Why should the Goblins care about your little, out-of-the-way outpost, when there are far more opulent, closer fortresses to sack?

proving grounds?

[Detros]

The problem with a game like Dwarf Fortress is that it can be hard to distinguish bugs from features. Why should the Goblins care about your little, out-of-the-way outpost, when there are far more opulent, closer fortresses to sack?

proving grounds?

So that's why they don't send any weaponmasters recenty.

[FrisianDude]

Maybe it's their way of 'hammering' or 'pitting'. They just send the eedjits to die at Dwarven hands.

[GrayFox]

I don't know what you're talking about. I'm always dealing with huge sieges that slow framerate... 100+ enemies. I might have to lower that for less lag.  Try playing in evil locations if you need a challenge. I haven't had very good luck with that, though I have only tried it a few times.

More challenges would be nice, but I really hope things don't become too hard to please those that only play the most extremely difficult games...
I don't think I'd be very happy if enemies start smashing down walls and digging new entrances. Maybe it might be an interesting optional setting or mod though? (I guess I'd give it a try, at least) Really don't need entire armies of fire-breathing creatures either. I lost 90 citizens to one fire breather recently... though the FPS gain from that was kinda nice (except for the slowdown when everything was burning to death).