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[Kot]

Heavy, innacurate (thanks to being heavy), useless from any range besides direct application to forehead (thanks to being innacurate), frequent chainfires (thanks to being cheap as fuck) turning it into wrist-breaking volley gun, stuff. Also because I'm sceptic about going all-out scrooge (with pepperboxes being literally poor-man revolvers) on guns we give to our soldiers.

[tryrar]

I'm with Kot on this. I'd rather go with revolvers(which are ultimately safer) than go for cheap things that might get our soldiers killed.

[Aseaheru]

Heavy

Not always. Depends mostly on the individual gun. Revolvers where sometimes 9lb.

inaccurate (thanks to being heavy)

This is true, but pistol range aswell as, well, look at muskets. Horrible accuracy there too.

useless from any range besides direct application to forehead (thanks to being inaccurate)

Again, muskets, aswell as it being a pistol. They have short range.

frequent chainfires (thanks to being cheap as fuck)

They often had less chainfires, due to the fact that they arent enclosed into a small space (like typical revolvers). Also, designing ways to get around that problem is rather simple. Like including a shield.

less weight turning it into wrist-breaking volley gun

Aha! He admits weight is less, which makes his comments about inaccuracy and lack of range due to weight reflect poorly on revolvers!

Also because I'm sceptic about going all-out scrooge (with pepperboxes being literally poor-man revolvers) on guns we give to our soldiers.

So yer one of the people who would rather give 100 people 10 fantastic guns instead of each getting a good gun? Good to know.

revolvers(which are ultimately safer)

*pointed look* Explain again, please.

[10ebbor10]

Remember, complexity isn't bad. It automatically gets cheaper after a while.

Anyway, we're not working on a revolver or a pepperbox, so we should get back to business.

[tryrar]

Heavy

Not always. Depends mostly on the individual gun. Revolvers where sometimes 9lb.

inaccurate (thanks to being heavy)

This is true, but pistol range aswell as, well, look at muskets. Horrible accuracy there too.

useless from any range besides direct application to forehead (thanks to being inaccurate)

Again, muskets, aswell as it being a pistol. They have short range.

frequent chainfires (thanks to being cheap as fuck)

They often had less chainfires, due to the fact that they arent enclosed into a small space (like typical revolvers). Also, designing ways to get around that problem is rather simple. Like including a shield.

less weight turning it into wrist-breaking volley gun

Aha! He admits weight is less, which makes his comments about inaccuracy and lack of range due to weight reflect poorly on revolvers!

Also because I'm sceptic about going all-out scrooge (with pepperboxes being literally poor-man revolvers) on guns we give to our soldiers.

So yer one of the people who would rather give 100 people 10 fantastic guns instead of each getting a good gun? Good to know.

revolvers(which are ultimately safer)

*pointed look* Explain again, please.

Ok, reading the wiki on pepperboxes makes my statement look idiotic(a pepperbgox is actually safer in the event of a chainfire, since dedicated barrels would mean it simply turns into an impromptu volley gun), but the major flaws that make it impractical for military use are:

It is innacurate past point blank range(might as well swing a saber or bayonet at that point). Compounding this is no usable sights due to the weight that would add to the barrels, as well as being unrifled

Speaking of weight, having multiple barrels makes this thing rather heavy and unwieldy to use compare to a normal pistol-especially when you go with longer barrles and/or higher barrel counts(which compounds aiming problems)

It takes FOREVER to reload all the barrels-granted, reloading the cylinders of a revolver isn't much better, but it's probably easier swapping cylinders than swapping entire barrel groups

So yeah, pepperboxes can be cheaper, but I'd rather we work out the kinks on revolvers

Ninja Edit:Well, that's my 2 bits on that, so yeah as 10ebbor said we're going for a long rifle this turn. Hey, let's do the Long Range Rifle with the slight addition of getting percussion caps!

[tryrar]

DP to post my idea on the rifle:

Spoiler: Imperial Rifle Mk.1 take 2 (click to show/hide)

The Imperial Rifle Mk.1 consists of a 760mm, 16mm-calibre rifled barrel in which seven grooves are cut. Contrary to the Baker Rifle, and expanding on ammo observed to be used in the Samara rifle, it uses a cast soft-lead bullet which will expand on being fired, grip the grooves and clean them of blackpowder residue. This takes away with the necessity of wrapping the ammo in cloth, therefore increasing the reload speed to that of a contemporary musket. Powder is issued - as usual - in paper cartridges to be ripped open and poured into the rifle; riflemen are additionally issued a powder horn for more accurate shots.
In the end, the rifle will be able to accurately hit a man-sized target with 90% of its shots at 300m, and marksmen will be to fire accurately up to 500m. Ity also uses copper percussion caps to prime and fire the rifle rather than previous flintlock systems

Why yes, I copied the long rifle wholesale and simply added percussion caps

[Kot]

Heavy

Not always. Depends mostly on the individual gun. Revolvers where sometimes 9lb.

A pepperbox with any meaningful caliber is going to be a) heavy as hell since multiple long barrels, which also makes them innacurate b) innacurate as hell because short barrels, c) both, because shitty production leads to solid pieces of metal.

inaccurate (thanks to being heavy)

This is true, but pistol range aswell as, well, look at muskets. Horrible accuracy there too.

useless from any range besides direct application to forehead (thanks to being inaccurate)

Again, muskets, aswell as it being a pistol. They have short range.

Except pepperbox innacurate is not "will not hit a plate from 10 meters", it's "will hit everything but the plate from 5 meters, including the shooter".

frequent chainfires (thanks to being cheap as fuck)

They often had less chainfires, due to the fact that they arent enclosed into a small space (like typical revolvers). Also, designing ways to get around that problem is rather simple. Like including a shield.

Multi-shot percussion firearms were often considered dangerous because firing one powder charge could ignite the others (a "chainfire"), all at the same time, when proper care was not taken. This problem was largely eliminated by the introduction of nipple partitions, evident on later percussion revolvers, which largely shielded the percussion caps on neighbouring chambers from the flash struck by the weapon's hammer during firing. However this feature is rarely seen on pepperboxes

less weight turning it into wrist-breaking volley gun

Aha! He admits weight is less, which makes his comments about inaccuracy and lack of range due to weight reflect poorly on revolvers!

I what. I never said anything about weight. The problem is the simultaneous explosion of multiple charges, which turns any pepperbox into a fucking volley gun which is comparable in recoil with a fucking hand cannon. Add that they're usually unwieldy due to being cheap, and there you go, broken wrists everywhere.

Also because I'm sceptic about going all-out scrooge (with pepperboxes being literally poor-man revolvers) on guns we give to our soldiers.

So yer one of the people who would rather give 100 people 10 fantastic guns instead of each getting a good gun? Good to know.

As far as I'm concerned, 10 trained officers with fantastic guns is much better than 100 idiots which will kill each other with their horrible weapons worth of suicide bomber.
Also that's just how British Empire rolls.

Ok, reading the wiki on pepperboxes makes my statement look idiotic(a pepperbgox is actually safer in the event of a chainfire, since dedicated barrels would mean it simply turns into an impromptu volley gun), but the major flaws that make it impractical for military use are:

Except no. Pepperbox may be kind of safer compared to early, shitty and cheap revolvers without some way of preventing chainfires, but they're also much more suspectible to it. I know the idea of unloading six or so shoots into one guy in fraction of a second is somewhat cool, but considering that you're left without weapon and broken wrist afterward...

[tryrar]

Nice points, all of them, now let's just drop the subject and focus on which rifle we're doing this turn

[3_14159]

DP to post my idea on the rifle:

Spoiler: Imperial Rifle Mk.1 take 2 (click to show/hide)

The Imperial Rifle Mk.1 consists of a 760mm, 16mm-calibre rifled barrel in which seven grooves are cut. Contrary to the Baker Rifle, and expanding on ammo observed to be used in the Samara rifle, it uses a cast soft-lead bullet which will expand on being fired, grip the grooves and clean them of blackpowder residue. This takes away with the necessity of wrapping the ammo in cloth, therefore increasing the reload speed to that of a contemporary musket. Powder is issued - as usual - in paper cartridges to be ripped open and poured into the rifle; riflemen are additionally issued a powder horn for more accurate shots.
In the end, the rifle will be able to accurately hit a man-sized target with 90% of its shots at 300m, and marksmen will be to fire accurately up to 500m. Ity also uses copper percussion caps to prime and fire the rifle rather than previous flintlock systems

Why yes, I copied the long rifle wholesale and simply added percussion caps

I like it. If the percussion cap design is successful, we can use it directly. If not, we can just use the revision to revise it.
That being said, let me add a bayonet mount to it...

Spoiler: Imperial Rifle Mk.1 take 2 (click to show/hide)

The Imperial Rifle Mk.1 consists of a 760mm, 16mm-calibre rifled barrel in which seven grooves are cut. Contrary to the Baker Rifle, and expanding on ammo observed to be used in the Samara rifle, it uses a cast soft-lead bullet which will expand on being fired, grip the grooves and clean them of blackpowder residue. This takes away with the necessity of wrapping the ammo in cloth, therefore increasing the reload speed to that of a contemporary musket. Powder is issued - as usual - in paper cartridges to be ripped open and poured into the rifle; riflemen are additionally issued a powder horn for more accurate shots.
In the end, the rifle will be able to accurately hit a man-sized target with 90% of its shots at 300m, and marksmen will be to fire accurately up to 500m. Ity also uses copper percussion caps to prime and fire the rifle rather than previous flintlock systems.
It also sports a mount for the same type of socket bayonets as on the Brown Bess.

[tryrar]

DP to post my idea on the rifle:

Spoiler: Imperial Rifle Mk.1 take 2 (click to show/hide)

The Imperial Rifle Mk.1 consists of a 760mm, 16mm-calibre rifled barrel in which seven grooves are cut. Contrary to the Baker Rifle, and expanding on ammo observed to be used in the Samara rifle, it uses a cast soft-lead bullet which will expand on being fired, grip the grooves and clean them of blackpowder residue. This takes away with the necessity of wrapping the ammo in cloth, therefore increasing the reload speed to that of a contemporary musket. Powder is issued - as usual - in paper cartridges to be ripped open and poured into the rifle; riflemen are additionally issued a powder horn for more accurate shots.
In the end, the rifle will be able to accurately hit a man-sized target with 90% of its shots at 300m, and marksmen will be to fire accurately up to 500m. Ity also uses copper percussion caps to prime and fire the rifle rather than previous flintlock systems

Why yes, I copied the long rifle wholesale and simply added percussion caps

I like it. If the percussion cap design is successful, we can use it directly. If not, we can just use the revision to revise it.
That being said, let me add a bayonet mount to it...

Spoiler: Imperial Rifle Mk.1 take 2 (click to show/hide)

The Imperial Rifle Mk.1 consists of a 760mm, 16mm-calibre rifled barrel in which seven grooves are cut. Contrary to the Baker Rifle, and expanding on ammo observed to be used in the Samara rifle, it uses a cast soft-lead bullet which will expand on being fired, grip the grooves and clean them of blackpowder residue. This takes away with the necessity of wrapping the ammo in cloth, therefore increasing the reload speed to that of a contemporary musket. Powder is issued - as usual - in paper cartridges to be ripped open and poured into the rifle; riflemen are additionally issued a powder horn for more accurate shots.
In the end, the rifle will be able to accurately hit a man-sized target with 90% of its shots at 300m, and marksmen will be to fire accurately up to 500m. Ity also uses copper percussion caps to prime and fire the rifle rather than previous flintlock systems.
It also sports a mount for the same type of socket bayonets as on the Brown Bess.

+1 for the mod

[10ebbor10]

Ok, good for me.

+1

[fillipk]

Sure, that'll work, why aren't we designing a better pistol again?  We could use our revision on the rifle and our sailors would be better armed.

[tryrar]

Sure, that'll work, why aren't we designing a better pistol again?  We could use our revision on the rifle and our sailors would be better armed.

because the rifle is something we can all agree on since we need to do something land related this turn . The pistol, as you saw from the full page discussion, isn't

[Aseaheru]

So why are we killing ourselves with our rate of fire?

[tryrar]

So why are we killing ourselves with our rate of fire?

Oh for fucks sake I was planning on the revision(if things go well) being a lindner breechloading system. Baby stewp Asa, baby steps.