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Author Topic: varius ideas  (Read 14260 times)

Zonk

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varius ideas
« on: October 28, 2001, 10:55:00 am »

here are some ideas...

allow "general"targeting preferences,not only the ones on specific entities

correct some bug,like the fact that you can bite yourself in the ear,for example

what about graphic options to make the game faster?

in the complete version,should the travel mode be removed?i mean..it's irrealistic that you can travel this way,ignoring dangers like entities,traps,ecc.ec..

what allowing damaging of the body parts that you use to attack?if i attack a knight in plate armor with a punch,il probably break my hand!

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Demon

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Re: varius ideas
« Reply #1 on: October 28, 2001, 02:55:00 pm »

I think you mentioned a wrestling interface before..?  Combat without weapons almost always goes to who can grappel better, but in most games people just stand neatly next to each other and punch.  So, where does good unarmed combat stand?

Also you should put in attacks that you just get a chance to do, ie 2 people are fighting with swords then one gets in a second to punch the other, or kick him.  It might not really hurt him, but throwing him off balance could make all the difference you need...

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Toady One

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Re: varius ideas
« Reply #2 on: October 28, 2001, 06:45:00 pm »

General targeting preferences are a must, although they get slightly tricky because the creature bodies are random.  Not that bad though.

I didn't even know you could attack yourself.  I guess I'll have to limit the bodyparts you can target with your mouth.  He he he.

Setting up some graphics options would help me speed it up in the long run (so people can tell me what is making it slow).  Zonk, how fast/slow is it now that it works on your computer?  Is it very playable?  Speed of your computer?  Video card?

Travel mode will not be completely removed.  Although you can avoid some things with it, the game would be totally unplayable if you had to walk manually everywhere.  There will have to be a balance.  The current World Travel screen will definitely be removed.  That covers too much distance.  You won't be able to pass over some entities, and there will be entity-based semi-random encounters near entities, so they can't be bypassed.

The damage routine right now is very reversible.  It compares the material types and causes damage to the target, but will also cause damage to the attacking item or bodypart.  That way, if you are fighting some fantastic creature with steel bones, you'll be able to hack through muscle tissue, but just clang off the bones (possibly chipping your sword).  If your sword blade is made out of some fantastic material, you might cut through the steel like air of course.  This will also make metal automatons (like a DND iron golem, say) very different opponents.  That AI will be fun to write -- maybe they'll just try to corner you and grind you into a wall with their bodies.  He he he.

Demon, well, there's no wrestling interface yet, but that's actually coming (fairly) soon -- if I don't put it in, I doubt my Jujitsu instructors would forgive me.  He he he.  Aside from Jujitsu club, I have some books (and have watched a few UFCs  :)), so I might do some justice to it.  Stand up fighting is still very useful -- especially if you are in a group against one talented wrestler.  He he he.  Anyway, yeah, unarmed combat isn't going to be blown off.

Attacks of opportunity are definitely more realistic than simply exchanging blows.  As the game gets more complicated, we'll see where the combat interface shifts to.  I don't want people just clicking at each other wildly as they might be doing now  :)

[ October 28, 2001: Message edited by: Toady One ]

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Zonk

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Re: varius ideas
« Reply #3 on: November 01, 2001, 04:25:00 am »

my portable PC is very fast...a bit more than my fixed PC wich was broken because of the monitor that will arrive this week...well the game is fast enough..i think is about 7.something frames per second..also another bug..how is it that im an ice dragon and an human can kill me with ONE blow(not a blow that makes me bleeding..just he hits me and i die)
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Toady One

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Re: varius ideas
« Reply #4 on: November 01, 2001, 11:12:00 am »

At least it is playable, although sometime I'll probably be able to get more than 7 out of it...  I get about 100 here.  And optimizations that don't do anything on my computer might make great improvements on other computers.  Oh well.  We'll figure that out eventually.  While the game is so unformed it isn't quite as important.

That's not a bug.  That's just a result of the game not being done -- NOBODY HAS SKULLS YET!  What most likely happened (we'll know more when I put the combat text back in) is that the human had a weapon (they all start with weapons) and he or she hit you in the head and got through the skin to the brain.  That's all it takes.  It would be like hitting a beanbag chair with a sword right now.  Creatures don't have digestive tracks either, or ribs.  They just have the basics for the bodily functions that are programmed (heart, lungs, spine, brain, liver, diaphragm, muscles, skin, basic bones).  The skull isn't a basic bone because it encompasses the brain, which is slightly more complicated.  It's already programmed, I just need to put in the line that adds skulls to creatures.  He he he.  Until then, everybody is vulnerable!

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Zonk

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Re: varius ideas
« Reply #5 on: November 03, 2001, 06:27:00 am »

i tried slaves of armok on my fixed pc..the speed is a a bit more than a 1/10 of the speed on the portable PC...but MY fixed pc isn't working to weel...also..another error..every time an ice dragon attacks me(or i attack him)i get exhausted

other problemsa are...

when handling corpses(not part of corpses...corpses)the game crashes

also when handling new weapons/changing the options for automatic attack the game crashes...

the max score i reachead was 127..i killed a WHOLE REGION of rats..i got killed by 2 gnomes..

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Toady One

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Re: varius ideas
« Reply #6 on: November 03, 2001, 11:18:00 am »

Right now, when you get hit by something, it decreases your stamina and makes you more exhausted.  It might be a little unbalanced with Ice Dragons -- because they are very large, their attacks are powerful, and they drain a lot of stamina with each shot.

A whole REGION of rats?  Do you mean one town?  Or did you kill all ~300 cities in an empire?  If you did that I imagine your score would be a lot higher (I think the population of each empire is roughly 30000 right now).

I'm not surprised the game is crashing in menu interfaces.  They just haven't been updated yet.  I've written down those specific bugs and I'll do my best to eliminate them when I get to the menu interface in a few days.

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Zonk

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Re: varius ideas
« Reply #7 on: November 04, 2001, 08:20:00 am »

some ideas:

unprecision,for example the player should not be able to know the precise weight of an item(like a sword that weights that 3281 grams :-).You should be able to see somethinfg like "HEAVY"or "LIGHT"depending on your strenght

also,the stats would be easier to be from 1 to 1000(or 1 to 100 counting decimals),since average stats of 150 don't look very average

Allow to ignore some things with some options(for example a player with,let's say...lices)could choose to ignore the text that appears at random saying he has lices,for example..

add falling damage reduction if falling on soft items(or creatures)and increase if falling on items like sword(useful to "Impale creatures"by pushing them off a cliff")

add something like an "artificial intelligence"to use when the player is charmed or very angry(easy for a beserk..just make the player attack everything)

Add height in addiction to weight in the status screen?


another thing..im trying to make a lot of italian people like Slaves to Armok..this way,when it will be finished,we will translate it!

also in the status,what do the numbers in "( )"mean?like im an ogre with a weight of 330000(199999)

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Demon

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Re: varius ideas
« Reply #8 on: November 04, 2001, 02:45:00 pm »

I think an improvement needed for the next release is defiantely a tiny bit of A.I.  Its so goofy to see 30 dragons lined up and helpless to hurt me cause I chopped off the leg of the one closest to me...  Just make them flow around each other a little, huh?

With sullying items...  Could I sully a weapon with a magical substance to make my weapon cut like some super material a few times??  Does it work like that?  I mean if I have a copper sword and I dip it in ever-liquid mithril or somthing does it gain the properties of that until it wipes off?  And if it does is it more efective to clean your sword when you get blood on it to prevent it from being weak?  Or will sullying only work with poison and such?  You should make sure creatures with poison blood use it...  (lick their swords or something, imagine the possibilities!)

So, on a limb for example theres: skin, muscle, and bone??  each has a different weight, mass, and hardness? In the body you have some organs to add to the mix but its more-or-less the same?  anything I'm missing here?

[ November 04, 2001: Message edited by: Demon ]

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Toady One

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Re: varius ideas
« Reply #9 on: November 06, 2001, 12:09:00 am »

Yeah, I should apologize for leaving some of those numbers in there.  They are for debugging more than anything.  The 199999 is just a volume measure for error testing (it won't be there later).  Creature descriptions are... let me see...  about 15 items away on the list of things to do.  Height and so on will be done then (along with hair!)

150 is kind of a trashy stat number isn't it?  I'll fix that.

I guess there should be all sorts of inventory effects when you fall over.  If you are carrying a vial of acid for instance, and you don't have it wrapped in some kind of packing, there might be some problems shortly after impact...  that goes for weapon strikes too.

He he he, yes, the AI is tribal.  It needs to be elevated, no doubt.  I wasn't going to do anything about it until the creatures had more to think about, but since that won't be so bad, I'll be sure to fix it before the next release.

Yeah -- item sullying is VERY versatile.  Each item has a list of things dirtying it (including their places and amounts).  You will be able to do all sorts of things.  The first one I'll add will probably be the ability to wipe things off, because it gets nasty.  Very nasty.  But yes, the sky is the limit with sullying.  Whatever I have time to sit down and put in is supportable by the current system (that is, there isn't just some silly "I'm a Poisoned Weapon" flag -- the item would actually have to have a certain amount of a poisonous substance on it to be poisonous).

Okay.  The bodies aren't completely done (missing some organs), but it basically works like this:

Limb: Skin, Muscle, Bone -- skin tissue includes hair (a "growth" on the "tissue")

Head: Skin, Muscle.  An "Extra Bodypart" starting at, say, Depth 3/15 in the Head called the Brain, and another "Extra Bodypart" at a similar Depth called the Skull.  There is a Relationship called "encase", with the skull holding the brain, so that any attack hitting the brain must penetrate the skull first, etc.

Upper Body: Skin, Muscle.  Some organs ("Extra Bodyparts") at various Depths, and Ribs which have the "encase" relationship with the lungs and heart, etc., but the "encase" relationship in this case is assigned a percentage, so that it can be bypassed in some cases (eg a knife between the ribs).

And so on.  It gets pretty messy, but in the end it should be very satisfying when I get it all polished.

The Mammal motif contains some general parameters for organs (such as size ranges for the brain and limbs), and each species is actualized within these.  For instance, half of the mammals right now have meaningful necks, and half of them don't.

Concerning materials, each of the tissues (skin, muscle, bone, heart tissue, brain tissue, blood, etc.) has a Material Specification associated with it.  This includes density, hardness, how much of an edge you can put on it, boiling point, melting point, etc.  For example, the Mammal motif holds general boiling point ranges for mammalian blood, and each species has a boiling point for its blood within that range.  When I put fire balls in, this will be more dramatic...  if the temperature gets above the melting points of the brain tissue on your sword, it might flow down onto your hand and burn you.  I'm still thinking about things like Flash Points for materials, because I don't think bone melts -- it probably just scorches and crumbles.

Sure, there are a lot of complications, but the perks just can't be passed up.  It isn't really that bad though.

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Harlander

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Re: varius ideas
« Reply #10 on: November 13, 2001, 02:56:00 am »

Here's a brief question: do you plan to restore the option to examine things in the game? (I can't remember the key for it in the old, 2D version but you could move a cursor and select an object for a basic description)

It'd be useful to see the wounds a creature is suffering from, and what it's carrying, and suchlike.

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Alanor

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Re: varius ideas
« Reply #11 on: November 13, 2001, 09:09:00 pm »

Harlander..
I am sure that goes under "creature discriptions"
thats in the short plan i believe
lots of verbosity got taken out for the new graphics version...
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Alanor
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Zonk

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Re: varius ideas
« Reply #12 on: November 18, 2001, 10:38:00 am »

i formatted my fixed PC to have a decent connection..well slaves of armok is even slower...i think i will fix this with time,or play it on the portable..i don't know
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Toady One

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Re: varius ideas
« Reply #13 on: November 18, 2001, 01:58:00 pm »

Uck...  I have a few more ideas on that.  Hopefully I can get that cleaned up.

Sorry, things have been a little bit slow lately.  That is the nature of student life unfortunately.  I'll try to have some more news by next weekend.

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Demon

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Re: varius ideas
« Reply #14 on: November 26, 2001, 07:18:00 pm »

So, what kinda super new, super kewl features can we expect soon?  Do you thrive on making us wait for the occasional tidbit of info??  Well, I guess if youre too busy programming to tell us about I can forgive you!    :p
    Alex
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