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[Descan]

where are you getting your numbers for refugees in europe/germany

the most i've seen is 1.2 million for all of europe, and 442K for germany in 2015

"millions"

[Egan_BW]

like at least one and a fifth millions

[Loud Whispers]

where are you getting your numbers for refugees in europe/germany

the most i've seen is 1.2 million for all of europe, and 442K for germany in 2015

"millions"

Spoiler: JUST CITE MY SHIT UP (click to show/hide)

People have very short memories, but these conversations repeat again and again(...) Merkel no longer has support for mass immigration. 2013, Merkel stresses that Germany must accept more refugees whilst her parliamentary bloc moves to classify the Balkans as safe, allowing for easier rejection of asylum seekers from Serbia, Macedonia, Albania e.t.c.. At that point Germany was taking in 200,000 refugees a year. They were warned that opening the door wider and leaving more incentives for people to make the journey to Germany would do the obvious; make more people make the journey to Germany.
By 2014:

Earlier in 2014 amongst first time asylum seekers the proportion of Syrians was around 10-15%, not accounting for second time asylum seekers, fake Syrians, those coming by sea nor immigrants who authorities fail to log. Eurostat has 700,000 asylum seekers in total logged across the EU despite countries like Germany alone taking in 750,000 illegal immigrants yearly, set to rise to 800,000 - conservative estimates. Measuring by asylum applications only takes into account those who bother to apply for asylum and takes their word for it.

That number had risen to 800,000 a year by conservative estimates, for Germany alone - excluding all other EU countries.
And unsurprisingly we are still talking about German and Swedish police covering up enriching crime, though it seems now they have shouldered all the blame leaving others just as responsible curiously clean.
By 2015 Merkel inquires whether Germany is losing that which makes Germany so strong," namely "the societal center." She is constantly asking herself, Merkel related, "if we are losing the center. By then the rate of immigration had its estimate increased from 800,000 to 1,500,000, measured only by those who claimed asylum - excluding those who did not register. That number also does not include those logged as immigrants, legal or illegal. The number for Europe as a whole is set to increase to 3,000,000 in 2016, though I wonder how many times that number will be revised and how many will go to Germany.

You've taken your number for Germany from the formal asylum applications that year, which is just under 480,000. The number registered was under 1.5 million, for that year, for Germany alone. Current estimates for Germany in 2016 range from the optimistic (a fall to 900,000 a year) to the probable (a rise to 3 million a year) to the pessimistic (10 million beyond 2016, given by Gerd Muller, German minister of economic development).

*EDIT
Removed a quote causing me confusion

[TheDarkStar]

like at least one and a fifth millions

this post was typed by at least 0.000001 million people

[Loud Whispers]

Checking my numbers more using statistics from 2016 sources and not sources that were from the time as it happened:
At least 850,000 people are expected to cross the Mediterranean seeking refuge in Europe this year and next, the United Nations said on Tuesday, giving estimates that already look conservative.
"In 2015, UNHCR anticipates that approximately 400,000 new arrivals will seek international protection in Europe via the Mediterranean. In 2016 this number could reach 450,000 or more," it said in an appeal document.
Spokesman William Spindler said the prediction for this year was close to being fulfilled, with 366,000 having already made the voyage. The total will depend on whether migrants stop attempting the journey as the weather gets colder and the seas more dangerous.
So far, the numbers do not appear to have slowed down, with many appearing spurred on by Germany's announcement that it will ease the rules for Syrians seeking refuge who first reach the European Union through other countries.

It annoys me immensely that the North Americans with so much power are led by people whose news station deliberately ignore inconvenient statistics or try to pass off official asylum logging reports as the sum total or try to pass off a singular Meditteranean route as the entirety of the trafficking. It's disingenuous and I'd expect more of them. Do note that the weather souring and winter arriving did not slow down the rate of immigration to Europe, as Germany's prized toleran and progresiv is more alluring than the bite of cold, with an average of 1,115 arriving daily in Greece in January. February's stats will be interesting.

Australia's policy:
-Ended human trafficking to Australia in two years
Germany's policy:
-Increased to a rate of millions per year in that same timespan

This is common sense, if we had to sacrifice Germany just to prove it so be it

[Wolfhunter107]

Note that the group of refugees about to be deported are mostly babies and children born in Australia (and their immigrant parents). The court ruled that it's okay to deport babies and children, against a child's mother who filed a lawsuit.

No, they are not mostly babies or children.

He said as much in his post.

Yet Australia shows them this compassion,

The Australians are not showing any kindness. They are shoving them into what are basically modern-day concentration camps. Stop lying.

The Anglican Church is currently mired in 5th columnists who unironically call for the de-Christianization of the Anglosphere, just as the Irish Catholic Church tried convincing the Irish that they weren't dismantling their beliefs.

This is, quite literally, some /pol/ tier bullshit.

Trying to play PR with a media that has already taken its side is pointless, least of all on unholy ground. Those that play on puppet strings will find they will only ever become just that - a puppet. I also do not see who loses face in a successful bipartisan policy, as cowering to appease problematic progressives with no power could be no greater humiliation to all of Australia.

Why, I don't see any way that violating holy sanctuary in order to drag out innocent people and force them into concentration camps could have any negative effects at all.

Oh.

Wait.

[Loud Whispers]

He said as much in his post.

Said as, not as said. Most is not most.

The Australians are not showing any kindness. They are shoving them into what are basically modern-day concentration camps. Stop lying.

Yeah it's basically Auschwitz, those dastardly Australians taking them off their ramshackle boats in order to gas them with their zyklon B, they should be more like the southeast Asians and just send the boats back to the ocean. I'm sorry for lying, I didn't realize the Australians were literally quite Hitler.

This is, quite literally, some /pol/ tier bullshit.

Literally used to mean something you know. Same with quite.

Why, I don't see any way that violating holy sanctuary in order to drag out innocent people and force them into concentration camps could have any negative effects at all.
Oh.
Wait.

Holy Sanctuary was abolished four centuries ago and as practiced would ensue with those refugees having to surrender themselves to secular authorities after 40 days or be executed. If we were to believe these apparent Anglicans knew anything about Anglicanism (why the bloody hell are they clinging to a practice outdated by Papal standards ffs) then they were deliberately acting in contravention with the faith - such a thing is called sinning.
Likewise we've already gone over Australians literally being Hitler by not encouraging illegal immigration by repatriating illegal immigrants, who are guilty of illegally immigrating.

But of course! We should give religion primacy over secular law, I fully agree. There will be no negative consequences then, I'm sure.

[Reudh]

Speaking as an Australian, it's not up to us to police the Nauruans and the Papua New Guineans on treatment of asylum seekers. If we are keeping them in our own territory, then yes, I'd expect us to be responsible. But another country's another country.

[Descan]

That falls apart if a) the detention centers are run by Australia, which I don't know if they are but I was under the impression that they were.

More importantly, b) Australia sends them to PNG and Nauru. Australia is obliged to make sure the places Oz is sending people are not treating them poorly. If they know that the people they send will be treated poorly, and then continue to send asylum seekers, then Australia is just as responsible and should be held accountable.

[wobbly]

Considering they're financed & administered by Australian goverment departments blaming standards on another country is pretty weak.

[Wolfhunter107]

Yesterday, the Australian Human Rights Commission released a report on the mental state of children in the Wickham Point detention center. All of these children had previously been held at Nauru

According to the report, 95% of children at the center between 8 and 18 were at high risk for PTSD. It concluded that the closed detention was harmful to the children's mental health, and recommended that they and their immediately be removed from Nauru.

[Wolfhunter107]

snip

Are you going to use actual arguments, or are you going to put words in my mouth?

[Dorsidwarf]

snip

Are you going to use actual arguments, or are you going to put words in my mouth?

Welcome to LoudPolitics.

[Sergarr]

The Australians are not showing any kindness. They are shoving them into what are basically modern-day concentration camps. Stop lying.

at least Australians are going to survive as a nation

unlike Germans and Swedes, who at this point at #1 candidates for getting quickly replaced with migrants, given that they're already in the majority compared with the natives in the youngest cohorts (i.e. the ones that matter), and the migration will only continue to rise in intensity because of the ghost of Hitler making people lose their minds and allow mass produced crimes (like illegal immigration, for example) to continue without any, even symbolic, repercussions, thus setting up a bomb under the whole "rule of law" structure that will inevitably blow up when the migrants will realise that they can do anything and no one will stop them because of "toleran progressiv".

[Loud Whispers]

Considering they're financed & administered by Australian goverment departments blaming standards on another country is pretty weak.

Considering Nauru would not accept the processing centre if it was not financed by the Australian government...? Consider that the Nauru government lets the immigrants have free reign of the island and the Australians get no say on that, nor do the Australians control the Nauru police and whom they charge with offences.

snip

Are you going to use actual arguments, or are you going to put words in my mouth?

I've presented my arguments and you've come up with nothing but emotional appeals and ad hominem. You say they are innocent, I point out they are illegal immigrants. You say the Australian government is violating holy sanctuary, I point out the lovely consequence of the Anglicans trying to hold ancient heretical doctrine as above secular law. I say giving these people residency will encourage more to make the journey - showing where with Germany exactly that happened, and how with Australia they stopped this from happening after a mere two years, and you respond by saying the Australians are putting innocent people into "basically" modern day concentration camps, not even addressing my argument at all. Come on m8 are you even trying, you got the cheeki breeki to say I have no argument when there is nothing but arguments with citations for days and all you've brought is emotional appeals, I want more substance if you want to convince me what the Australians are doing is wrong

Welcome to LoudPolitics.

Take yourself seriously or I won't, it's the a golden rule of shitposting; everyone throws around big claims and big words without any bloody sources