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[E. Albright]

Depends on the particulars. Higher prot points to the latter, higher def to the former... so with berserking giants, probably moreso the latter. However, if you can boost the attackers with e.g. Strength of Giants or Weapons of Sharpness, the former will look better, as it also will in cases where you can deploy Destruction. The former also has the advantage of deteriorating more slowly. However, if they can't punch through the armor with enough damage to outrun regen, that extra endurance probably won't last long enough to matter (i.e., 'til autorout).

[EuchreJack]

Any troops that are Ethereal + Lucky should do well, in general.  And smaller versions of those spells are relatively early (Body Ethereal has a radius of 1, so it actually effects a whole square instead of a single unit...so one giant or an entire halfling squad, food for thought).

By the way, I certainly would not say that provinces from an awake pretender are any ways "free".  There are certainly trade-offs.
The most simple trade-offs are: good scales vs. Awake -- and Magic Diversity vs. Awake Supercombatant.
However, every nation gives up more or less on those two fronts.

[E. Albright]

Well, the IMO strongest of the Fomorian nations has magic axes on all their sacreds, so with them ethereal is useless. But yes, for the rest that's true. And if any of us had fae-blooded Glamoured hoburgs... <shudder>

[EuchreJack]

Well, the IMO strongest of the Fomorian nations has magic axes on all their sacreds, so with them ethereal is useless. But yes, for the rest that's true. And if any of us had fae-blooded Glamoured hoburgs... <shudder>

Berserk on the hoburgs would help too.  Easy to cast, may or may not be out of the way research-wise.

[BFEL]

Geez the more I scout the more I feel HOPELESSLY OUTCLASSED strategically. I mean, I guess it's too early to really call such things, but like I said, I got one of the hilariously overpowered nations and I'm being out-expanded and...out-everything really.

Also getting tired of missing the times when EVERYONE IS ON AND TALKING GAH.

[EnigmaticHat]

Normally I would say "don't worry about winning your first MP game, just try to have fun and learn while you lose".

But, as you said, you have one of the overpowered nations.  So I wouldn't totally count yourself out.

[E. Albright]

One thing normally recommended with MP is when you're trying a new nation, fix your pretender and scales, then play out the first 10-20 turns repeatedly. Like, 3-10 times, or until you're comfortably ending up with... I dunno, 9-15 provinces at the end of the first year? The target number depends a lot on the aggressiveness of the people you're playing with, and how densely packed/connected the map is. Granted, in an actual game, everything may go south and you could end up with 4 or 5 provinces floating in an ocean of tears, but you need to know that you have a setup and strategy which is capable of making a good expansion against indies w/o every last star in the sky aligning...

[EnigmaticHat]

Exactly.  My standard for target provinces is to take the total number of land provinces, divide it by the number of land nations, get more than that if you can.  Depends on the nation tho.  If I was playing a nation like MA Pythium I would count my lucky stars to have the "expected" number of provinces.

[BFEL]

Exactly.  My standard for target provinces is to take the total number of land provinces, divide it by the number of land nations, get more than that if you can.  Depends on the nation tho.  If I was playing a nation like MA Pythium I would count my lucky stars to have the "expected" number of provinces.

And seeing how you've expanded so far if you were playing Dheathdaich you would have ALREADY WON

[EnigmaticHat]

Well, yeah, duh.  My goal playing a nation like Niefelhiem would be to control 200 provinces by the end of the first year.

(actually Fomorian troops are pretty good at scaring off rabble like Indy light infantry, so I would be surprised if I was the only player with solid early expansion)

[AlStar]

Even though I whined about it when I was initially looking over my nation, I want to say it again, just because: What kind of crap-ass Caelian nation uses Human scouts?!

Hey look at all those provinces that I can effortlessly fly to, but I have no idea what's there because my scout can't cross the river/mountain/whatever! Bah.

[EnigmaticHat]

Maybe its considered beneath Caelians to do that kind of work?

[BFEL]

Your Caelians have a crippling fear of success, its the only explanation.

[EnigmaticHat]

Your Caelians have a crippling fear of success, its the only explanation.

But if we conquer the world... what then?

[Frumple]

Then it would have been proven that everyone else had an even more crippling fear of success

Though honestly, hobina looks a lot more like it's actually caelian's that are the second class citizens. Presumably they aren't trusted to transmit vital information back to the rulers. For all its everything is basically tissue paper on this map, it's fairly metal that they're basically ruled by a coven of magically powerful bears. Bearocracy is pretty hardcore.

Lil' weird they can't summon bears, though, now that I think about it. Maybe the harbringers are worried about competition? Part time bears would probably have trouble holding ground with real ones. Explains why everything is screwed up with 'em, they don't have properly beary leadership, just a pale shapeshifting imitation.

In other news, while typing that, I have apparently convinced myself that a bear-themed nation is a good idea. Hrm.