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[Mephansteras]

Made an interesting discovery with my latest fortress.

We all know that Fortifications, while better then nothing, don't really do much to save your dwarves when the massed archers of the enemy come by. So, I had set up one of my forward watch towers at a junction where almost all of the invaders (hobgoblin in this case, since I modded in a few new races) had to come by to get at my fortress.

On a whim, I decided to make it a grand tower out of marble, and am slowly growing it as high as I can. Well, after moving my archers up to one of the top levels during a siege, I noticed that despite the hail of arrows flying at them, they didn't get scratched. Took out about 3 or 4 hoboblins before they'd moved out of range, too. A dog hanging out around the unfinished top, however, was killed. (No fortifications)

Which makes me think that, while Fortifications don't help too much near the enemy, the farther away you are the better chance they have of missing, and a better chance that the fortifications will help. So, being high up in a tower means that your dwarves are much safer then they would be say, one z-level above the enemy.

Anyone else notice this?

[Hypcso]

I've noticed that my central marksdwarf area 4 z-levels up from my entrance is capable of doing massive damage to anything on the ground, and thus far my only injury has been a headshot on a completely unarmored marksdwarf. Just finished cleaning out 100 gobbos + 100 beak dogs and a ton of trolls from that point. I was worried about the group of bowgoblins led by the bowgoblin leader, but I don't think they even got a shot off. Seems like from 4 z levels up my dwarves can hit MUCH farther out than on ground level as they were pounding goblins I couldn't even see without moving my screen

[Erom]

Yeah, the distance to fortifications is taken into account in the chance-to-penetrate calculation, it seems. So a gobbo standing right next to a fort is just as likely to shoot in as you are to shoot out. You can get the same effect by channeling some trenches to keep them at a distance, or by building up a few z-levels.

[dreiche2]

Would be cool if we could get an official confirmation on this from Toady...?

[ColonelTEE3]

If this is indeed confirmed, im guessing theres going to a mass-transition for most player's defense designs. Mine included  . Single z level archer walls ftl.

[Fedor]

Urm.  I thought the distance bit was already well-known.  Any goblin archer that makes it to the fortifications owns them!

What I didn't know was how helpful it apparently is to elevate marksdwarf firing positions.  That's the new information here.

[gimli]

quote:Originally posted by Hypcso:
<STRONG> Just finished cleaning out 100 gobbos + 100 beak dogs and a ton of trolls from that point. I was worried about the group of bowgoblins led by the bowgoblin leader, but I don't think they even got a shot off. </STRONG>

This is a fine example, that the current sieges are pretty much pointless. Marksdwarves in a tower / siege engines / traps -> Even 1000 goblins ans 100 trolls would be massarced easily.

[Hypcso]

quote:Originally posted by gimli:
<STRONG>

This is a fine example, that the current sieges are pretty much pointless. Marksdwarves in a tower / siege engines / traps -> Even 1000 goblins ans 100 trolls would be massarced easily.</STRONG>

Not true, they are succeeding in lagging me out so badly that I nearly can't play anymore. 300 goblins/beakdogs/trolls + caravan at the same time ftw. Last siege I had more fps pausing and using the one step method than letting it run.

[Earthquake Damage]

quote:Originally posted by Hypcso:
<STRONG>Not true, they are succeeding in lagging me out so badly that I nearly can't play anymore. 300 goblins/beakdogs/trolls + caravan at the same time ftw. Last siege I had more fps pausing and using the one step method than letting it run.</STRONG>

I recommend turning off weather until the siege is over.  It might make things tolerable.  That and temperature.

I done grammared good.

[ March 27, 2008: Message edited by: Earthquake Damage ]

[gimli]

quote:Originally posted by Hypcso:
<STRONG>

Not true, they are succeeding in lagging me out so badly that I nearly can't play anymore. 300 goblins/beakdogs/trolls + caravan at the same time ftw. Last siege I had more fps pausing and using the one step method than letting it run.</STRONG>

Well huh. I wonder what FPS will we have after the Army ARC is working and implemented.
As a side note, something must be done regarding sieges. It doesnt matter how many siegers are coming, its ridicolously easy to beat them all, even without loosing a single dwarf.   :roll:

[dreiche2]

Could you please stop hijacking every single thread either for the interface discussion or the sieges/megabeasts-not-tough-enough discussion?

Concerning the fortifications, I think the point was not that they operate better with z-levels, but better if enemies are far from them and your dwarves close, and z-levels are another way to put distance in between you and the enemy.

And about what was known from before, there was always that "far enemies must make a skill check" on the wiki, whatever that really means, and I think it also always had the "verify" tag.

So yeah....

[gimli]

quote:Originally posted by dreiche2:
<STRONG>Could you please stop hijacking every single thread either for the interface discussion or the sieges/megabeasts-not-tough-enough discussion?

Concerning the fortifications, I think the point was not that they operate better with z-levels, but better if enemies are far from them and your dwarves close, and z-levels are another way to put distance in between you and the enemy.

And about what was known from before, there was always that "far enemies must make a skill check" on the wiki, whatever that really means, and I think it also always had the "verify" tag.

So yeah....</STRONG>

Hijacking? I guess my reply wasnt out of line here at all, besides everything is true what I said.
 

[Hypcso]

quote:Originally posted by Earthquake Damage:
<STRONG>

I recommend turning off weather until the siege is over.  It might make things tolerable.  That and temperature.

I done grammared good.

[ March 27, 2008: Message edited by: Earthquake Damage ]</STRONG>

I've had everything off since I started this fortress, doesn't help in the least.

[Mech#4]

How many z levels can a dwarf fire down from? I thought it was 1 or is that only for catapults or balista...

[Derakon]

Catapults and ballista can't fire across z-axes; anything else can. I've certainly had dwarves firing crossbows down from my lookout tower.