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[Telgin]

Yeah, seems like I've read about people doing that, where the different purge types that produce resources produce stupid amounts at almost no cost because of that.  I never purge anything myself, but this does give another example of how the current pop growth and decline system needs some serious work.

[ZeroGravitas]

yeah i mean everything about the current implementation is mostly garbage. it's basically impossible for the AI to get right, as well as being a huge drain on your computer's resources because of the size of the optimization problem.

i mean the stellaris economy has never been right. never. it's always been absolute trash. we dozens of highly finnicky and customizable sources of resources and production, aka planets, yet we have global pools of resources that completely disengage your ship production from your resource harvesting and refining. it's just dumb.

and yeah, the pop/species management system is atrocious. just utter garbage.

so glad that games like eu4 and ck2 abstract all of this stuff, because stellaris absolutely proves that pds is incapable of designing and implementing a more detailed system.

[Loud Whispers]

What happened to the vic2 economy programmer?

[Iceblaster]

IIRC he just kinda disappeared after leaving the company, seeing as they can't even begin to decode how the economy functioned if I recall what I read right.

Spoiler: hot take (click to show/hide)

honestly tho ngl victoria 2's economy isn't even that GOOD it's just that for the genre, it works and is better than any alternative we have atm.

[Loud Whispers]

Ah. Shame he left. I agree the vic2 economy isn't perfect; no services economy, pops always being perfectly protectionist so tariffs don't actually do anything to keep out foreign goods e.t.c., but it was damn good. I would've hoped the hermetic monk who developed such a system which was fairly benign to computers would've been able to develop something spicier in the 10 years since but if they've departed, it's likely we'll never see them again until they've found King Arthur & Tupac

[EuchreJack]

Hm, Imperator: Rome has individual pops and an "economy*".

*Economy in that pops give specific resources in the form of gold, research, troops, or commerce (other gold).  And trade goods give bonuses instead of actual stuff, and the trading is abstracted again for gold.  Still, they have a developer tinkering with Imperator: Rome, and I've wondered why.  Perhaps they're using it to experiment on replacements for the system in Stellaris.

[LoSboccacc]

> we fixed federations, that'd be 19.99$

wait what

[Cruxador]

> we fixed federations, that'd be 19.99$

wait what

Are you really surprised?

[pisskop]

So I went and decided to boot this up on my new comp.  Got steam working fine.  Got my dlc in order.  Load -> crash on launcher.  Exception log says its a memory access problem, but not only is the computer new, the solutions Ive seen online dont seem to help?

Something about permissions?  idk, but it looks like its explicitly a problem with paradox games.

[Telgin]

The launcher crashes?  You might be able to bypass it and just run the game directly, but I'm not sure how exactly.

> we fixed federations, that'd be 19.99$

wait what

I'm curious if they actually fixed the problems with federations or just added new mechanics.  I'm specifically thinking of things like the 1,000 empty fleets that show up in the fleet manager because the AI keeps building corvettes, one at a time, to reinforce the federation fleet.  I know they made some changes to fleet reinforcements, so maybe they did.


Unrelated, but I had a humorous bug in my current game: a determined exterminator suffered a rebellion, which produced an empire of one system and two planets that were ostensibly controlled by a new reptilian empire despite the exterminators being avian designs.  The planets had no organic pops as far as I can tell and only had robots that were disassembling.

I didn't know gestalts could even have rebellions, much less have any idea where the reptilians came from.  This was a special game I set up with just the exterminators as the only other AI, and no primitives.

[amjh]

Maybe the game generated some kind of event that forces a rebellion but didn't have any valid targets?

[Telgin]

Very likely so.  I'm still a little curious how it happened in the first place, but when there's one bug there's dozens of them.  I also bumbled into the bug where a dig site took 32,000 days to excavate for some unknowable reason, with no obvious way to reset or fix it.

[Dunamisdeos]

it's likely we'll never see them again until they've found King Arthur & Tupac

Breaking news: Tupac is an immortal, was also King Arthur.

[Sartain]

I'm curious if they actually fixed the problems with federations or just added new mechanics.  I'm specifically thinking of things like the 1,000 empty fleets that show up in the fleet manager because the AI keeps building corvettes, one at a time, to reinforce the federation fleet.  I know they made some changes to fleet reinforcements, so maybe they did.

I'm guessing that they've added more mechanics with very little to no regard for how these mechanics actually interact with already existing mechanics, as that seems to have been the M.O. since around 2.0 I guess

[Rolan7]

The launcher crashes?  You might be able to bypass it and just run the game directly, but I'm not sure how exactly.

> we fixed federations, that'd be 19.99$

wait what

I'm curious if they actually fixed the problems with federations or just added new mechanics.  I'm specifically thinking of things like the 1,000 empty fleets that show up in the fleet manager because the AI keeps building corvettes, one at a time, to reinforce the federation fleet.  I know they made some changes to fleet reinforcements, so maybe they did.

Probably both.  I agree with Sartain that it's probably going to be... messy at first, with some bugfixes coming out in the days after launch.  But their development is spectacularly open, with back and forth discussion happening on their forums, so I blame that on the scale of their changes rather than laziness or anything.

It's also a good thing that they're changing so much.  Isn't that what people have been demanding, a proper federation system with depth?  Of course the playerbase will find bugs that in-house testing didn't, just by volume.  It's a sweeping rebuild of a core mechanic of the game, it will have bugs.

Which actually makes the accusation that it'll cost $19.99 laughable.  The new mechanics are free, as is their longstanding policy.  They merely lock the wilder options.  We all get the improved federations (and yes, the bugs ).