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[10ebbor10]

Fine then, but at least make it something usefull, instead of slightly cheaper and shinier.

[Sheb]

Yeah, cheaper+Hollow point seems like a good idea.

[Execute/Dumbo.exe]

My thoughts are that we should probably try to level the playing field, if they get an automatic bonus at short ranges, get better short range weaponry to compensate.
Oh, speaking of, when were weapon attachments first developed in real life? You know, weapons designed to have a function in any situation, I feel that having something like that first would be a big boon.

[andrea]

either way, has the design discussion stopped? if me and Andres are outvoted on the rifle, then we should make a formal design proposal for the optics , including all the models developed, how they attach to our stuff, etc.


@Andres, I know. I wanted planes cheaper as well. But we were the only 2 voting for that, it was going to lose. The choice was between HEAT and rocket. cheaper planes would have done a lot more to negate their artillery advantage.

[Andres]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but hollow points aren't that effective at piercing armour, right? Well, Moskurg uses steel plate as makeshift armour and have been doing so since the trenches. It was stated as not being as effective as our own (which was made with a Revision) but it might still be enough to stop 9mm hollow points.

Glory to Arstotzka.

[Sheb]

We already got cheap attack planes, there is a limit to how many planes we can fly.

[andrea]

we don't have cheap attack planes. We have cheap triplanes, which are very outdated and no longer used since we introduced full aluminium planes.
All our currently deployed planes are expensive.

[10ebbor10]

@Andres, I know. I wanted planes cheaper as well. But we were the only 2 voting for that, it was going to lose. The choice was between HEAT and rocket. cheaper planes would have done a lot more to negate their artillery advantage.

The problem was different actually.

You convinced me HEAT was useless, and thus I proposed a general ammunition update. However, the GM ninja-updated before that could gain enough ground, but after enough people had already switched from HEAT.

[Sheb]

we don't have cheap attack planes. We have cheap triplanes, which are very outdated and no longer used since we introduced full aluminium planes.
All our currently deployed planes are expensive.

I don't think we ever obsoleted them. And they aren't that outdated.

[Andres]

we don't have cheap attack planes. We have cheap triplanes, which are very outdated and no longer used since we introduced full aluminium planes.
All our currently deployed planes are expensive.

I don't think we ever obsoleted them. And they aren't that outdated.

We didn't officially obsolete them but one of the reports said that they just couldn't keep up with the new planes. Our Very Expensive HF managed to stall their Expensive planes (can't remember what plane they were using) and now that they're Expensive, our triplanes just aren't of any use.

Glory to Arstotzka.

EDIT:
http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=152099.msg6423848#msg6423848
Actually, our HF managed to more than stall them, they managed to give us an advantage. This was back when their engines leaked and were forced to land occasionally. They were fighting top-of-the-line Wasps.

[10ebbor10]

What caused us to loose air-to-air advantage then?

[andrea]

I don't think we did.

[Andres]

I found some relevant reports on our planes' abilities to fight.

1927 Battle Report

Overall, Arstotzka has better performance in air-to-air, ground-to-air, and slightly better air-to-ground.

1928 Battle Report

The war in the air hasn't changed, except for the addition of Eagle Sights to some Moskurg M3 Wasps. This lets them aim shots from farther off, but their M1 Stallion's grouping is a limiting factor on accuracy. Arstotzka has more planes shot down by ground-to-air fire than last year, after the Stallion shortage ends. Still, Arstotzka retains an advantage overall.

1929 Battle Report

The war in the air is quite entirely the same as it was last year. Arstotzka still gets more air-to-air and air-to-ground kills than Moskurg, and their dive bombers continue to be a big threat to T2 Breakers, SPATs, and other artillery, emplacements and vehicles.

Glory to Arstotzka.

[10ebbor10]

On a side note, one final argument why we need to update our armor.

The enemy RR is seriously flawed, exploding at random moments and such. If they fix that, our tanks will be decimated.

[Andres]

They'll be fighting in the city where they'll be fighting in close range. Any armour we add will be countered by being at Close range. (+1 level of armour penetration, according to the rules.)

In the Jungle, their new weapon is absolute shit and a Revision might not be enough to fix it entirely. More importantly, they're winning despite the shitty weapon and that's a sign that tank armour isn't the key to winning there.

SMGs will let us suppress them (similar to how they're suppressing us) and our sniper should help take them out (similar to how they've done to our RPGs in the Mountains.)

Glory to Arstotzka.