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[evilcherry]

I guess we're now more technologically advanced in literally every way than Moskurg. Now that we have cheap radios, our citizens have cheap radios too.

Glory to Arstotzka.

[Joking]SENSI.
I DEMAND WE GET INCREASED MORALE BECAUSE OF OUR NEW AND IMPROVED PROPAGANDA INFORMATION SPREADING DEVICES.

Meanwhile, Agent Sandworm in somewhere codenamed AS-CC-77...

Wow this is the current standard of Astrotzkan education. Spelling errors and all-caps writing. Will make better propaganda material than anything they have scavenged from their city-of-dashes.

Great no apostrophe there.
Fun fact, sensi is actually a word, a Japanese one, sure, but no more so than sensei, apparently sensi means a teacher or instructor at Judo/Karate, while sensei is the Japanese term for teacher.
I have no idea why there's a difference.

((One of the renderings of Sensi, or Senshi in Hepburn Romanization, is 先師, which means a very, very esteemed teacher or grandmaster. Note that most people outside of Japan uses Hepburn, so the use of si instead of shi is quite odd. Anyway, enough banter here, please don't give me another chance to peek at this thread.))

[10ebbor10]

Anyway, back to the game.

Anyone have a tally of the revisions?

[andrea]

Spoiler: revision proposals (click to show/hide)

Revise our dive bomber to use 2 Oil instead or 3 Oil. If fuel injection and/or turbo can help achieve that goal, include them. If they don't, exclude them. Highest priority is decreasing Oil cost.

Revision : Introduce HEAT rounds for our artillery, tank and rocket. This should give each of those a single-shot kill certainity on anything they design with less than extremely heavy armor. Uses a cap and fins to stabilize the projectile. If time is left, also develop APHE, and Canister shot.

Spoiler: revision votes (click to show/hide)

Plane engines : Andres, Andrea, ebbor?
Heat rounds:ebbor?, quake,tryrar

I am not entirely sure of what you voted for, ebbor. It seems you get to decide.

I still think the heat rounds are not a great idea, since we can already penetrate their armor with ease.

Also, addendum to the planes revision: after reducing oil cost, apply engine upgrades as long as they don't increase oil cost?

[Sheb]

What's the difference between HEAT and the shaped charge we already got?

[10ebbor10]

The shaped charge we have now is non-aerodynamic, inaccurate and generally ineffective beyond extremely close range.

The problem is, I don't really like either revision. As has correctly been noted before, the ammunition revision isn't really useful. (Especially, because in retrospect, our tank cannon is actually on the smaller side for HEAT shells, and HEAT does better when fired from smoothbore).

On the other hand, our planes have generally been ineffective in doing anything useful, even though they should be of great benefit.

[andrea]

well, in that same post ebbor proposed to put our new shaped charge to use, so I guess none. Still, our design is rather crude, so any design or revision done to it is bound to increase effectiveness somewhat.

Also, is adding shaped charges to artillery a good idea? it is not like we can pinpoint enemy tanks, and if we hit one straight, a 80mm projectile is going to butcher it regardless. besides, I imagine artillery is hitting the top more than the front, meanng it has even less armor to deal with.

Anyway, HEAT rounds ( or shaped charges) increase armor penetration.

I think more planes can help, and more tech will help our next design. Still, scrolling our tech list for improvements.
At worst, we can resurrect the old favorite SMG

[10ebbor10]

Also, is adding shaped charges to artillery a good idea? it is not like we can pinpoint enemy tanks, and if we hit one straight, a 80mm projectile is going to butcher it regardless. besides, I imagine artillery is hitting the top more than the front, meanng it has even less armor to deal with.

Our artillery is a field gun. It fires direct line of sight shots. It's also highly outdated, so I'm not sure it can still penetrate enemy tanks.

[10ebbor10]

I'm going for ammunition. In both the 1927 and 1928 these are noted as being a prime advantage of Moskurg.

We should change our airforce doctrine. Currently, it's being noted as bombers escorting fighters. I think we should go to a total air superiority doctrine, with dedicated air sweeps of pure fighters hunting down Moskurgian defenders, and bombing effort focused on their airfields.

We have superior planes, we can force their airforce into the ground.

[andrea]

for the kind of range needed to be useful against tanks ( which is, significantly mroe than our more mobile tank destroyers which are already doing a good job at countersniping), it has got to go at least a bit ballistic.

and a big chunck of metal and explosion is going to stay effective for a while, I guess.

we do have a shortage of things we can revise.

we can revise the SMG. will bring us a small advantage in jungle ( note that despite stolen communications, they still cn't advance there).
we can apply modern engine tech to our motorbike ( I may be wrong, but I don't think we really need a 150kph offroad speeder)
we can revise our armored car to act as a troop transport ( doubtful it can be done)
we can revise the RPG to improve range and accuracy ( but this can be rolled in the already proposed ammo upgrade)
we can revise the landmine to get better power and variety ( it already works fine against infantry and we have plenty of ways to deal with armor)
we can revise our tank( use the longer barrel+muzzle brake of tank destroyer to gain range? electric turrets? will it actually be of use?)

or we can revise planes, revise armor.

basically, all our designs work fine. even our recent pseudo-computer works fine, and is cheap.

Ebbor: they are noted as prime moskurg advantage because before that they had no way of reliably piercing our sloped armor. We, on the other hand, never had a problem piercing their.

[Sheb]

Wait, what about all my enthusiastic ranting about mounting AS-RPG28 on vehicles? I still think an armored car with a couple of racks of rockets on it would make a great anti-armor unit, or alternatively great direct fire support for infantry in the jungle. Racks of rockets on our plane would make them into fearsome attacker, and let us wreck Moksburg's train tracks.


Revision Proposal

Fits AS-RPG28 on our vehicles! attach racks of rockets launchers to our vehicle, with a simple electric cable to allow firing from within the vehicle. Vehicles to be upgraded are:
-AS-MV21-AL, for a small, light M50 Ontos.
-AS-A19C: For more ground-attack capabilites.
-AS-HF-24: So our aces can blow even more stuff.
-AS-GU23: Who doesn't like a helmet-mounted rocket-launcher?

Also, start putting a couples of RPGs in each of our AS-MAT26-50, in case something threaten their flanks.

[Kot]

Wait, what about all my enthusiastic ranting about mounting AS-RPG28 on vehicles? I still think an armored car with a couple of racks of rockets on it would make a great anti-armor unit, or alternatively great direct fire support for infantry in the jungle. Racks of rockets on our plane would make them into fearsome attacker, and let us wreck Moksburg's train tracks.

Mounting it on ground vehicles won't do shit, especially when you think of making M50 Ontos (30mm vs 106mm, are you for real? I said that even before, and if you still consider it's 50mm actually, it's still 56mm of difference!). Mounting them on planes might do better, since rockets on planes are amazing.

[Sheb]

The AS-MV21 mount 20 mm steel core AP autocannon. Mounting RPG28 on it would increase its combat power significantly. And its faster than anything else we have on the ground but the motorcycle.

I agree that there would be little point in mountain rockets on our tank, which is why I didn't suggest it. But the AS-MV21-AL is a good choice.

[andrea]

mounting on planes might be a suitable plan.

As for mounting on vehicles... not sure if worth it. with the kind of tech we have now, we can basically only aim forward with any weapon mounted outside but controlled inside ( no cameras, no electronics, no sophisticated controls). Our soldiers could get out and aim manually... but they can do that already ( see motorbikes)

Same goes for the MAT26. te crew can already get RPGs for self defense if they so wish.

However, a revision to add rockets to our planes is something I could get behind. furthers rocket tech, possibly gets us a better shaped charge rocket ( more aerodynamic) , improves capabilities of our planes.
Still in favor of cheaper planes, but it depends on how the support swings.

edit: the autocannon in the AS-MV21 fires with the gunner hatch open. it means one of our soldiers gets out and operate it I think. Due to the recoilless nature of our RPG, there is nothing stopping the soldiers from just keeping an infantry rated tube available

[Sheb]

Oh, I agree, it just gives some extra Ooooomph to our armored cars. Basically, give them something with more explosive to shoot when they need to dispatch groups of enemy infantry in the jungle, or shoot at enemy's armored vehicle.

But yeah, if you want more fancy rocket tech, we could just revise the planes for rockets.

[andrea]

well, updating the list. Gain support, and I'll vote to make rocket planes win rather than shaped charge artillery rounds.

Spoiler: revision proposals (click to show/hide)

Revise our dive bomber to use 2 Oil instead or 3 Oil. If fuel injection and/or turbo can help achieve that goal, include them. If they don't, exclude them. Highest priority is decreasing Oil cost.

Revision : Introduce HEAT rounds for our artillery, tank and rocket. This should give each of those a single-shot kill certainity on anything they design with less than extremely heavy armor. Uses a cap and fins to stabilize the projectile. If time is left, also develop APHE, and Canister shot.

Add rocket weapons to our planes. Improve the aerodynamics of our shaped charge shells as well, so they are useable.

Add rocket weapons to our vehicles. Get the forementioned shaped charge reshape as well.

Spoiler: revision votes (click to show/hide)

Plane engines : Andres, Andrea
Heat rounds:ebbor, quake,tryrar
Vehicle RPG:
Rocket planes!(not actually rocket planes):