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We know how to make them and they're useful, mainline production.

4 (33.3%)

They seem out of place and run rather counter to a fantasy setting, avoid them.

2 (16.7%)

Get outta here, nerd, nobody finds guns that interesting.

1 (8.3%)

Go ahead and have the NPCs make em, but not worth player input.

1 (8.3%)

Support, but they shouldn't be the standard weapons.

4 (33.3%)

Total Members Voted: 12

[Amperzand]

Cool, but far harder to accomplish. It's not something you can never do, but we don't actually have the fabrication machinery to make things like that. Technomancy may be powerful, but you still need a proper fine machining shop to make fractionally submillimeter components.

[TheBiggerFish]

Cool, but far harder to accomplish. It's not something you can never do, but we don't actually have the fabrication machinery to make things like that. Technomancy may be powerful, but you still need a proper fine machining shop to make fractionally submillimeter components.

...?
Jeweler's magnifying thing plus literally moving molecues or crystal units or whatever plus extreme patience.

[Dustan Hache]

Net, i dont know how many times i have to explain this, but FORCING ENERGY INTO SOMETHING IS NOT THE SAME AS HACKING!  If i was trying to hack a magicomputer for any reason whatsoever, it would obviously A) require knowledge of technomancy working to begin with and B) a something akin to mind , not energy, affecting spell.
A lump of soul is counting as energy for the sake of my attack, so protecting against "hacking" will not stop a surge of energy from frying spark and giving it sapience. On the same note, THERE IS NO WAY OF REPULSING A SURGE OF MAGIC ENERGY CURRENTLY. This means that the attack will inevitably hit, though it could in theory be siphoned off or redirected to prevent major harm.

If amperzand wants to try and take my place for the remainder of the session, be my guest, but for the final f***ing time: he is not armed with anything other than his internal reserves of geothaum, he is only wearing regular clothing, he is a Specialised necromancer, with little in the way of other training, he is Not some sort of supermuscular mastermind, and finally, he is injured and on the ground right now.

Please, by all means butcher the plan i had in mind simply because you can't see that fish is blatantly powergaming. I am out for the next week, had enough of this BS.

[TheBiggerFish]

Net, i dont know how many times i have to explain this, but FORCING ENERGY INTO SOMETHING IS NOT THE SAME AS HACKING!  If i was trying to hack a magicomputer for any reason whatsoever, it would obviously A) require knowledge of technomancy working to begin with and B) a something akin to mind , not energy, affecting spell.
A lump of soul is counting as energy for the sake of my attack, so protecting against "hacking" will not stop a surge of energy from frying spark and giving it sapience. On the same note, THERE IS NO WAY OF REPULSING A SURGE OF MAGIC ENERGY CURRENTLY. This means that the attack will inevitably hit, though it could in theory be siphoned off or redirected to prevent major harm.

If amperzand wants to try and take my place for the remainder of the session, be my guest, but for the final f***ing time: he is not armed with anything other than his internal reserves of geothaum, he is only wearing regular clothing, he is a Specialised necromancer, with little in the way of other training, he is Not some sort of supermuscular mastermind, and finally, he is injured and on the ground right now.

Please, by all means butcher the plan i had in mind simply because you can't see that fish is blatantly powergaming. I am out for the next week, had enough of this BS.

...You DID read the bit where Spark can deflect spells, right?
And I seem to recall offering a compromise but seriously, magic and, to a lesser extent, mobility are Spark's strong points.  It's going to take work to hit him with magic, even if it's not best analogous to a hack.  You can't just come out of nowhere and blast through defenses that can rewrite themselves faster than a human can react without some planning beforehand, for crying out loud!
And if you're armed with only a very drained geothaumic field how are you even mustering enough energy to CAST that?
Seriously, soul magic is a big thing.

[Amperzand]

He can, actually. It's called hitting the thing with brute energy. Hacking into the thing messes with its software, hitting it with a power surge overloads the hardware.

No, Spark doesn't deflect spells, because that's overpowered, especially for a pet. Try fighting in person, the little machine isn't a combat asset, it's an advisor and personal data assistant.

[TheBiggerFish]

He can, actually. It's called hitting the thing with brute energy. Hacking into the thing messes with its software, hitting it with a power surge overloads the hardware.

No, Spark doesn't deflect spells, because that's overpowered, especially for a pet. Try fighting in person, the little machine isn't a combat asset, it's an advisor and personal data assistant.

...Okay, make up your mind, please.
*goes quote hunting*
E:Okay, Amp, you did say he could do a power surge.
However, the original attack, which has not been changed since (below)

*the stranger would turn, and focus upon spark, twisting and tainting the energy into an unholy mix that would fry the battery, and most likely twist spark's original being into something... different. the originally barely sentient magicomputer would unleash a wave of agony through spark and it's connection to Net, possibly incapacitating them both in the process as a part of his own consciousness is ripped through it and into the now sapient machine. after which he would continue to limp off as quietly as possible, heading for the lift with urgency*

is, as written, NOT a power surge.  It's an attempt at manipulation of the system.  So while I will agree that he COULD do that, he DIDN'T.  He can still try though.

[Amperzand]

@Hache; Okay, for all intents and purposes, the construct is already a sentient. You can certainly use your own specialization to separate it from its creator, rendering it independently sentient, which should prove interesting. I'm going to assume this is what you try to do for the next update.

@Fish; I don't actually know what self-contradiction I'm making. One way or another, that's not at all a good thing.

[TheBiggerFish]

@Hache; Okay, for all intents and purposes, the construct is already a sentient. You can certainly use your own specialization to separate it from its creator, rendering it independently sentient, which should prove interesting. I'm going to assume this is what you try to do for the next update.

@Fish; I don't actually know what self-contradiction I'm making. One way or another, that's not at all a good thing.

One: Significantly edited post.
One Point Five:Yeah, trying to add more sentience wouldn't exactly help.  However, rending the "control" bond should be possible, if not the telepathic link between myself and Spark, which would have the same effect as making it independent of me.  I think that if you rended it it'd latch onto the Skalewyrm for a bit, download stuff, then decay.  Sympathy and all.  My end would probably just dissipate.
Two: P sure you said Spark could deflect spells somewhere.  In the specific context of this event.

E:Found it.

{One, bouncing the spell back is perfectly viable, as long as you aren't the one trying to cast with it. There may be loopholes, but they won't exist once they are brought to my attention. Two, please snip quotes for just the things you are specifically referencing, it's good form. Three, I don't really know how to deal with y'all's situation right now, so here's a battledop.}

E:Link.
http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=149024.msg6475225#msg6475225

[Amperzand]

Ahh. Thanks. While I had forgotten saying that, I meant it as an active defense, you cast a thingymabob to reflect another thingymabob, not something that could be gotten permanently. Defending yourself against spells on an individual basis, yes. Being immune to spells on a passive basis, no.

E;Also, Spark wouldn't fade. That thing's functionally immortal, it's not dying until something smashes it and nobody puts it back together.

[TheBiggerFish]

Ahh. Thanks. While I had forgotten saying that, I meant it as an active defense, you cast a thingymabob to reflect another thingymabob, not something that could be gotten as a passive defense. Defending yourself against spells on an individual basis, yes. Being immune to spells on a passive basis, no.

Yeah I kind of assumed it was you had to actually go and cast to defend, but Dustan would still take time to assemble that spell, and thus leave Spark time to counter it.  At least that's my opinion, as this is clearly not a premade/practiced spell.
More In-Depth Whatever, Subject To GM Approval:
You have to assemble the spell to cast it.  In any system, really.  This takes more time the more you're trying to improvise, and less time the more you use components of spells you've used before, even if only as components and not as anything that the original spell might have actually done.  For instance, assuming magic enough, you could spam fireball more than you could generate the same amount of fire at the target's position.  Alternatively, had you practiced generating stationary bursts of heat at varying distances, you could make that work more easily than moving a ball of heat along.  Most mages practice the moving projectiles though.

[Amperzand]

Not quite what I imagine, but it's close enough. If a conflict arises, I'll moderate there.

[TheBiggerFish]

Not quite what I imagine, but it's close enough. If a conflict arises, I'll moderate there.

So is that yes, no, or partial to deflecting the power twist thing?
Just to get that out of the way.

[Amperzand]

Spark isn't a spellcaster itself, it's a sentient machine with control over its components. Were you near it, you could cast to defend it, or if you hadn't just been blown up by a cannon, you could cast at range along the link to defend it. Of course, casting at range/along links is harder and more time-consuming than casting at short range/within Mk.1 Eyeball distance. It's fairly easy for, say, a necromancer to cast a functional "Soulrend Sentient" spell against spark in half the time it'd take you to send a defense along your link. Equally, you can throw a fireball before a necromancer can magic up an "Entropic Barrier" to absorb it for his zombies.

@Hache; While base DF necromancy is highly limited in versatility, I'm altering that. While you still don't have a full range of Dark Magic type spells, you are a Death Magician, instead of merely a Reanimator, if that makes sense.

[TheBiggerFish]

Spark isn't a spellcaster itself, it's a sentient machine with control over its components. Were you near it, you could cast to defend it, or if you hadn't just been blown up by a cannon, you could cast at range along the link to defend it. Of course, casting at range/along links is harder and more time-consuming than casting at short range/within Mk.1 Eyeball distance. It's fairly easy for, say, a necromancer to cast a functional "Soulrend Sentient" spell against spark in half the time it'd take you to send a defense along your link. Equally, you can throw a fireball before a necromancer can magic up an "Entropic Barrier" to absorb it for his zombies.

Ahem.  It is somewhat nonsensical to state that a magic AI (of any power) can't cast.
It's kind of like saying that a normal AI can't write code.  Or that, equally, a fully animate zombie mage can't cast.
Although zombie mages are not very likely.
Spark also has a battery tapped at the moment for power.

[Chevaleresse]

Just chiming in to say that from my perspective, Hache did the equivalent of grabbing, twisting, and pulling with magical energy, not some sort of sophisticated hack. Trying to rip a component out of a computer won't be stopped by any amount of software, though that analogy isn;t perfect.