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[Kanil]

curious if you guys'll be doing those tournaments, i'd love to get in on that once the game's out

AlStar has been coordinating BB1 tournaments here for....years now. If he's onboard with BB2, it would seem safe to assume he'll do so there too.

AlStar handed the tournament off to me a couple of years ago, and I handed it to THE_SLAYA more recently, he's the current coordinator.

We've had three different people run the tournament, without any major issue, so even if THE_SLAYA doesn't want to run a BB2 version, I'm sure you can find someone willing to.

[Delta Foxtrot]

2 hour game?

Most of the games I played on PC took over an hour, some hitting two hour or near that point. Obviously it depends on turn timer and how judiciously people use it.

I have no reason to believe that Cyanide would make the game quicker to play (nor that they necessarily should, it can be a fun 2 hours).

[CaptainLambcake]

Would you be willing to Kanil?

[sambojin]

nope. There was a post here, but my phone ate it.

In summary, it looks ok, but I wouldn't buy it if you bought the first. I didn't, so I might. Still DLC races for the full roster though. Interface seems a bit nicer and more usable, just quicker to play in general.

Icons instead of skill names on player cards, which is a big no-no IMO. But block dice are on the main screen, and percentages are easier to see for dodges etc. I'm not sure whether it's worth full price, considering the other available options for BB (I could just donate to fumbbl, as much or as little as I wanted, or not at all).

This one is far prettier though, so I'll probably grab a copy when it's on sale.

Here's some footage between crendor and TB of the finished product:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=0OLnS42pO8I

[Silent_Thunder]

For MM I can't recommend BB1 anymore as it's already starting to wither, and tbh I never liked it for leagues anyway, fumbbl being my league BB of choice because the much more comprehensive house rules you can choose from.

So basically for open MM play BB2 manages to fit the bill, even with the missing teams. Really it just needs Undead, Goblins, Pro Elves, Vampires, and CDorfs to really fit the bill for all the most commonly played races.

It's also far, far more new player friendly, with showing the percentages of actions, what block dice will do if you hover over them, the skill icons both being worse and better (worse to start, better when you're used to them as it lets you view the whole team at once in the team management screens), the lack of hover names is shit though, so we'll see if that's fixed.

The new rules are also IMHO an improvement in most cases, especially the (unanimously agreed on by the BBRC) treasury bank rule that was supposed to be in LRB6 before Jervis threw a shitfit and used his veto power to put his pet rule in instead. Aging is back from LRB4, except now it's only the retirement part, not the horrible constant stat decay, and the new stadium improvements, while I can't find much previous stuff on it like the other changes, do add a nice dynamic, especially as upgrades affect teams equally (for instance making any failed GFI roll add +1 to armor break for the failure, or both teams getting a free bribe). The wizard one is fairly problematic as a free wizard for both sides favors AGI teams by quite alot, but thankfully not many people seem to take it out of irrational fear.

It should be noted that for private leagues aging can be disabled, and stadium upgrades can easily be house rule enforced. The bank rule however is not optional, but is frankly a better way of handling it than the old petty cash rule.

Basically the old petty cash rule from LRB6 was that any cash added added to opponents petty cash as well, and couldn't stack with petty cash. This caused two problems. 1) If you were the top team, you never ever had a reason to buy inducements. 2) If you were the bottom team and you were a bit short, you couldn't do anything about it.

The new rule doesn't do cash adding, but also makes any cash over 150,000 (Considered to be the usual nest egg you want to keep) count for tv. So lower value teams can spend the extra 10k if they reall need it, while rich teams (almost always bashy guys who dont take as many casulties because bash) are both discouraged from hoarding gold like a kleptomaniac dragon (I have seen max fed Chaos teams with over 10 million gold in bb1 before), and have a reason to actually spend it.

The new race, Brettonians, also aren't a Cyanide invention, and are isntead a roster that have been around for awhile in various fan communities.

Lastly, there have been hints by Cyanide we might get a Slaan team this time around. Slaan, while a BBRC approved team, was not in BBCE because GW never sold minis for them, same as Chaos Pact.

[Stuebi]

Don't throw stones at me please, but I actually bought the Preorder. Initially you would either get Woodelves or Lizardmen for the Preorder, but they actually handed out both in the end.

First things first, the game looks a lot better than the first one. Animations, both idle and active look a lot cooler. The game also runs a lot smoother, at least for me. I allways had little preformance issues with Chaos Edition. It's also more Newbie-friendly, the Campaign is basically one big Tutorial and the UI gives you a lot more numbers.

On the other hand, only 10 Teams (8 if you did not Preorder), League Management is a little limited, especially in Single Player (No customizeable Rewards etc.) and there is no LAN-Mode, at least I couldnt find it.

All in all, the recommendation heavily depends on Cyanide now. If they release new Races as actual DLC instead of a new game every couple months and work on the League System, I can totally recommend the game. But if they announce Slightlynew-Edition in a few weeks, I'd stay clear.

[Neonivek]

Actually Stuebi it seems that Blood Bowl 2 has a good mix between people liking and disliking the game. Meaning it is a good time for reasonable discourse.

[Kanil]

If they release new Races as actual DLC instead of a new game every couple months and work on the League System, I can totally recommend the game. But if they announce Slightlynew-Edition in a few weeks, I'd stay clear.

I'm hoping for the exact opposite. I'd rather everyone have access to all the teams than having to buy each one of them individually (or in small packs or what have you.) I'd prefer seeing people pick teams they want to play, than what they're willing to pay to play.

[sambojin]

I really hope lizzies get DLC'd at some point. They're one of my favourites.

I do want the game just yet, but when it's on sale or after seeing what they do with the other races, I'll consider it for sure. It's a real shame it's not all-in-one, but BB gives a surprising amount of value out of a couple of extra races. Might be worth it if they're cheap enough.

[Delta Foxtrot]

How's the match length compared to previous blood bowl?

[sambojin]

It "seems" a little quicker from what I saw of play vids. You can set the turn timer for leagues. But in general, the better layout, information on-screen and block die setup seemed a bit quicker for turns overall.

1 hour games are a definite possibility if you've got a quick-to-play team and maybe a couple of turnovers due to early errors.

Any input from those that actually own it?

[Silent_Thunder]

It plays faster mostly because the doing stuff part of the interface isn't a complete disaster like it was in BB1 (I dare someone to defend that UI, I double dare them). Optional skills like wrestle show up in their own little context popup menu above the player instead of a fucking awful giant box of skills that have nothing to do with the action you are taking for instance. The dice appearing above the player instead of in a big fucking menu also help you make your decision faster by immediately seeing the surrounding area and weather say a both down or a stumble is the better choice when they have Blodge. Actions that need to be activated, like doing a Blitz, Pass or using Hypnotic Gaze can be activated from the context menu on the player instead of the weird disaster sidebar in BB1. (Oh god what Icon was leap again.. no that's pass.. where is it, crap how do I disable Hail Mary pass again?)

 The moneyshot cutscenes don't interfere much if you remember to set it to "Armor Breaks Only", although it will make things drag if they are set to every successful block. Setting up takes longer though as peices now run to their new position instead of teleport, although the players actually move faster than in bb1 it seems. But mainly it's the move to context menus and the 3d dice that speed things along as you aren't jumping in and out of a screen blocking menu and thus breaking up the flow of your decision making.

It's sorta been confirmed in various discussions that DLC is the way they're going to do it not "buy the new version even if you have no interest in the new teams because fuck you" like in B1, especially as the Lizards and Wood Elves were supposed to be the first DLC but then the game got delayed for programming reasons (which meant the art teams were still working on the DLC), and infact they are already available to non-preorders on the console versions IIRC but they are still trying to determine a good price point for PC apparently. The unofficial word is sometime in the week or two will see Lizzies and Wood Elves as DLC for non preorders.

Normally I'd recommend new players actually go to FUMBBL since it's free, but TBH going to FUMBBL for someone who never played Blood Bowl before is like having your first ever American Football game against the New England Patriots. You're going to get murdered, learn nothing, and hate everything. The more explained mechanics and general lower skill floor in the current BB2 community because of other new players make it a much better game than BB1 or FUMBBL for someone who has never played before.

Oh yeah, and passblock is in. They apparently were having programming issues with it, so it arrived in the first post release patch.

[Silent_Thunder]

Oh and for the record the TGS Blood Bowl tournament is being done again, this time under the name Crendorian Invitational, and so far 3 matches have been played.

Here's a playlist with the preview thread with the rundown of teams and the currently played matches. No idea if it will be kept up to date though.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F6s-9LS3fRo&index=1&list=PLnX-N6iBXNOzfXWOsF0-U9RkIK7-rUI7O

[Teneb]

Icons instead of skill names on player cards, which is a big no-no IMO.

Just would like to point out that you can click/mouse over (can't remember which) the icon in order to find out what it is.

If they release new Races as actual DLC instead of a new game every couple months and work on the League System, I can totally recommend the game. But if they announce Slightlynew-Edition in a few weeks, I'd stay clear.

I'm hoping for the exact opposite. I'd rather everyone have access to all the teams than having to buy each one of them individually (or in small packs or what have you.) I'd prefer seeing people pick teams they want to play, than what they're willing to pay to play.

The thing is that making models, animations and so on for a team is not a cheap thing. As long as the price is right, I think DLC is an ok way to go.

Should we set up a B12 BB2 league?

[Kanil]

I'm hoping for the exact opposite. I'd rather everyone have access to all the teams than having to buy each one of them individually (or in small packs or what have you.) I'd prefer seeing people pick teams they want to play, than what they're willing to pay to play.

The thing is that making models, animations and so on for a team is not a cheap thing. As long as the price is right, I think DLC is an ok way to go.

No matter how cheap they make it, it's still going to have a negative effect on your opponent's team variety. If you enjoy playing orcs and dwarves all day, you'll probably be fine with DLC. If you like playing against a variety of teams, then you're out of luck. This is really a situation where DLC makes the end product worse irregardless of whether you buy it all or not.