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[Retropunch]

Greetings Slavers!

IN THE GRIM DARKNESS OF THE FAR FUTURE THERE IS ONLY WAR!

So I've been working on a game in total secrecy for a little while now, and it's at the point where I can about share it and issue forth a cry for assistance. It's basically a Homeworld/FTL-like, but with a much expanded meta-game and real time, particle-heavy battles. And you play as the bad guy.

You're the head of a slave ship, and you basically just slave and pillage your way across the galaxy - lots of hard decisions to make and lots of slaves to slave.


The combat:
Real-time combat, but (as you may have seen from my previous posts) an emphasis on broad commands rather than individual unit movements or direct commands. So you can get your crew to focus on rolling out as many fighters as you can, or focus your bombers on frigates, but this won't always be followed by everyone. This is in an attempt to give the player more of a feel of a commander, with orders affected by morale and the number of officers you have. I'll be expanding on this in a future post, but currently everything works as expected, it just needs a lot of tweaking to get any sort of balance right. Currently there's a bit of a cascade sort of thing going on, as if you/they start losing it's pretty much game-over in 15 seconds as they quickly get overwhelmed.

Screenshot of combat below:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

The Meta
This ties directly into the combat, and is basically about pillaging, slaving and gaining credits. You need to balance your reputation against the morale of your officers - if you go too far with the pillaging/slaving then the pressure from the three main factions can quickly overwhelm you, but your officers expect you to be slaving and pillaging and morale will dip if you don't. You've also got to be repairing your ship, buying new toys and paying your crew.

Slaves are both your currency and part of your crew. Without enough slaves, reloading time, fighter production and so on will dip, but they're also the one commodity you can sell. All frigates have slaves on them, so losing a frigate also kills off slaves, as can taking critical damage on the capital ship.

There's no end goal, but its gratuitously and unfairly difficult with pretty much no thought put towards balance or difficulty curve. Currently, there's just a lot of random events but I'm looking at how to change that. This is where I need your feedback! As far as meta goes I have the following broad questions (but feel free to add anything more):
 
Would you prefer a random or hand-crafted universe? Hand crafted would obviously be smaller, but it would allow for a more interesting and involved universe.
'Missions' seem a bit contradictory to the slaving/pirating thing to me, but do you think it will be too bland without?
What do you look for in the meta-game? More Aurora-style number crunching or more RPing?
Should the player be completely alone or be able to side with a faction more closely?
Overall, how much survival-sim do you want? I can add in food, fuel and all that, but it might just become a distraction from the joys of slaving.


I'll post more as I go along, and I'll post a basic simulation of battle sometime later today. Let me know your thoughts!

[Retropunch]

So I've uploaded a non-playable simulated version of a very average battle between two capital ships (it's HTML5 so you can browser it!). Whilst this is pretty early compared to what I've got now, it's probably the best in terms of being able to actually watch stuff happen as at the moment the balance is so hideously off that its over in seconds.

Let me know what you think!

http://retropunch.itch.io/ascreaminspace

[Antsan]

Seems interesting, although the fight seems to drag out quite a lot. There's two of the long ships circling on the big ship in the bottom left and they don't seem to manage to finally destroy the green player.

[Calidovi]

I like the darker style that doesn't try too hard to encompass the entirety of space, instead just focusing on the here and now. That style sets the tone for this game of cruelty.
As for combat, visually it wasn't very interesting. I saw two ships, triangles flying at each other (excuse my poor vision, I think those are triangles).

As for the questions you posed in the OP:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

I prefer a hand-crafted universe. I honestly feel like random generation is a gimmick for many games and until you can reach a point where a random universe is both immersive and viable, you should stick with a deep, cultured setting.

I am for missions, as when the only objectives are good maintenance and surviving the occasional run with the law and pirates, the universe doesn't seem like a living universe.

To answer the number-crunching vs. RP question, I'd first like to know how you plan to do RP.

I think factions are good, but joining a non-slave-trading faction doesn't seem sensible. I'm for favors and quests, though.

As far as maintenance goes, just do generator power and food like you said. (However, why not burn slaves for generator power and eat them for food?).

[Retropunch]

Thanks for the feedback - what I uploaded was really just a taster of what combat looks like (I could have really just made a gif I suppose) - there's no way for the player/enemies to destroy the other completely at the moment so that I can test things out. These are also just place holder sprites which should be replaced shortly!

@Laptisen:

I prefer a hand-crafted universe. I honestly feel like random generation is a gimmick for many games and until you can reach a point where a random universe is both immersive and viable, you should stick with a deep, cultured setting.

Agreed - I'm moving further and further away from random gen. I might try to do a mix - a number of main systems and then a number of more randomised areas to keep things a bit fresher.

I am for missions, as when the only objectives are good maintenance and surviving the occasional run with the law and pirates, the universe doesn't seem like a living universe.

What sort of missions do you think would work? I'm against doing anything even remotely 'fetch-quest' like or similar as I just don't think it fits.

To answer the number-crunching vs. RP question, I'd first like to know how you plan to do RP.

I should have clarified this - I was meaning should it be more number/stats heavy or more obfuscated.

I think factions are good, but joining a non-slave-trading faction doesn't seem sensible. I'm for favors and quests, though.

As far as maintenance goes, just do generator power and food like you said. (However, why not burn slaves for generator power and eat them for food?).

Good feedback, and I definitely agree with not joining non-slave-traders.







 

[Graknorke]

The world needs more macromanagement oriented strategy in games. I approve.

[Calidovi]

-snip-

For the missions, I'm honestly not sure. I was thinking something along the lines of how you gain influence with city-states in Civ to function as side quests. In Civ, there are multiple city-states with different ideals and personalities. For example, some city states might want you to connect your trade network with them to increase their mercantile status, some may want you to harass another city-state to gain more power, and some might be pursuing their own goals and need you to process something or develop a technology. If you want more detail on that, just look up Civ city-states and read through the wiki article.

As for main quests, I'm feeling that delivery, smuggling, and messing with faction politics are the most realistic goals for a slave trader, but I'm not sure how 'fun' those first two would be.

As for the RP v. algorithm thing, I think you should have weapons and probabilities to have a set chance, which is then modified slightly by a sort of chance system. For example, a certain missile should do 300 damage to the engines if it's a direct hit, but the actual damage could range from 250 - 350. This possible variation is due to random chances that could happen (e.g. "The fuselage burst in the impact, damaging the craft further!" or  "The missile's warhead was fast to explode, lessening the force of the blow!) Of course this number could be further modified by slave skills or whatnot, but that's your decision for the depth of this game.

[dorf]

PTW

[Retropunch]

-snip-

For the missions, I'm honestly not sure. I was thinking something along the lines of how you gain influence with city-states in Civ to function as side quests. In Civ, there are multiple city-states with different ideals and personalities. For example, some city states might want you to connect your trade network with them to increase their mercantile status, some may want you to harass another city-state to gain more power, and some might be pursuing their own goals and need you to process something or develop a technology. If you want more detail on that, just look up Civ city-states and read through the wiki article.

As for main quests, I'm feeling that delivery, smuggling, and messing with faction politics are the most realistic goals for a slave trader, but I'm not sure how 'fun' those first two would be.

Yeah I was thinking that the missions could only really be harassing other factions, as well as perhaps some sort of smuggling. I've decided to not bother with proper missions for the time being (although they'll be easier to add later) and instead will just expand on the 'random events' that occur, plus making survival more interesting.

As for the RP v. algorithm thing, I think you should have weapons and probabilities to have a set chance, which is then modified slightly by a sort of chance system. For example, a certain missile should do 300 damage to the engines if it's a direct hit, but the actual damage could range from 250 - 350. This possible variation is due to random chances that could happen (e.g. "The fuselage burst in the impact, damaging the craft further!" or  "The missile's warhead was fast to explode, lessening the force of the blow!) Of course this number could be further modified by slave skills or whatnot, but that's your decision for the depth of this game.

This already happens quite a bit - weapon accuracy and damage are all within parameters with modifiers for morale. I suppose it's really just if these numbers should be easily accessible to the player or if it'd be fine to have them more hidden. For instance, DCSS has a lot of the internal stats hidden, whilst some games have everything from DPS to accuracy against different types of monsters clearly numbered. I'd prefer the first, but if people were really against it then I'd show them all.

[Calidovi]

-snip-

For the missions, I'm honestly not sure. I was thinking something along the lines of how you gain influence with city-states in Civ to function as side quests. In Civ, there are multiple city-states with different ideals and personalities. For example, some city states might want you to connect your trade network with them to increase their mercantile status, some may want you to harass another city-state to gain more power, and some might be pursuing their own goals and need you to process something or develop a technology. If you want more detail on that, just look up Civ city-states and read through the wiki article.

As for main quests, I'm feeling that delivery, smuggling, and messing with faction politics are the most realistic goals for a slave trader, but I'm not sure how 'fun' those first two would be.

Yeah I was thinking that the missions could only really be harassing other factions, as well as perhaps some sort of smuggling. I've decided to not bother with proper missions for the time being (although they'll be easier to add later) and instead will just expand on the 'random events' that occur, plus making survival more interesting.

As for the RP v. algorithm thing, I think you should have weapons and probabilities to have a set chance, which is then modified slightly by a sort of chance system. For example, a certain missile should do 300 damage to the engines if it's a direct hit, but the actual damage could range from 250 - 350. This possible variation is due to random chances that could happen (e.g. "The fuselage burst in the impact, damaging the craft further!" or  "The missile's warhead was fast to explode, lessening the force of the blow!) Of course this number could be further modified by slave skills or whatnot, but that's your decision for the depth of this game.

This already happens quite a bit - weapon accuracy and damage are all within parameters with modifiers for morale. I suppose it's really just if these numbers should be easily accessible to the player or if it'd be fine to have them more hidden. For instance, DCSS has a lot of the internal stats hidden, whilst some games have everything from DPS to accuracy against different types of monsters clearly numbered. I'd prefer the first, but if people were really against it then I'd show them all.

I agree with the first part and I argue that the last part is up to your discretion.

[Retropunch]

FOCUS!
So today I've been working on different 'focuses' that you can be in. As I mentioned in the first post, a big part of the game is the 'macro' rather than the micro. You can only control things at a 'commander' level, not at a 'godlike' level.

In combat, this means giving the player broad controls that give a range of buffs and debuffs, as well as some broad control options.

Currently, you have 6 'focuses' which are as follows:
Balanced - the default, which gives a good spread of everything.
Weapon Focus - Increase weapon speed, at the cost of production speed and manufacturing.
Fighter Focus - Increase fighter manufacturing and producing at the cost of bombers.
Bomber Focus - Increase bomber manufacturing and producing at the cost of fighters.
Overdrive - Increase engine and energy replenishment, at the cost of weapons, fighter and bomber production.
Sacrifice - You drug your slaves and crew for increased weapon speed, engine power and energy replenishment, this kills a number at the end of the battle.

These are rather simple, but they're not something you should be constantly tweaking - you might change these two to three times a battle, and will probably only use Sacrifice as a last ditch effort.

There will be a number of actions as well. These are tentatively as follows:
Retrofit bombers - This changes a number of bombers into fighters, as well as gives you some energy.
Retrofit fighters - This changes a number of fighters into bombers and slows down energy replenishment.
Execute - Execute a capital ship officer for improved morale.

I'd like to get more of these in, but I'm struggling to think of good ideas.

A number of targeting options also exist:
Target closest - Sets the 'main target' to the closest 'big targets' (frigates, destroyers, carriers).
Target dangerous - Targets the biggest/most dangerous target.
Target enemy capital - targets the enemy capital ship/space station.
Fighter screen - fighters protect the capital ship
Bomber rush - bombers go directly for the target without any evasive actions.

This is broadly as close to targeting options as I want to get. I had originally not wanted to have any, but I thought that would get a bit frustrating.

Please let me know your thoughts and if you have any new ideas? I'll be uploading this version (again, without any of the meta stuff, and only in cap on cap battle) shortly.

[Calidovi]

FOCUS!
So today I've been working on different 'focuses' that you can be in. As I mentioned in the first post, a big part of the game is the 'macro' rather than the micro. You can only control things at a 'commander' level, not at a 'godlike' level.

In combat, this means giving the player broad controls that give a range of buffs and debuffs, as well as some broad control options.

Currently, you have 6 'focuses' which are as follows:
Balanced - the default, which gives a good spread of everything.
Weapon Focus - Increase weapon speed, at the cost of production speed and manufacturing.
Fighter Focus - Increase fighter manufacturing and producing at the cost of bombers.
Bomber Focus - Increase bomber manufacturing and producing at the cost of fighters.
Overdrive - Increase engine and energy replenishment, at the cost of weapons, fighter and bomber production.
Sacrifice - You drug your slaves and crew for increased weapon speed, engine power and energy replenishment, this kills a number at the end of the battle.

These are rather simple, but they're not something you should be constantly tweaking - you might change these two to three times a battle, and will probably only use Sacrifice as a last ditch effort.

There will be a number of actions as well. These are tentatively as follows:
Retrofit bombers - This changes a number of bombers into fighters, as well as gives you some energy.
Retrofit fighters - This changes a number of fighters into bombers and slows down energy replenishment.
Execute - Execute a capital ship officer for improved morale.

I'd like to get more of these in, but I'm struggling to think of good ideas.

A number of targeting options also exist:
Target closest - Sets the 'main target' to the closest 'big targets' (frigates, destroyers, carriers).
Target dangerous - Targets the biggest/most dangerous target.
Target enemy capital - targets the enemy capital ship/space station.
Fighter screen - fighters protect the capital ship
Bomber rush - bombers go directly for the target without any evasive actions.

This is broadly as close to targeting options as I want to get. I had originally not wanted to have any, but I thought that would get a bit frustrating.

Please let me know your thoughts and if you have any new ideas? I'll be uploading this version (again, without any of the meta stuff, and only in cap on cap battle) shortly.

So are these 'controls' performed at the expense of morale (Other than the execution, of course)? And how powerful with this morale be?

[forsaken1111]

ptw because nice

[Antsan]

I have this idea that you can select officers for ships, where officers have different character traits which make them act differently.

[Retropunch]

I have this idea that you can select officers for ships, where officers have different character traits which make them act differently.

I thought about that, as I love that kind of thing in other games (endless space for instance) however I'm unsure how to implement it at the moment.

For something like this to work you need to have some sort of attachment to the officers (more than just minor stat. boosts), and I can't see of a good way of implementing that properly at the moment, as you've got so many officers who are all disposable and die often.
You start with roughly 30 officers, and if a frigate goes down you lose 2, and you can lose some on critical damage to the capital ship. You also can end up executing a few to give a temporary boost to everything. I toyed around with making them a lot less rare and having a bigger impact if they died, but a freak run of two frigates getting blown up plus a crit strike on the capship caused a huge drop in morale.

If I was to implement this I might have captains who are a lot less disposable (and only on destroyers and carriers) but I'll need to implement the bigger ships first.