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Author Topic: X-Com Chimera Squad  (Read 733855 times)

MetalSlimeHunt

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Re: X-Com 2: Et Elegit Sanguis Infectus
« Reply #6420 on: June 16, 2017, 07:46:37 pm »

It's a shame, because the tone of X-Com 2 should be obvious, and was nailed by a fan trailer: foreign to our own homeworld. Erasing the human from humanity, and such.

It's something that's harder to nail down with little things or with only being able to look at missions. The ultimate goal to not use humanity as slaves but literally kill us all to create Avatars is also a problem for it. They have no reason to oppose human-ness, since we'll all be dead instead of a slave race like the others.

If there does end up being an X-Com 3, I'm afraid for it. I want to say there is no way they'd try to "reset" again and do the same formula, but they did do it once, and quite literally. This is especially an issue as X-Com 3 could be great as an Earth vs. the Galaxy game. You saved the homeworld, good job, now there's only a hundred billion stars left.

So your small force becomes Earth instead of X-Com, and your large force becomes the Alien Empires. Galaxyscape instead of Geoscape, space combat instead of air combat. You can't really take down the whole alien empires, and that isn't your actual goal either. Your goal is to carve out a place for humanity that can survive.

Start off incredibly bleak - maybe the Ethereals are the largest force or maybe they are not, but everyone is hostile to humanity because of how weak we are. You have to establish a human region of space, you have to fight off alien incursions, you have to destabilize some empires and make lasting peace with others. X-Com remains what it is, a special forces group that strikes at critical targets to make this all happen.

It'd be a fairly different game than what we're used to but that's fine, progression is what the story needs.

More likely they'll just reset again, but hopefully that takes the form of something like "the extradimensional nightmare machines the Ethereals are running from are here and they're hungry, of course your tech isn't enough it wasn't enough for the Ethereals either".
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EnigmaticHat

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Re: X-Com 2: Et Elegit Sanguis Infectus
« Reply #6421 on: June 16, 2017, 09:54:44 pm »

They should team up with the EDF developers.  X-com: Earth Defense Force: Shadow of UFO Defense 3.1.  You rebuilt Earth, now the aliens are back... and fifty times their original size!  All voice lines written by Firaxis, then translated into Japanese by the EDF developers, then translated back into English by a third party team given an intentionally small budget.
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"T-take this non-euclidean geometry, h-humanity-baka. I m-made it, but not because I l-li-l-like you or anything! I just felt s-sorry for you, b-baka."
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TheDarkStar

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Re: X-Com 2: Et Elegit Sanguis Infectus
« Reply #6422 on: June 16, 2017, 10:02:34 pm »

I guess I wouldn't mind seeing an actual grimdark XCOM. And honestly, I'd like to see one where losing battles or retreating is OK and happens a decent amount of the time. It just seems odd that storywise XCOM manages to win almost every battle they fight - sometimes, it should make more sense to run away rather than reload the mission for the third time to get another perfect battle. Or at least have a mission where accomplishing the objective doesn't necessarily mean that anyone survives (for example, retrieving/destroying some vital thing but losing all your soldiers before they can get out; think Rogue One).
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MetalSlimeHunt

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Re: X-Com 2: Et Elegit Sanguis Infectus
« Reply #6423 on: June 16, 2017, 10:05:21 pm »

That's more of a standard set up by Firaxis-Com's solider standards - soldiers are both decently expensive and invaluable when experienced. A squad full of kitted out rookies will get wiped on a late game mission because they lack abilities.

There's not that great of a solution for it without completely reworking the tactical model. You could make rookies cost peanuts, but that wouldn't solve the issue of experienced soldiers being worth more than all the rooks put together. The abilities are what make the biggest difference, even bigger than tech.
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Neonivek

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Re: X-Com 2: Et Elegit Sanguis Infectus
« Reply #6424 on: June 16, 2017, 10:08:24 pm »

That's more of a standard set up by Firaxis-Com's solider standards - soldiers are both decently expensive and invaluable when experienced. A squad full of kitted out rookies will get wiped on a late game mission because they lack abilities.

There's not that great of a solution for it without completely reworking the tactical model. You could make rookies cost peanuts, but that wouldn't solve the issue of experienced soldiers being worth more than all the rooks put together. The abilities are what make the biggest difference, even bigger than tech.

Xcom 1 had a bounce back mechanic where the later in the game you were the more experienced soldiers would join due to missions and as rewards.
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MetalSlimeHunt

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Re: X-Com 2: Et Elegit Sanguis Infectus
« Reply #6425 on: June 16, 2017, 10:10:52 pm »

Speaking as someone who had more than a couple of games of EW enter the meatgrinder and never leave due to a squad wipe, it's not even close to being strong enough.

I'm sure there is a desperation mechanic of some kind that would work for this...
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Neonivek

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Re: X-Com 2: Et Elegit Sanguis Infectus
« Reply #6426 on: June 16, 2017, 10:13:08 pm »

If ONLY we had some sort of place where we could slowly increase the level ceiling.
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EnigmaticHat

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Re: X-Com 2: Et Elegit Sanguis Infectus
« Reply #6427 on: June 16, 2017, 10:16:12 pm »

If we're going to go full Shadow of Mordor about this and have named aliens that level up, might as well just make it so BOTH sides are much more likely to survive a battle.  No idea how they would go about doing that.  In Shadow of Morder its just like "oh you THOUGHT that guy was dead, nah bro he has an eyepatch now and he's a badass."  That would be one way to do it, they'd have to be careful to keep it from being one more rage-inducing dice roll.
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"T-take this non-euclidean geometry, h-humanity-baka. I m-made it, but not because I l-li-l-like you or anything! I just felt s-sorry for you, b-baka."
You misspelled seance.  Are possessing Draignean?  Are you actually a ghost in the shell? You have to tell us if you are, that's the rule

Neonivek

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Re: X-Com 2: Et Elegit Sanguis Infectus
« Reply #6428 on: June 16, 2017, 10:22:16 pm »

If we're going to go full Shadow of Mordor about this and have named aliens that level up, might as well just make it so BOTH sides are much more likely to survive a battle.  No idea how they would go about doing that.  In Shadow of Morder its just like "oh you THOUGHT that guy was dead, nah bro he has an eyepatch now and he's a badass."  That would be one way to do it, they'd have to be careful to keep it from being one more rage-inducing dice roll.

Yes they already have that. You need to kiss the three faction's butts... You need to kiss their butts passionately KEEP KISSING THEM!!!

So that they will bestow upon you their Super Heroes who are 10 times better than your soldiers.

So they fixed it by making everyone else not matter as much.
« Last Edit: June 16, 2017, 10:25:53 pm by Neonivek »
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MetalSlimeHunt

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Re: X-Com 2: Et Elegit Sanguis Infectus
« Reply #6429 on: June 16, 2017, 10:24:57 pm »

If we're going to go full Shadow of Mordor about this and have named aliens that level up, might as well just make it so BOTH sides are much more likely to survive a battle.  No idea how they would go about doing that.  In Shadow of Morder its just like "oh you THOUGHT that guy was dead, nah bro he has an eyepatch now and he's a badass."  That would be one way to do it, they'd have to be careful to keep it from being one more rage-inducing dice roll.
If you were to do that, a version of this Ruler and Chosen system we're getting seems functional. Do some damage to the alien, they use Gate and leave the battle. Obvious survival. Do a lot of damage to the alien, they get downed like an X-Com solider. Either they'll Gate out or you'll confirm the kill. Say the Gate is automatic if the mission ends. If they Gate out after being crit, they get modified for next time, which could leave them out of action for a while. If you confirm the kill, they die and you get the body to study and such.

No uncertainty, outcome based on player performance. Critically wounded X-Com soldiers could become unusable until you've put them through cybernetic enhancement.
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Quote from: Thomas Paine
To argue with a man who has renounced the use and authority of reason, and whose philosophy consists in holding humanity in contempt, is like administering medicine to the dead, or endeavoring to convert an atheist by scripture.
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Egan_BW

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Re: X-Com 2: Et Elegit Sanguis Infectus
« Reply #6430 on: June 16, 2017, 10:39:41 pm »

Please please please let me put critically wounded soldiers' brains in Shivs.
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Strife26

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Re: X-Com 2: Et Elegit Sanguis Infectus
« Reply #6431 on: June 16, 2017, 10:43:59 pm »

Please please please let me put critically wounded soldiers' brains in Shivs.

I'd rather the triumphant return of mecs.
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EnigmaticHat

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Re: X-Com 2: Et Elegit Sanguis Infectus
« Reply #6432 on: June 16, 2017, 10:46:46 pm »

Please please please let me put critically wounded soldiers' brains in Shivs.
"So now you Xcom fools send brainless machines against me!"

"Not brainless."

"That voice... no... I killed you.  I watched you die!"

*sounds of autocannon and gore*
« Last Edit: June 16, 2017, 10:50:52 pm by EnigmaticHat »
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"T-take this non-euclidean geometry, h-humanity-baka. I m-made it, but not because I l-li-l-like you or anything! I just felt s-sorry for you, b-baka."
You misspelled seance.  Are possessing Draignean?  Are you actually a ghost in the shell? You have to tell us if you are, that's the rule

Egan_BW

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Re: X-Com 2: Et Elegit Sanguis Infectus
« Reply #6433 on: June 16, 2017, 10:49:44 pm »

EVEN IN DEATH, I SERVE. VIGILO CONFIDO.
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Neonivek

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Re: X-Com 2: Et Elegit Sanguis Infectus
« Reply #6434 on: June 16, 2017, 11:12:39 pm »

Please please please let me put critically wounded soldiers' brains in Shivs.

No that would be cool. We decided to stop doing cool things after Enemy Within.
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