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[Rolan7]

Actually yeah!  I really did enjoy NewCOM 1 Long War, on normal (or easy?) for that reason.  It opens up the squad size a lot, and gives you tools to deal with things.
I only played the early game, I think, but it did feel a lot like OldCOM 1 but with a better interface and many more options.

[Retropunch]

Yeah, LW1 basically made it possible to have a bit more of a 'war' rather than a series of successful (or not) skirmishes. Wasn't perfect, but I'm hoping LW2 ups the ante in that regard.

As an aside, I'm sure it's been mentioned, but X-piratez (http://openxcom.org/forum/index.php?topic=3626.0) is a fantastic mod for Old-com, and any fans of the genre should play it immediately. It's basically X-com, but with post-apocalyptic pirates instead. Ignore the lame and overly sexualised graphics (some of it is NSFW), and it's an incredible strat/tact game. It's got the XCOM2 'guerrilla' style fighting down 100% which they never managed in XCOM2, and there's a lot of depth behind it on a strategic level. 

I've probably gone back to that more than pretty much any X-com game - read a few reviews and you'll get the picture. One thing to note, there's a sort of 'notoriety' system, read up on it before playing or you'll probably hit a random end-game out of the blue. You basically have to balance keeping up your notoriety without attracting too much attention to yourself - easy enough to do but difficult to work it out on your own. (I won't spoiler any more, for those who want to play spoiler freee)

[Neonivek]

Do they do what Xcom 2 is too afraid to do and let you play the terrorist?

[Rolan7]

I wish man, but I doubt it ):

TBF they do let you wreck civ buildings and occasionally kill (or capture/interrogate) corroborators.
But yeah basically I'm with you, very disappointed that XCOM 2 is the very nicest terrorists who ever did terrorize.  Basically not terrorists at all.

[scrdest]

I wish man, but I doubt it ):

TBF they do let you wreck civ buildings and occasionally kill (or capture/interrogate) corroborators.
But yeah basically I'm with you, very disappointed that XCOM 2 is the very nicest terrorists who ever did terrorize.  Basically not terrorists at all.

Yeah but assassination is not worth it in 100% of the cases. Literally 100%, unless you're tactically in a 'FUCK, WE NEED TO LEAVE, NOW' situation and you're just cutting losses.

But hell, what's just an inexcusable oversight is not giving you non-quest X4s so you could have the option to open your ambush a bit more... dramatically.

[EnigmaticHat]

In a winning C/I campaign I once had all but one of the squad end up a couple tiles away from extracting in a dark VIP mission.  Still ended up a nominal victory because one of my rangers shotgunned the VIP and the other one escaped.

Two of the five captured squad members were eventually rescued.  Even tho they were once my best and brightest by the time they were extracted they were too low level to be anything more than support.

[forsaken1111]

I wish man, but I doubt it ):

TBF they do let you wreck civ buildings and occasionally kill (or capture/interrogate) corroborators.
But yeah basically I'm with you, very disappointed that XCOM 2 is the very nicest terrorists who ever did terrorize.  Basically not terrorists at all.

Yeah but assassination is not worth it in 100% of the cases. Literally 100%, unless you're tactically in a 'FUCK, WE NEED TO LEAVE, NOW' situation and you're just cutting losses.

But hell, what's just an inexcusable oversight is not giving you non-quest X4s so you could have the option to open your ambush a bit more... dramatically.

I miss oldcom breaching UFOs with explosives

[Twinwolf]

I mean, you still can
Rockets and grenades can take down a wall

[Chiefwaffles]

If anything, it's easier to breach UFOs in both XCOM 1 and 2. UFO Defense had the super-tough UFO walls, didn't it? While both XCOM 1 and 2 have the UFO walls made out of plastic that can be easily blown up with just about anything.

[GiglameshDespair]

Do they do what Xcom 2 is too afraid to do and let you play the terrorist?

I'm sure using the elite operatives of X-Com to bomb a marketplace would be helpful because...?

Why would xcom engage in petty terrorism? It wouldn't help them any.

If anything, it's easier to breach UFOs in both XCOM 1 and 2. UFO Defense had the super-tough UFO walls, didn't it? While both XCOM 1 and 2 have the UFO walls made out of plastic that can be easily blown up with just about anything.

Yeah, for UFO defence you pretty much needed blaster bombs or heavy plasma to destroy ufo walls, both of which were more lategame weapons.

[Rolan7]

Or high explosive, I think...  Actually I'll check.
Yeah, UFO outer walls have 100 armor and HE had 110.  So HE could penetrate it, but (IIRC) it was chancy.  And that stuff was heavy and had a pretty big blast radius, so it was rather awkward to actually use.  Despite the nice adjustable timer all explosives had.

There was a bug where explosions would pierce through angles, too.  Pretty sure I once killed an alien in an UFO that way and didn't question it, heheh.

I think the XcomUtil mod significantly buffed heavy lasers to where they could at least pierce interior UFO walls, which were significantly weaker.  Heavy lasers were mostly useless in the base game.

Well, everything but heavy plasma was mostly useless.  Late game my butt.  Total non-choice, with abundant recovered ammo.  I tended to use lasers but mostly to freely spray-and-pray, and rip through cover.  Infinite ammo, ya?

[NullForceOmega]

Laser rifle is the best sniper weapon of UFO Defense by far, nearly unlimited range and ammo, and low TU cost on top of that, not to mention the maxed out accuracy?  A squad of decent accuracy veterans could one-shot almost everything in the game, even Mutons.

[TempAcc]

To be honest I kinda want a newcom game based more on apocalypse. I actualy really liked apocalypse, even if they never managed to implement everything they wanted to. Running xcom in that game felt different, you could essentialy do your own terror missions against the cult of sirius and other enemy factions, etc.

They'll prob be going more in the way of terror from the deep, going from what the ending of newcom 2 has shown us, though.

[Egan_BW]

Infinite ammo, ya?

* Points at bandanna.

Just in case anyone was wondering, Long War 2 is not going to be a paid expansion, Pavonis' website calls it a "free mod".

[Rolan7]

Do they do what Xcom 2 is too afraid to do and let you play the terrorist?

I'm sure using the elite operatives of X-Com to bomb a marketplace would be helpful because...?

Why would xcom engage in petty terrorism? It wouldn't help them any.

I typed for a while about how convenient it is that every region has a resistance force just waiting for you, but deleted it.  That's actually very reasonable, particularly considering the size of the zones.  It's only been what, 30 years, and people are disappearing.  Despite all the propaganda, there would be resistance, particularly in the boonies - which is literally what the game tells us.

Still...  I was hoping for some sort of morality debate, I guess.  There isn't any.  We're still unquestionably good.  While we may be desperate, there's no benefit in bending morals.

NewCOM 1 Enemy Within actually did that better, when we started amputating people (not even wounded!) and injecting alien nanites into others.  And were opposed by a human force of semi-plainclothes humans, even if they were zealous extremists.  XCOM was seriously doing WHATEVER it took to win the war. 

Spoiler: Alien Hunters (click to show/hide)

That sorta comes across in Alien Hunters, but in the wrong way: "Wow, Vahlen went way too far with this shit!  Why did she do this?"
I haven't killed the third (Archon) ruler yet, but still...  The judgement is kinda telling.

This band of rebels in NewCOM 2 may have an impressive array of rebellious armor choices, but their morality is incredibly cut and dry.  Even more so than in NewCOM 1.  That's... fine, definitely, I just wish there was some question.  Some opportunity to go renegade.
Trailers always lie, but the trailer (which I think I literally watched a dozen times, and showed my family) promised a desperate rebel fight against an overwhelming enemy.

When I played the game, I experienced that... and lost... because it was just like NewCOM 1.  If you aren't winning all the time, you're losing and you're doomed.

Which is something Long War did a lot for in NewCOM 1.  I'm optimistic for it in NewCOM 2!

Infinite ammo, ya?

* Points at bandanna.

Snake... can love bloom on the battlefield?

To be honest I kinda want a newcom game based more on apocalypse. I actualy really liked apocalypse, even if they never managed to implement everything they wanted to. Running xcom in that game felt different, you could essentialy do your own terror missions against the cult of sirius and other enemy factions, etc.

THIS, SO MUCH