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[SOLDIER First]

Just don't use a ranged touch spell within threat range, or you get two AoO's against you: one for casting the spell and one for making the actual attack.

[Sirus]

I think my misunderstanding was thinking that the cast and the touch were a single standard action.

And yeah, I know about ranged touch spells. With those it makes *sense* to stay away from the baddies while casting

[Jimmy]

The Magus also gets a class ability that lets them cast a touch spell as part of their melee attack sequence. It's a popular option to add a Shocking Grasp spell onto your attack for an extra 5d6 damage.

[highmax28]

I think my misunderstanding was thinking that the cast and the touch were a single standard action.

And yeah, I know about ranged touch spells. With those it makes *sense* to stay away from the baddies while casting

That luxury is in 4e and beyond. Mind you, casting in 5e doesn't provoke Attacks of opportunity.

In other news, I found a copy of D&D Basic Rules Cyclopedia and I'm laughing at how weird this gets.

Why is wizardry a spell? Why can clerics only cast it? Why doesn't it show up in the spell list!? Why is ELF a class and can only level up to 10 when other classes level to 36? Why are clerics only able to heal at second level? Why are there only 3 alignments!?

It's random stuff like this that makes me laugh hysterically.

The goal is to study up on it and run a one off adventure wth my two groups of friends working together to try and get through the bullshit that is first edition.

[Tawa]

The "only three alignments" thing was always kinda confusing. On one hand it seems more morally grey because it cuts out the good-evil dichotomy, but on the other hand IIRC evil guys in published stuff tended to get slapped with "chaotic" regardless of their stance on the law.

[Rolan7]

I think my misunderstanding was thinking that the cast and the touch were a single standard action.

And yeah, I know about ranged touch spells. With those it makes *sense* to stay away from the baddies while casting

That luxury is in 4e and beyond. Mind you, casting in 5e doesn't provoke Attacks of opportunity.

Cast-move-touch is in at least 3.5e and beyond:  http://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/actionsInCombat.htm#touchSpellsinCombat

I don't think we even noticed that trick though, my cleric usually made the fairly generous concentration checks to "cast defensively" and avoid AoO.  Also tried to start fights with a held touch attack in addition to the standard buffs (thanks to high spot/listen we usually had a couple rounds).

[highmax28]

I think my misunderstanding was thinking that the cast and the touch were a single standard action.

And yeah, I know about ranged touch spells. With those it makes *sense* to stay away from the baddies while casting

That luxury is in 4e and beyond. Mind you, casting in 5e doesn't provoke Attacks of opportunity.

Cast-move-touch is in at least 3.5e and beyond:  http://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/actionsInCombat.htm#touchSpellsinCombat

I don't think we even noticed that trick though, my cleric usually made the fairly generous concentration checks to "cast defensively" and avoid AoO.  Also tried to start fights with a held touch attack in addition to the standard buffs (thanks to high spot/listen we usually had a couple rounds).

Not cast-move-touch, the cast and touch was one action and only provoked AoO once. Plus, aren't AoO only once per round unless you have a feat?

[Sirus]

I dunno, that link disagrees:

Many spells have a range of touch. To use these spells, you cast the spell and then touch the subject, either in the same round or any time later. In the same round that you cast the spell, you may also touch (or attempt to touch) the target. You may take your move before casting the spell, after touching the target, or between casting the spell and touching the target. You can automatically touch one friend or use the spell on yourself, but to touch an opponent, you must succeed on an attack roll.

[Rolan7]

[ninja'd]
I was afraid I was misunderstanding, I used to play a lot of 3.5e but not as much recently (NWoD), phew.

You may take your move before casting the spell, after touching the target, or between casting the spell and touching the target.

And yeah, typical enemies can only take one AoO per round unless they have Combat Reflexes.


Unrelated but confusing, my group and I are currently considering 5th edition a bit.  We've heard good things, but turns out none of us have really gone into it since the alpha (and it turns out things have changed a bit from the alpha).  There's a lot of adjustment necessary, we're seeing.

But seriously, is it just us, or are humans pathetically bad?  +1 to every attribute seems pretty awful when the other classes get 2-3 points in important stats.  On top of lists of useful abilities.  Tieflings in particular seem OP as hell (hehe).

Halflings also seem to have gotten it bad...  Out of all the races, they chose the thief race to join humanity in not having darkvision?  Also they're "usually lawful good" lol.

There's a variant which gives humans back the skill bonus (proficiency) and feat, but I compared it to default half elves:
"They give up a second proficiency, +2 CHA, darkvision, immunity to sleep, and advantage vs charm...  for one feat"

On the other hand, attributes are apparently capped at 20 in most ways.  That sure is weird.  I guess that makes it less important to beeline your important stats, since they'll just cap out from the copious attribute points from levelling.  And from feats!?  It's so weird...  Would appreciate help migrating from 3.5e.

[Dorsidwarf]

Yeah 5e really doesn't have the stat ballooning of earlier editions, ACs don't skyrocket as high as you'd expect, and even weak enemies can be a surprisingly dangerous threat to all but the highest levelled characters. I know our level 6 party got totally fucked by a gang of level 1 kobolds who used the deadly tactic of "standing where we couldn't get us and making ten times as many attacks into the party as the party made out at them. Once casters start getting serious AOE that goes away a bit though

[Neonivek]

Which is kind of one reason I love 5e. The entire monster manual is useful to you pretty much no matter what level your characters are at (well... ok a monster can be TOO powerful).

You don't have to turn them into Troops or Swarms (and if you do, it is for the unique effect they would have).

Or rather... Armies in 5e are armies. I know people don't like that, but in terms of handling threat and the flow of gameplay it is preferable.

[highmax28]

5e seems to be the amalgamate of 1st edition, 3.5 and 4e. And personally, I really like it. I just think more content should be put in if you're only using the PHB. I reccomend looking for a copy of Volo's Guide to Monsters, Sword Coast Adventure Guide, and Elemental Evil handbooks, or at least the material for players covered in it, as well as looking into the unearthed arcana (but be VERY careful of the material there. Some of it is unbalanced).

The game feels simple enough to hop right in but complex enough to have players feel like they have full control and aren't stuck with certain abilities or whatnot.

Feats are only given at 4th level, which they can get in place of the +1 to two scores or +2 to one score. I actually prefer the feats myself; they're very much worth it. And with many of the feats actually are multiple feats in one, it really seems better

As someone who plays nothing BUT humans, I actually find the human default to be actually pretty good. It may not be a fact of "get better with your prime requisite" but more "everything gets a little better". And that +1 can turn your +2 modifier to a +3, or get you enough push to have you get there at level 4 through a feat or the +1/+2. I actually turned a pretty "meh" human wizard into one who's pretty decent thanks to that +1 to all. It made him have +2 to dex, +1 to strength, +1 to con and +4 to int, all thanks to carefully distributed scores.

I reccomend giving it a try. I do suggest that whoever DM's should study up though. I got sucker punched by how OP the barbarian is at early game against the generic level 1 enemies, and how amazing a potion of giant's strength of any level is when you're a melee warrior

[Dorsidwarf]

Yeah the barbarian at low levels kicks immense ass when he only gets in a couple of fights a day, same with the Paladin and their limited pot of super deadly shit they only get a handful of pops a day.

[GiglameshDespair]

I really like 5e from my experiences with it. Much preferable to 3.5e, I'd say.

Base humans are a little underwhelming, but variant humans are pretty great.

[Criptfeind]

There's a variant which gives humans back the skill bonus (proficiency) and feat, but I compared it to default half elves:
"They give up a second proficiency, +2 CHA, darkvision, immunity to sleep, and advantage vs charm...  for one feat"

Feats are pretty rare. They are basically worth two stat points anyway (since that's what you need to pay to get one) and humans can get them quite a few levels before anyone else. Humans also don't really start any weaker for their +1s insteand of +2s, since 16=17 as far as most things go, which means humans are only weaker stat wise after the first attribute bonus (assuming the non human wouldn't have spent it on a feat.) where they'll be at +3 instead of +4 in their secondary attribute. Of course, humans are missing out on all the cool miscellaneous bonuses, but it could very well be worth it to get early access to some feat. Predicated on them actually having a feat they want of course.