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Any D&D/D20

Shadowrun

World of Darkness

Palladium

Other (feel free to post about it)

[UXLZ]

I was thinking more that I'd remove Insight as an "active" thing from the game. Whenever the party encountered someone whom it might affect, I'd roll their (highest?) Insight versus that guy's deception or something, and it would stick for the rest of the conversation. Something like this as a general example.

Stranger A walks up to PC, Stranger rolls 3, PC rolls 10.

"As the unknown man came towards you, a chill went down your spine. His face looked cheerful and kind enough, there was nothing wrong with what he was wearing, but... You could just feel it. You knew he was bad news."

Stranger A walks up to PC, Stranger rolls 10, PC rolls 3.

"Out of the corner of your eye you spot a jovial old man walking up to you, a smile on his face. He seems happy to see you. Perhaps he needs something?"

That sorta difference. 

I guess that would just overcomplicate things.

[Sirus]

So a question for you fine folks: Would it be theoretically possible for any number of low-level D&D characters (say, each level 4) to eventually triumph over some of the nastier monsters? Things like the tarrasque or great wyrms. My understanding is that such creatures are usually battled by groups of high-level, specially-kitted adventurers. I want to know if zerg rushing could ever succeed.

[UXLZ]

The Tarrasque is a bad example. It might say "Challenge Rating 30" but it is far, far weaker than that.

Also, yes, I'd wager ~30 level 5 adventurers could beat any solo "Big Bad" monster assuming it didn't blast them like crazy with AoE. Gated Accuracy and all that.

[scriver]

What edition, Sirus?

[Flying Dice]

Theoretically you could bring down the Tarrasque with a single casting of Ray of Stupidity, at the whopping cost of a second level spell slot. All you need is a way to overcome the SR. As a 5th level Wizard or Sorcerer you could have Spell Penetration and Greater Spell Penetration. Assume they're human and took Weapon Focus: Ray. Assume that they've also got 18 Dex.

So right there we've got a 5th level arcane caster. They've got: 1d20 + 3 to hit with that ray, for a range from 4-23 on their attack roll. Anything over 5 beats the Tarrasque's Touch AC, so any roll higher than 2 is a hit. The Tarrasque also has Spell Resistance 32, which is the big problem.

You've got +4 Spell Pen from feats. Assuming our caster is still 5th level, that means their roll to overcome is 1d20+9, for a maximum of 29, not good enough.

However, if they are 8th level, they get access to Assay Spell Resistance, which for our purposes amounts to an extra +10 to overcome SR on that crucial attack. At 8th level combined with that, we're up to 1d20+22 for the check to overcome, ranging from 23 to 42. A roll of 11 or higher succeeds. Bam. That's it.

All it takes to bring down the 3.5e Tarrasque is one properly-specced Wizard or Sorcerer with one 4th level spell, one 2nd level spell, one ludicrously low roll, and one slightly above average roll. Maybe a casting of Invisibility beforehand to get close enough. That one mid-level caster can encounter-kill the Tarrasque thanks to a broken spell and the beastie's 3 Int. As long as they've brought along a crowd to beat on the unconscious Tarrasque with an endless series of coup de grace attacks, which are all automatic hits and confirmed criticals. If you've got even a single martial character capable of dishing out damage in the mid-40s, every round is a potential instant death if the Tarrasque fails the Fort save.

disclaimer: it's 6:14 AM and I have no idea how stupid I am right now. But yes, theoretically you could kill the Tarrasque with one 8th level caster and a mob of Commoners with daggers and clubs. If you roll a 1 on the d4, it'll take a second casting of the ray.

[UXLZ]

You need Wish to actually kill it as far as I remember, but yes, you can defeat it like that.

Here's another method.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

[Neonivek]

Immune to that spell.

There are spells that can trump the Tarresque but that isn't one of them.

[Sirus]

What edition, Sirus?

Call it 3.5. I'm guessing it's what Flying Dice was working off of, and it's the only edition I have easy access to monster stats for anyway.

@Flying Dice: See, this is why I ask the experts
I was knocking an idea around in my head for a one-shot "campaign" in which a Big Bad monster is approaching a city and the only available defenders are fairly low-leveled. My hope was that the verdict would be "doable, but difficult and at the cost of many characters' lives". I went with the tarrasque because I was under the impression that it was a potentially world-ending beastie.

So if the tarrasque can be so easily brought down, what might be a better candidate?

[scriver]

A continent-sized Nishruu.

[Twinwolf]

I was knocking an idea around in my head for a one-shot "campaign" in which a Big Bad monster is approaching a city and the only available defenders are fairly low-leveled. My hope was that the verdict would be "doable, but difficult and at the cost of many characters' lives".

I hope not to much effort needs to be put into character creation?

[Bohandas]

The tarrasque has immunity to rays as an extraordinary ability.

Carapace (Ex)

The tarrasque’s armorlike carapace is exceptionally tough and highly reflective, deflecting all rays, lines, cones, and even magic missile spells. There is a 30% chance of reflecting any such effect back at the caster; otherwise, it is merely negated. Check for reflection before rolling to overcome the creature’s spell resistance.

[flabort]

I was knocking an idea around in my head for a one-shot "campaign" in which a Big Bad monster is approaching a city and the only available defenders are fairly low-leveled. My hope was that the verdict would be "doable, but difficult and at the cost of many characters' lives". I went with the tarrasque because I was under the impression that it was a potentially world-ending beastie.

So if the tarrasque can be so easily brought down, what might be a better candidate?

I sent you an idea for it by PM. I think it fits your criteria nicely. You may share it if you wish, or if you wish to keep it to yourself to spring on your players you can. That's why I sent it via PM.

For those of you wondering: It's just using the "increase a creature's hit dice" and refluffing a creature rules.

[Bohandas]

The tarasque can also be defeated by having the cleric convince it to convert it to their religion.

[scriver]

Better not be a cleric of Tempus or Garagos.

[Neonivek]

Found out that you give Trap EXP pretty much if the party knows it exists.

There is something that doesn't sit right with me for someone getting exp because they tripped a landmine but I guess I can't really complain.