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Any D&D/D20

Shadowrun

World of Darkness

Palladium

Other (feel free to post about it)

[Neonivek]

Definitely Old World of Darkness where they weren't evil or really fallen.

Basically Demons are robots who eventually learned morality and broke off from their mother machine and made human bodies for them to live in. With their ultimate goal to create their own pocket dimensions for them to live in which CAN be a hell but doesn't have to be.

Which is where I am kind of like "They aren't really demons" with the books REALLY stretching and pushing themselves to go "No really guys they are totally demons!".

Which don't get me wrong they are probably one of the most interesting and unique Race in World of Darkness (both new and old) and I realize they needed the brand recognition... But yeah I just chose to completely forget they are demons altogether, that information isn't all that accurate or helpful anyhow.

Sounds like New World of Darkness handles my issue... but makes them blander as a result.

[Rolan7]

After a few hours trying to track down the thrall-to-be, we realized we left the elder's ghoul's corpse in the dumpster.  The Ventrue and my Mekhet went back to cover up the Gangrel's murder...

We get there and notice a bat in the car.  It's obviously a vampire.  "Are you Kayla?" *squeek*.  "Squeek twice if you're Kayla" *silence*
I use Auspex to read aura, but all I get is "hatred".

We're across the street from the crime scene (which is full of police now).  Bat hides under the seat.
Amanda decides to poke it with a stick.  Jake gets the fuck out of the car because we're pretty sure this is Kayla, and she is frenzying at the drop of a hat.  Jake doesn't even know the half of it, but still knows better than to poke the Gangrel with a stick.

The bat rolls an extraordinary grapple success, stealing the stick.  Jake cautions Amanda.  Amanda cranks the radio to max and puts on an Eminem CD, specifically cranking the bass "because bats have sensitive hearing".  JAKE SPRINTS THE HELL AWAY.  Then feels a little bad and returns to watch from around the corner of the Denny's.

seriously though...  Amanda already got nearly sliced in half by our out-of-control gangrel.  I'm not sure why she thought this was a good idea.

Oh hey the bat turned into a wolf and bit the radio in half, and now is chasing Amanda.  "Sorry for frenzying Kayla" says Amanda's player.  I'm pretty sure Amanda's totally screwed unless Jake or her roll very fortunately on a dominate roll...

Oh god Amanda just went into the denny's to order pancakes, with Kayla frenzying inside the car.  Ah, Kayla just tossed the radio straight through the windshield.  Fortunately she seems content to continue destroying the car with her teeth, for now.  Ooh, exceptional success tearing apart the seats...

Amanda:  "Ooh, I hope those pancakes arrive soon..."

So basically Kayla is mindless, and Amanda's player is mindless, and Jake and me and Kayla's player are just boggling vacantly at these shenanigans.

Edit:  Kayla's player keeps thinking up new parts of the car to savage, rather than go after Amanda.  Amanda is trying to mind control the waitress, and we have no idea why

[Amperzand]

You have an interesting player group, my friend. :V

[GiglameshDespair]

You fail to consider other reasons for why the villain would be restring time, or using a different plan every time, or not just killing the heroes outright, Gig.

Such as?
If the same few people are defeating you each time, they become the priority. That's basic logic. Presumably the big bad is capable of suceeding if the heroes do not intervene (else it would be rather pointless campaign all told) so as the main threat the protags need to be dealt with first, while they are both at their weakest and least on guard.

[highmax28]

Know what? I should ask this:

Thoughts on/build ideas for pathfinder's vigilante class that was released recently.

I found using enforcer, merciful weapons and having a high intimidate makes for some big damage, at the trade off of hitting everything non-lethally

[BlackFlyme]

There's a few Vigilante Talents that go well with that. You have to take the Avenger specialization for them though.

Fist of the Avenger gives Improved Unarmed Strike as a bonus feat, and adds bonus damage equal to half your level (maximum +5 damage) when using an unarmed attack or attacking with a gauntlet-type weapon. Another Talent, Sucker Punch, adds an additional 1d6 when attacking nonlethally, and adds another 1d6 at levels 6, 12, and 18.

Lethal Grace is also good. Can be taken by any Vigilante, and adds half your level to damage when using Weapon Finesse with a melee weapon, so long as you are using Dexterity for your to-hit chance and your Strength for damage. Paizo seems to want to reel in Dex-to-damage a bit.

Vigilante is cool, though it takes a certain type of campaign to really get much use out of the social abilities. Plus some people complain about how your Renown works. Even an Evil Socialite/Vigilante is still beloved in their area of renown, which some people dislike. Or how a Social Identity can be an absolute nobody, but still famous somehow.

[Neonivek]

I admit... if the Avenger Class would let me play Alkaizer... I'd have jumped right freeken on it!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EugQfuu1Y6Q

I kind of wish these games would have a cool action magic sword. But I guess with the spell system it is kind of impossible

I am just a sucker for big flashy moves but the Sorcerers and Mages got the cornerstone

[highmax28]

There's a few Vigilante Talents that go well with that. You have to take the Avenger specialization for them though.

Fist of the Avenger gives Improved Unarmed Strike as a bonus feat, and adds bonus damage equal to half your level (maximum +5 damage) when using an unarmed attack or attacking with a gauntlet-type weapon. Another Talent, Sucker Punch, adds an additional 1d6 when attacking nonlethally, and adds another 1d6 at levels 6, 12, and 18.

Lethal Grace is also good. Can be taken by any Vigilante, and adds half your level to damage when using Weapon Finesse with a melee weapon, so long as you are using Dexterity for your to-hit chance and your Strength for damage. Paizo seems to want to reel in Dex-to-damage a bit.

Vigilante is cool, though it takes a certain type of campaign to really get much use out of the social abilities. Plus some people complain about how your Renown works. Even an Evil Socialite/Vigilante is still beloved in their area of renown, which some people dislike. Or how a Social Identity can be an absolute nobody, but still famous somehow.

I managed to find ways to constantly use the bonus damage as a stalker avenger. While I don't get the heavy striker damage that the avenger vigilante gets, I get some nice abilities. Up Close and Personal is probably going to be my main source of damage being level 11. Plus, Twisting Fear is REALLY nasty with that bonus to intimidate Incredible Renown gives you, plus its even more insane when you add social grace to intimidate checks as well.

I also noticed that it mentions the social identity is SUPPOSED to be a merchant or noble (as seen in the Double Time description), so it tries to make you a person of relevance. My character is a renown gunsmith (guns are everywhere in the game I'm playing, and most modern firearms are considered martial) and co-owns a company with his cousin (which is how we explained the broken as fuck Celebrity Discount talent).

I also want to put forth on the table that vigilantes made at level 11 specifically are slightly broken if the DM lets you take into account your social talents (my DM allowed it and regretted it later, but it made sense once we took into account that my character is the head gunsmith for his world's equivalent of Henry Repeaters). Due to the rules on upgrading items, you can just get everything that costs 8000gp or less and then upgrade it. Its how my character has every magic item slot filled, several slotless magical items (mostly handy haversack, bag of holding) and still has 4000gp left over.

I also looked into the archetypes, and I noticed how they have a few archetypes based on other superheroes, such as Brute being Hulk (and freaking awesome) and the wildsoul having Hawkman, Spiderman and... I think sabertooth? (I don't know what superhero turns into a bear and ONLY a bear, and even using sabertooth is wrong) Either way, I realized that the wildsoul seems more for flavor than actual use, especially the arachnid one. In order to fully be useful, you have to pump up your con score, which adds another ability score you have to crank up, and even then, you waste one of your precious uses of your webs just to move around cooler.

The others just seem to be "you're half vigilante, half gunslinger/magus/inquisitor/cavalier/psion, enjoy".

[BlackFlyme]

The Brute is pretty cool, but having a poor Will save on an archetype that requires the save in order to not attack your allies was a terrible design choice. Especially with a relatively high DC of 20 plus your Vigilante level.

The Gunslinger archetype isn't even as good as the actual Gunslinger is. Sidenote, the Maverick archetype for Gunslinger introduced in the same book ain't bad.

The one with the animal companion is just funny, since your pet has a secret identity, too. Your animal cannot benefit from the quick-change abilities, either.

The Cabalist is alright, for a blood-mage-type character, though I would just merge it and the Warlock, since they share a handful of abilities and a spell-list/casting stat. Just choose whether you'd want the bleed damage or the rather terrible Mystic Bolts. The playtest had much better scaling, with you getting 1d6 plus your level, rather than 1d6 plus one-fifth your level.

The Magical Child archetype is very meh. Good concept, but the Summoner spell list isn't great. I'd choose any other 0-6 caster than the Summoner. Though the familiar's ability to shift between different Improved Familiars is really neat. The DM said that Magical Children should get Sorcerer spellcasting abilities, and do in his games, since he really wants to play one. And I am surprised to be able to say that the Magical Girl trope has already been done in Pathfinder before, in the Chosen One Paladin archetype. I find that hilarious.

Wildsoul is a cool concept that allows you to impersonate some memorable superheroes, but the abilities just come online too late for the arachnid and the ursine. Poor Bear-man, always ignored.

And Zealot's a sort of Paladin/Inquisitor, without as many alignment restrictions. I haven't any complaints about it.

[BlackHeartKabal]

Magical Child is literally Sailor Moon.

Don't ask me how I know that.

[Rolan7]

There's a "magical girl" fan module for World of Darkness.  It's... way more serious than I expected, though I'm not experienced with senshis and stuff.  It seems to be about fighting for hope, while fully recognizing that WoD is grimdark.
http://princesswod.wikia.com/wiki/Introduction

As for our vampire group, our ventrue managed to scare off our frenzying gangrel by lighting a fire (again).  They both fled from the flames in Rotschrek, and everything's cool.
Well, except this time she started the fire by tossing a human into an open grill.
and passed the humanity check AGAIN.  Still 7 humanity.  Despite being a malkavian (basically twice as likely to degenerate).  The GM is past fake-crying and is openly plotting revenge (all in good fun.  Seriously, these rolls have been insane).

Meanwhile... uh.  My character took care of the runaway human who witnessed Kayla... being Kayla.

It was a lot like his own embrace, actually.  Hiding in panicked terror, watching a door.  Well, Jake didn't have a gun, but it's not like it mattered here...
And much like his embrace, it turned out much better than expected.
sorta
Immortality is good right?  And superpowers?
yeah our characters are all monsters, Jake's just in denial about it

(And that's not even getting into the vinculum.  I guess being deeply, personally disturbing is a mark of a good game.)
Anyway next session we're desperately trying to recharge our willpowers ASAP.  In other words we need to "relax" by exercising our vices in inventive and irresponsible ways.

[BlackHeartKabal]

I can totally see a Malkavian murdering someone and not losing humanity. Yep.

[SOLDIER First]

That reminds me someone made a Steven Universe DnD-style game.

[highmax28]

The Brute is pretty cool, but having a poor Will save on an archetype that requires the save in order to not attack your allies was a terrible design choice. Especially with a relatively high DC of 20 plus your Vigilante level.

The Gunslinger archetype isn't even as good as the actual Gunslinger is. Sidenote, the Maverick archetype for Gunslinger introduced in the same book ain't bad.

The one with the animal companion is just funny, since your pet has a secret identity, too. Your animal cannot benefit from the quick-change abilities, either.

The Cabalist is alright, for a blood-mage-type character, though I would just merge it and the Warlock, since they share a handful of abilities and a spell-list/casting stat. Just choose whether you'd want the bleed damage or the rather terrible Mystic Bolts. The playtest had much better scaling, with you getting 1d6 plus your level, rather than 1d6 plus one-fifth your level.

The Magical Child archetype is very meh. Good concept, but the Summoner spell list isn't great. I'd choose any other 0-6 caster than the Summoner. Though the familiar's ability to shift between different Improved Familiars is really neat. The DM said that Magical Children should get Sorcerer spellcasting abilities, and do in his games, since he really wants to play one. And I am surprised to be able to say that the Magical Girl trope has already been done in Pathfinder before, in the Chosen One Paladin archetype. I find that hilarious.

Wildsoul is a cool concept that allows you to impersonate some memorable superheroes, but the abilities just come online too late for the arachnid and the ursine. Poor Bear-man, always ignored.

And Zealot's a sort of Paladin/Inquisitor, without as many alignment restrictions. I haven't any complaints about it.

I find it interesting to note though how intimidate is one of their primary skills that they use, because it normally does get overlooked. Why do it when you can drop a fear spell? And there are a few things that are immune to fear effects, so it can potentially cripple their appearance abilities.

I do find it interesting that every version of the vigilante is similar to another class. Stalker is like a rogue and avenger is like a fighter. They just get some flashy extras. While I know that avenger seems to be the best in terms of damage output, some of the defensive skills that stalker has access to makes it really shine when sending them out on their own. Throw in the Up Close and Personal talent, Rooftop Infiltrator and Perfect Fall, and you're constantly on the hit and run tactic. Even if you're spotted afterwards, the Up Close and Personal ability allows you to keep using the d8's rather than the d4's. Throw in boots of speed for haste or some sort of movement increasing magic, and enemies will be hurting while you climb up walls, drop down as a free action, run through them, and climb back up out of their reach. It'll suck because you don't get more than one of those attacks per turn, but if you get a normal attack in first and then start moving, you're gonna have some fun.

My stalker vigilante that I'm using right now though doesn't really go that way; as I said, I focus on non-lethal damage. Since the campaign he's going to be in is based around us being law enforcement (or aiding them in my case), it wouldn't hurt to keep everyone alive. He has two merciful modern revolvers that he uses against enemies that are too far away for him to use his blades or such. He uses medium armor and has the talent that removes the penalty to stealth and acrobatics while wearing it, which is nice.

[BlackFlyme]

Since you are going non-lethal, have you considered picking up the Sap Adept or Sap Master feats to get more out of your sneak-attack?