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[FArgHalfnr]

So it's not a joke? Paid mods are actually kill?

It is dead. At least for now, since valve's reply seemed to imply that they'll try this scheme again. We'll need to be cautious of them in the future.

[Flying Dice]

Except when modders are officially hired and brought into the developer, they do lose creative control over their content. Anything the "Wet and Cold" dev makes for Bethesda while working for Beth would belong to Beth. They could fire him a year later and continue using and selling his work, and there wouldn't be a thing anyone could do about it. Commissioning works better as you continue to be your own business with your own IP, as long as you don't sign it away.

Yep. But it's also a distinctly different relationship. I haven't made a mod that was good enough and popular enough to get me picked up by a developer, but my assumption would be that things are much more formal and contractually binding. And, again, it circumvents the core issue re: fracturing the modding community.

That said, I'm about 85% sure that the people behind most of the mods -> official games/DLC I named are still with the companies that brought them on, or at least have arrangements where they continue to benefit from their work in some fashion.

[Leyic]

Yep. But it's also a distinctly different relationship. I haven't made a mod that was good enough and popular enough to get me picked up by a developer, but my assumption would be that things are much more formal and contractually binding. And, again, it circumvents the core issue re: fracturing the modding community.

That said, I'm about 85% sure that the people behind most of the mods -> official games/DLC I named are still with the companies that brought them on, or at least have arrangements where they continue to benefit from their work in some fashion.

It's not a black-or-white, ValveThesda model or join the company sort of thing. Commissioning is an alternative that several entities in the industry are already familiar with, it just hasn't been applied much to the modder-sphere. "Guilded artisanship" is theoretically another alternative, and that's what ValveThesda would've had if they kept the system closed to the initial group of modders for the first few months so they could figure out the community issues.

Paradox ended their experiment with commissioned modding. Some of those involved stayed with the community as modders and admins for their games, while others disappeared for supposedly greener pastures. None of them are working for Paradox in any capacity anymore, except possibly as a community manager. They would likely still receive royalties for their work, however, but such things are usually kept secret via NDA.

[GrizzlyAdamz]

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

They're going to wait for people to forget and then try again with a new game that doesn't have a large, established community. I doubt it'll be Fallout 4 -- Bethesda's press release a little while ago threw Valve under the bus on this, and I doubt that they're going to want to touch the idea with an 11' pole now.

How so?

In our early discussions regarding Workshop with Valve, they presented data showing the effect paid user content has had on their games, their players, and their modders. All of it hugely positive. They showed, quite clearly, that allowing content creators to make money increased the quality and choice that players had. They asked if we would consider doing the same.

"It was all Valve's idea, they came to us and told us it was a good idea that would make things better for you!"

Three years later and Valve has finally solved the technical and legal hurdles to make such a thing possible, and they should be celebrated for it. It wasn’t easy. They are not forcing us, or any other game, to do it. They are opening a powerful new choice for everyone.

"Valve were the ones pushing to get it working!"

Opening up a market like this is full of problems. They are all the same problems every software developer faces (support, theft, etc.), and the solutions are the same. Valve has done a great job addressing those, but there will be new ones, and we’re confident those will get solved over time also. If the system shows that it needs curation, we’ll consider it, but we believe that should be a last resort.

"...because they were their problems to solve, after all."

The remaining is split 25% to the modder and 45% to us. We ultimately decide this percentage, not Valve.

This was the only point where they admitted fault at all, and then they proceeded directly into further damage control a la:

This is not some money grabbing scheme by us. Even this weekend, when Skyrim was free for all, mod sales represented less than 1% of our Steam revenue.

Ah ok, guess I just didn't read it very closely.
So, it was valve/Gaben...

[Putnam]

Valve said the exact same thing the other way around, so it's mostly just hilarious.

[GrizzlyAdamz]

Valve said the exact same thing the other way around, so it's mostly just hilarious.

Really? Where? (didn't see it in their statement, and I double-checked it this time)

[SquatchHammer]

Could someone change the title now since they are not supporting it?

[Propman]

War's over lads; time to get back to work. I know I have. It's likely going to takes a week for all the damage done to Nexus to be completely reverted, if it ever is, but at least it didn't drag on long enough for the worst of the issue to happen. Now's a time for reconstruction, as well as new construction to take advantage of the opportunities we quite nearly lost: I also hope you've considered donating to your fellow modder or asset maker! Heh, once I'm not too cash strapped, I think I'll give a dollar or two to TrainWiz, maybe even hand some back to the DFhack community as well.

[NullForceOmega]

I hate being poor, I've wanted to send some cash to Daejones and a few other modders for years.

[Leyic]

There is at least one nugget of good to come of this: The CK had the file size and master file restrictions removed after our group told them it would be necessary for the project to work at all. Unless they're total jackasses, they won't be taking that away from us.

Source (post #137).

So yay, I guess? Larger mods on Workshop 'n stuff. He also points out that yet again, Valve did something without telling the modders involved. So Valve botched the PR going in, and botched the PR pulling out. gg Valve.

[Flying Dice]

There is at least one nugget of good to come of this: The CK had the file size and master file restrictions removed after our group told them it would be necessary for the project to work at all. Unless they're total jackasses, they won't be taking that away from us.

Source (post #137).

So yay, I guess? Larger mods on Workshop 'n stuff. He also points out that yet again, Valve did something without telling the modders involved. So Valve botched the PR going in, and botched the PR pulling out. gg Valve.

Well I'll be, there was something beneficial buried under all the rubbish.

Not that that makes me respect Arthmoor, considering he had literally just gotten done calling everyone who disagreed with him trolls. 

[Urist McScoopbeard]

Ze crisis is over.

[Leyic]

Quoting Arthmoor: "No, but it's right to call the vast majority of them who were doing nothing but spewing hatred trolls." (Emphasis mine.) Come now, Flying Dice, that's not "everyone", and none of us have any idea what sort of messages he was getting. There's enough frustration all around, the last thing we need is to keep dividing the community over who-said-whats.

[Flying Dice]

Fair enough, I'll lay off. Still bloody generalizing, though

Anyway, we got shanked. Do they seriously expect anyone to trust them when they want to try again? They've clearly demonstrated they're willing to sacrifice the very people who make mods in order to satisfy the trolls who likely don't.

was pretty clearly a potshot along the lines of "none of the people protesting this are actually modders, and they're all just trolls and not actually legitimately concerned," or at least that's how I parsed it.

[UXLZ]

That's the message I get as well...