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Author Topic: (Newbie Question) So, I caged a GCS by accident. What should I do now.  (Read 5469 times)

Admiral Obvious

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So, as of today I hit the first cavern layer. I'm a relatively new player to this game, but I knew that there was probably going to be nasty stuff down there.

Turns out there were hostile reptile man blow gunners, so I sealed off my entrance to the cave until I have a relatively in shape military.

Shortly after (roughly 2 months in game time) I noticed that all of the Reptile men had wound up dead according to the entity list, so I decided to open up the cavern to steal their stuff. This went well without issue. I decided immediately afterwards to place a big array of cage, and upright spike traps just before the entrance to the caverns, just to be safe, and still be able to mine out the materials there.

Then, the game draws my attention away, as roughly 20 migrants arrive (one of which I think may be a vampire, but that's a separate issue). I come back about 10 minutes later (real time) and discover that some of my cage traps activated. One contains a Giant Toad. The other contains a Giant Cave Spider.

I wasn't prepared to encounter fun this early in the embarkation (roughly 1 year from striking the earth).

The giant Toad is contained in a Bismuth Bronze cage of master quality, so I don't think it will break out of it any time soon. I just am scared to do anything with that, so I'll leave it alone forever I guess.

My real concern is that I have a GCS in a moderately good wooden cage. I have absolutely no idea what to do with it, and I'm terrified of what might happen if it breaks out of the cage. I've currently got it locked away in a stockpile, far far away from the rest of the fortress, behind a locked/forbidden door.

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
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vjmdhzgr

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Cages are invincible and can't be broken out of so don't worry about that. As for what to do with it, giant cave spiders are one of the most valuable things a fortress can have. There's many ways to make giant cave spider silk farms, and I don't know exactly how to make them, but I think with that giant toad you should be able to start taming the GCS and wait until you have a general familiarity with GCS' or a legendary animal trainer (preferably both) then you have a trained GCS. Now it's very important not to let it out of the cage if it's untamed or even just semi-wild or trained with no quality modifiers. If it attacks a dwarf then it will permanently be an enemy, even if you manage to cage it again, which you probably won't be able to since training an animal even once makes it immune to cage traps (most of the time). However, it should be easy to make sure it never gets to that point and you keep your tame more dangerous than a semimegabeast pet.
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Meneth

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Do NOT tame it!

If it remains wild, you can "release" it under controlled circumstances to create a Silk Farm. That gives you unlimited silk thread and cloth, from which you can make clothes, ropes and bags.
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SimRobert2001

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When you tame it, it can run free among your dwarves and act as a guardian, and breeding more gcs. However training degrades over time, its training will degrade, until it regresses to a wild state, at which point, many dwarves will die.
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Naryar

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Tame it. Then catch another, breed them, and do dwarven things with them.

When you tame it, it can run free among your dwarves and act as a guardian, and breeding more gcs. However training degrades over time, its training will degrade, until it regresses to a wild state, at which point, many dwarves will die.

that's why you assign an animal trainer and an animal training zone to it so it doesn't become wild.

For GCS you better use a good animal trainer though.

TheFlame52

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Mod GCS to have children, domesticate them, and breed an army.

A GCS and three of her spiderlings defeated an entire siege.

Dunamisdeos

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Seriously? Feed prisoners to it.
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Fishanchips

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Didn't GCS have the (NO_BREED) tag? Or did they change that in 0.40?

As for what to do with a GCS.
 
Step one: Tame it
Step two: Use it to capture mega beasts, titans and FBs
Step three: See if a goblin siege would beat a steel skinned winged serpent with deadly dust FB
Step four: See how many years it takes for the goblins to defeat said Forgotten Beast
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Dunamisdeos

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Didn't GCS have the (NO_BREED) tag? Or did they change that in 0.40?

As for what to do with a GCS.
 
Step one: Tame it
Step two: Use it to capture mega beasts, titans and FBs
Step three: See if a goblin siege would beat a steel skinned winged serpent with deadly dust FB
Step four: See how many years it takes for the goblins to defeat said Forgotten Beast

This guy is an alright kind of guy.
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Max™

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I have to say you should try to accidentally do more stuff, because you're really quite good at it. :D

I had more luck getting a webbing FB trapped with some bridges than I did getting a GCS for a while, though naturally the first one I got didn't want to shoot anything, preferring to sit back and cower in the little room I built for it to web from. T.T
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TheFlame52

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Re: (Newbie Question) So, I caged a GCS by accident. What should I do now.
« Reply #10 on: April 11, 2015, 07:39:57 am »

At this point I have so many GCS I don't care what happens to them. It doesn't matter that I lost three GCS catching a fire-breathing FB - I have 50 more where that came from.

Niddhoger

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Re: (Newbie Question) So, I caged a GCS by accident. What should I do now.
« Reply #11 on: April 11, 2015, 07:54:30 am »

I decided immediately afterwards to place a big array of cage, and upright spike traps just before the entrance to the caverns, just to be safe, and still be able to mine out the materials there.

This is the main way to secure the first cavern layer.  Nothing in the first layer is a true danger to your fort.  In fact, most wildlife in the first cavern layer is more interested in running from your dorfs than eating them.  But GCS are scary! You say, yes they can be.  However, GCS (along with trolls and crocs) are building destroyers.  They have a raging hate-boner for built structures (not walls/bridges/floors, but things like statues and doors).  So if you place a few (wooden) doors-to-nowhere around the edge of the caverns and then put a few cage traps around them, they'll act as magnets to snare these dangerous critters.  It helps to dig a few tiles into the rock near the map edge (where they spawn from).  So when that big bad croc enters the map, the first thing he sees is some BASTARD wooden door taunting him and not a tasty dorf to snack on.  He charges that ASSHOLE door and falls right into your trap. 

Those reptile-men were never an actual danger to your fort either.  They never actually move around.  You could have just ignored them and they'd have returned the favor.  At most you could have walled them in to keep your dorfs from wandering too close to them. 

Now for the GCS- its probably best you don't tame it for now.  You'll need two to  breed (they can breed now), but taming one makes it a little harder to farm silk from.  The gist of silk farming is to put a GCS in a locked room lined with fortifications on one side.  You'll also build a small retracting bridge directly on the opposite side of the fortifications to block line-of-sight as needed.  Then you place a target that is hostile to the GCS on the other side of the bridge.  Now, if the GCS is tamed, this needs to be a critter hostile to your fort (wild animal/gobbo/etc).  If the GCS is wild itself, you can just chain a puppy up nearby.  Now, with the bridge up (blocking line of sight) put the bait in place.  With all of your dorfs safely out of the room, lower the bridge and let the GCS blast away.  It'll sit there and spew silky gold for... well until it dies in a couple years.  Any time you want to collect the silk, just raise the bridge and send in some weavers.  You shouldn't need to recapture the GCS unless you find another to tame it.  To recapture, you can probably just use a raised bridge blocking a wooden building with traps in front of it like you did in the caverns. 

Now, for that giant toad.  You have three options.  You can let your military get some live training killing it (they aren't too dangerous).  You can tame it and then "pasture" it near the front of your fort as a fodder.  The easiest option is to tame it once (semi-wild is fine), then lead it to your butchers shop.  The very worst of training will still last long enough to safely butcher the animal, but putting the animal training zone near your butchers can't hurt- at all.  Please do this! >.> Back on point, all cave critters have value multipliers on their parts- I think toads are x4? So crafts, armor, and food made from butchered toad parts are going to fetch a fair price.  This is what I do with most of my tameable cave crittes  I get from traps.  You can feed an entire fortress on cavern meat with enough traps... I've also done very well for myself on metal-less embarks using a menagerie of semi-trained cavern critters as fodder.  I've even defeated a couple of early sieges just with cave crocs, elk birds, draaltha, and giant toads.  It helps to build a partial wall to block line-of-sight from archers, thus forcing them into melee range before they can open fire.  The best use of the cave critters is to station your marksdorfs behind them.  While the crocs are keeping the goblin lashers busy, your marksdorfs can do their work. 

Hmmm I -suppose- you could also make pets out of the critters.  Only a few of the cavern critters are hunting/war trainable (jabberer, giant cave swallow/bat), but the others can serve as good distractions to let their owner get away.  Just overlap an animal training zone with your meeting hall and pasture the (mostly) trained animals there that you want adopted.   

Almost forgot- as has been mentioned you can cage-trap FB's with GCS.  In this case it probably is best to tame the GCS for easier replacement.  Its similar to the silk farm, except you want the GCS to be shooting at a target adjacent to some set cage traps.  You want the webbing to land right on top of the traps.  Then, the big-bad FB comes stomping into your fort, gets caught in the webbing, then immediately gets snared by the trap.  Stunned/webbed entities lose their "trapavoid" tag. You can get similar results from controlled cave-ins and collapsing floors.  CAUTION! Creatuers that have no-stun (all FB/Titans) can't be trapped this way. Creatures that use webs themselves (GCS+any web spewing FB/titan) will also have "Webimmune" that prevents them from being trapped this way as well.  So don't think your webbed cage-trap line makes you invulnerable, because a web-spewwing FB will saunter right through them.  Otherwise, it works like a charm letting you capture insanely deadly FB's (like that flying steel-skinned poison spewer...) without much hassle.  Now, you don't want farking CRUNDLES falling into your webbed traps, so I'd keep the web-trap line sealed off.  Then, when you see an FB spawn, double check that it isn't webimmune (if it can spew webs, its immune) then seal your main trap corridor and open the webbed one. 
« Last Edit: April 11, 2015, 08:02:56 am by Niddhoger »
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Admiral Obvious

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Re: (Newbie Question) So, I caged a GCS by accident. What should I do now.
« Reply #12 on: April 11, 2015, 02:39:30 pm »

Thanks for the replies everyone. I'm happy everyone is able to give good suggestions on what to do. I still have the GCS caged, and I'm probably going to build a silk farm soon.

If I do train it with a poor animal trainer, what can I expect to happen?
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Max™

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Re: (Newbie Question) So, I caged a GCS by accident. What should I do now.
« Reply #13 on: April 11, 2015, 02:45:16 pm »

Fun, for certain values of fun after it reverts, but don't train it yet if you can avoid it, easier to silk farm with just a puppy chained near a fortification rather than having to capture actual aggressive enemies and keep them around to web at.
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Niddhoger

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Re: (Newbie Question) So, I caged a GCS by accident. What should I do now.
« Reply #14 on: April 11, 2015, 08:04:28 pm »

Thanks for the replies everyone. I'm happy everyone is able to give good suggestions on what to do. I still have the GCS caged, and I'm probably going to build a silk farm soon.

If I do train it with a poor animal trainer, what can I expect to happen?

if you train it, leave it in the cage for a while.  Whenever the training reverts, the trainer will swing by and work on the critter again.  Generally, whenever an animal reverts to "semi-wild," it'll queue and animal training job.  HOWEVER this is a -very- crucial top priority task.  If your animal trainer is off in the boonies hauling cinnabar back into your fort, he won't get back in time/will go on break afterwards.  Meanwhile, your GCS has reverted to full-wild status and is snacking its way through the dining room.  If you leave it in the cage, there is no risk of it going on a rampage while your animal trainer skills up.  To help matters along, have the trainer tame several animals at once.  So that giant toad... if your animal trainer is working on both at hte same time, he'll gain double the experience.  He won't build up GCS knowledge as quickly, though.  Even so, you want him to rank up more- so this is the main reason I bother keeping other animals around instead of sending them right to the butchers.  Another thing to do is turn off -all- other labors on your animal trainer.  When you can, get two of them as well.  The last thing you want is your trainer to be on break.  That grizzly bear is about to snap and go on a rampage, but its not my problem- on break! Honestly though, I haven't had any serious problems with this by taking hte above precautions (two animal trainers with -no- other labours). 

OH YEAH! Remember, if an animal isn't in an "animal training zone" the trainer won't go to it.  So if you pasture animals into your meeting hall for adoption, don't forget to enable it as a training zone as well.

Training requires food which often leaves seed behinds.  Cages with seeds in them cannot be reused, but this is an easy fix.  You'll have to look inside the cages (k-enter iirc) and then select each seed for dumping first.  You have to press enter a second time to specifically dump hte seed, though, so it can be tedious. 

However, yes it is easier to leave the GCS wild.  Otherwise, youll have to pit crundles and naked gobbos from above for your tame GCS to shoot.  OR you could just bunker it outside during a siege/in the caverns *shrugs*
« Last Edit: April 11, 2015, 08:07:03 pm by Niddhoger »
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