Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[StagnantSoul]

Everybody's coming up with all these ways to kill the merchant, but really just full masterwork divine armor, legendary in all fighting skills, 5,000 in every attribute [TRAP_IMMUNE], [FIRE_IMMUNE_SUPER], and [NO_BREATHE] will easily make him immune to all but an obsidian trap in which case you're obsidianizing the goods as well so there's no point.

[TRAP_IMMUNE] has two catches, a unconcious creature will ALWAYS be trapped, and a webbed trap traps anything that doesn't spin webs. A siege weapon will wreck him, since armor defends against blunt attacks less, catapults with cinnabar, the heaviest stone you can get without exploits. Or even some other stone. The only reason why catapults are worse than ballistas is since Ballistas pierce through enemies and are edged. So the Catapults superior blunt damage and ignoring allies makes it pathetically easy to kill him. A single hit to a leg will knock him over, a hit to the head could knock him unconscious or just kill him. Since most body parts have bones, any hit could make him give into pain from a bone fracture. If you find a way to bypass that, just make a bridge over a pit that has spikes at the bottom. Which will make him explode AND get all his organs impaled.

Um, have you never used a catapult? They're far from precision striking, and couldn't kill a badger.

Then you add more catapults. What you lose in accuracy you recoup in sheer number.

Or, ya'know, use a water cannon or shotgun for all the benefits of a salvo (and more) at the cost of being harder to setup.

I thought those got nerfed with the whole velocity thing?

Really? Dang. Hadn't heard of that. Could you link some stuff pointing to that to me if you can find it please? I'm interested as to how.

Wait, nevermind. They're still fine. It was crossbows and throwing stuff like water that got nerfed.

[XXXXYYYY]

-Snip-

Joy! A round of rocks for everyone!

[Pwned dwarf]

Everybody's coming up with all these ways to kill the merchant, but really just full masterwork divine armor, legendary in all fighting skills, 5,000 in every attribute [TRAP_IMMUNE], [FIRE_IMMUNE_SUPER], and [NO_BREATHE] will easily make him immune to all but an obsidian trap in which case you're obsidianizing the goods as well so there's no point.

[TRAP_IMMUNE] has two catches, a unconcious creature will ALWAYS be trapped, and a webbed trap traps anything that doesn't spin webs. A siege weapon will wreck him, since armor defends against blunt attacks less, catapults with cinnabar, the heaviest stone you can get without exploits. Or even some other stone. The only reason why catapults are worse than ballistas is since Ballistas pierce through enemies and are edged. So the Catapults superior blunt damage and ignoring allies makes it pathetically easy to kill him. A single hit to a leg will knock him over, a hit to the head could knock him unconscious or just kill him. Since most body parts have bones, any hit could make him give into pain from a bone fracture. If you find a way to bypass that, just make a bridge over a pit that has spikes at the bottom. Which will make him explode AND get all his organs impaled.

[NOPAIN] [NOEXERT]
EDIT: also [WEB_IMMUNE] forgot that one.

If he gets hit in a [STANCE] part he'll still be knocked over, a headshot can knock him unconsious (and let him be trapped or murdered by military) or kill him, a hand or arm shot will make him drop his shield or weapon, and a bridge can still make him fall 50 z levels onto a ☼menacing steel spike☼

[vjmdhzgr]

Everybody's coming up with all these ways to kill the merchant, but really just full masterwork divine armor, legendary in all fighting skills, 5,000 in every attribute [TRAP_IMMUNE], [FIRE_IMMUNE_SUPER], and [NO_BREATHE] will easily make him immune to all but an obsidian trap in which case you're obsidianizing the goods as well so there's no point.

[TRAP_IMMUNE] has two catches, a unconcious creature will ALWAYS be trapped, and a webbed trap traps anything that doesn't spin webs. A siege weapon will wreck him, since armor defends against blunt attacks less, catapults with cinnabar, the heaviest stone you can get without exploits. Or even some other stone. The only reason why catapults are worse than ballistas is since Ballistas pierce through enemies and are edged. So the Catapults superior blunt damage and ignoring allies makes it pathetically easy to kill him. A single hit to a leg will knock him over, a hit to the head could knock him unconscious or just kill him. Since most body parts have bones, any hit could make him give into pain from a bone fracture. If you find a way to bypass that, just make a bridge over a pit that has spikes at the bottom. Which will make him explode AND get all his organs impaled.

[NOPAIN] [NOEXERT]
EDIT: also [WEB_IMMUNE] forgot that one.

If he gets hit in a [STANCE] part he'll still be knocked over, a headshot can knock him unconsious (and let him be trapped or murdered by military) or kill him, a hand or arm shot will make him drop his shield or weapon, and a bridge can still make him fall 50 z levels onto a ☼menacing steel spike☼

You're saying all this like Toady can't just make the merchant actually invincible. It doesn't really matter if a dwarf would be easily killed by this, think more whether a demon wearing masterwork divine armor could be killed by it. It really doesn't matter what the merchant is in the end, the idea is to make it so if you try to steal from the merchant there's a severe penalty. The initial post said the merchant was sent by Armok himself so maybe even just make it so the merchant doesn't put up a fight, but after they die an entire army of angels show up. Thinking about it, that might actually be better. You get multiple enemies so they're more difficult to kill with traps, and you don't immediately get punished so maybe it seems like you're going to be okay for a moment, then suddenly you can never go outside again.

[NullForceOmega]

You're forgetting one thing: q, cursor over depot, x.

Also, this is Bay 12, we can kill anything, or use it to kill something else.

[StagnantSoul]

You're forgetting one thing: q, cursor over depot, x.

Also, this is Bay 12, we can kill anything, or use it to kill something else.

That is one way to get the stuff. Toady said it's an intended feature too.

[utunnels]

this unsuspecting merchant is most likely sent by Armok himself.

Maybe the merchant IS Armok.
Maybe when you try to rob him, he can turn random tiles on the map into magma...


But wait, if you need to create enough wealth to trigger the event, you can probably mine enough candy by then. Since candy is already OP, by purchasing them you are just adding more wealth to your fort. Maybe the game should thereafter be more difficult to play? Like random disasters, random dangerous creatures, random plagues...


Edit*

Oh, another thought. Maybe there should be more random merchants. Not just those caravans form neighbour civs. They don't always bring useful items, but could be a fun factor.

[Pwned dwarf]

even if you make a [invincible] tag, you can knock him into a http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2014:Chasm using a bridge or something, it will kill him and the loot is yours
EDIT: these no longer exist

[Pwned dwarf]

Everybody's coming up with all these ways to kill the merchant, but really just full masterwork divine armor, legendary in all fighting skills, 5,000 in every attribute [TRAP_IMMUNE], [FIRE_IMMUNE_SUPER], and [NO_BREATHE] will easily make him immune to all but an obsidian trap in which case you're obsidianizing the goods as well so there's no point.

[TRAP_IMMUNE] has two catches, a unconcious creature will ALWAYS be trapped, and a webbed trap traps anything that doesn't spin webs. A siege weapon will wreck him, since armor defends against blunt attacks less, catapults with cinnabar, the heaviest stone you can get without exploits. Or even some other stone. The only reason why catapults are worse than ballistas is since Ballistas pierce through enemies and are edged. So the Catapults superior blunt damage and ignoring allies makes it pathetically easy to kill him. A single hit to a leg will knock him over, a hit to the head could knock him unconscious or just kill him. Since most body parts have bones, any hit could make him give into pain from a bone fracture. If you find a way to bypass that, just make a bridge over a pit that has spikes at the bottom. Which will make him explode AND get all his organs impaled.

[NOPAIN] [NOEXERT]
EDIT: also [WEB_IMMUNE] forgot that one.

If he gets hit in a [STANCE] part he'll still be knocked over, a headshot can knock him unconsious (and let him be trapped or murdered by military) or kill him, a hand or arm shot will make him drop his shield or weapon, and a bridge can still make him fall 50 z levels onto a ☼menacing steel spike☼

You're saying all this like Toady can't just make the merchant actually invincible. It doesn't really matter if a dwarf would be easily killed by this, think more whether a demon wearing masterwork divine armor could be killed by it. It really doesn't matter what the merchant is in the end, the idea is to make it so if you try to steal from the merchant there's a severe penalty. The initial post said the merchant was sent by Armok himself so maybe even just make it so the merchant doesn't put up a fight, but after they die an entire army of angels show up. Thinking about it, that might actually be better. You get multiple enemies so they're more difficult to kill with traps, and you don't immediately get punished so maybe it seems like you're going to be okay for a moment, then suddenly you can never go outside again.

Toady one would need to make creatures that arnt part of an entity siege you, which is new code, i think angels are weaker than demons, since the only ones with special attacks are archangels which there are only 10 or so in a given world. Also, since angels are weaker,  a Ballista will carve through their lines and a squad of hammer/mace lords will manage to do damage, and if all else fails, a obsidian trap works nicely, and after all the carnage, the lucky dwarves celebrate the angel christmas by melting the large dark metal breastplates and start making their own dark metal breastplates.

[AceSV]

You're forgetting one thing: q, cursor over depot, x.

Also, this is Bay 12, we can kill anything, or use it to kill something else.

I just realized that too (after doing it).  You could maybe get around this by having the merchant go straight to your broker or leader instead of to the depot.  Since he's magic anyways, maybe all the goods you mark for trade just teleport into his sack from wherever they are in the fortress. 

[Bumber]

Or bypass the trading mechanic entirely and have him ask a less monetary cost. (Souls. He probably wants souls. Or artifacts. Or legendary dwarves to join him in his travels. Or legendary dwarf souls.)

[Ops Fox]

I am partial to the bag if holding idea and angels attacking, dont even need the merchant to be a legendary warrior in divine gear. Have it so that the bag is invincible and if the merchant dies the bag randomly spits out demons and angels. When toady one implimemts wear on cages the demon and such can even be spawned in cages that  almost instantly fall apart.

This way there is no easy way to get the goods, once the merchant dies if you can get the stuff in it fun stuff can come out and get you.

[Pwned dwarf]

your changing from hard to defeat, but killing him gives great rewards to invincible and why should you even interact with him if you asks for legendary dwarves

[StagnantSoul]

your changing from hard to defeat, but killing him gives great rewards to invincible and why should you even interact with him if you asks for legendary dwarves

I'm keeping him at really, really hard to defeat, but very reasonable to trade with.

[AceSV]

I am partial to the bag if holding idea and angels attacking, dont even need the merchant to be a legendary warrior in divine gear. Have it so that the bag is invincible and if the merchant dies the bag randomly spits out demons and angels. When toady one implimemts wear on cages the demon and such can even be spawned in cages that  almost instantly fall apart.

This way there is no easy way to get the goods, once the merchant dies if you can get the stuff in it fun stuff can come out and get you.

Would be interesting if the merchant could trade you a caged demon the way elves trade caged elephants.