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[Phmcw]

I think one of the main problems is that a non-insignificant number of people don't see transgendered people as being a "true" representation of their gender, so you get people who become all territorial when they see a "man" (trans women) in the women bathroom, or vice versa, and they don't think they belong in their room.

IMO the best solution is unisex bathrooms, because it stops bathrooms from becoming rooms "for only us", and just becomes "a bathroom".

Or to tell them to grow up and stop being ridiculous?

[alexandertnt]

Or to tell them to grow up and stop being ridiculous?

Do you actually think this is a more effective way of allowing trans people to become more accepted and use the bathroom in peace that unisex bathrooms?

Because I don't know about you, but in my experience, telling someone to "grow up" generally doesn't change peoples opinion, and in fact may even reinforce them.

[Phmcw]

Or to tell them to grow up and stop being ridiculous?

Do you actually think this is a more effective way of allowing trans people to become more accepted and use the bathroom in peace that unisex bathrooms?

Because I don't know about you, but in my experience, telling someone to "grow up" generally doesn't change peoples opinion, and in fact may even reinforce them.

They are being stupid, and I don't think that unisex bathroom are that good an idea in a large scale setting. Sometime, it's better to marginalize an oppinion than to try to change their hardcore supporter.

[alexandertnt]

Well, we can always do both . After all, they are being stupid regardless.

I can't think of a problem for unisex bathrooms in larger settings. In fact, it seems like they may be more efficient, as it allows for all the bathroom resources to be used more efficiently. For example, the last time I went to a metal concert, the male bathroom had a queue despite the fact that the female bathroom was quite literally empty almost the entire time.

Unless you mean "large scale" as in "in more places", but even then I see no problem, at least in my own experiences. All the new public toilets around here are these automatic self-cleaning toilets, which are unisex (and cater for disabled people too).

[smjjames]

It's not so much that unisex bathrooms aren't a good idea in a large scale setting (unless you're talking about temporary setups with lots of portapotties) it's the logistics of it. It'd be like splitting up a gender bathroom with a capacity of 10 into 10 separate rooms.

Now imagine a large scale place like say, a sports stadium, or even a theatre doing that.

[alexandertnt]

Wait, why do we need separate rooms? What's wrong with cubicles?

As far as I can tell, in most places you could just remove the wall and the gender signs to get a unisex bathroom.

[Leafsnail]

That's gonna be way, way, way harder to sell than letting transgender people use the right bathrooms.

[alexandertnt]

Well, I don't really think so, but then again I don't exactly have a study backing that up, so perhaps.

I still think it is a better solution. If such a thing became normal, not only would it help transgender people, but also any other gender identity or biological sex etc. It also has logistical benefits I listed earlier.

[Owlbread]

Spoiler: I don't see what the issue here is. Is this some kind of problem for English people? (click to show/hide)

[BlindKitty]

I will try and chime in with a few points:
a) In Europe, we have all those laws about sexual violence, mobbing, and various other sex crimes. I'm pretty sure a (sex) man in a women's bathroom would be in for, like, a major fee and a few months in jail... Since law is the law, and common sense has no implication in the court. Also, really, if we are going to use common sense instead of billions of laws, I'm in for it, but we really need to get rid of, like, 85% of the laws already established.
b) I have no beef with unisex bathrooms one way or another (stalls/separate rooms/any other way). I've even worked in a place where all bathrooms were unisex (room kind), and it seemed to work well enough. I think bigger problem would be with the changing rooms/locker rooms in sporting establishments and schools - those are often open (I mean: no stalls/small rooms/any kind of separation), at least where I live; hardly a way to make them unisex without some major problems (high schools come to mind).
c) If we are really going to regulate transgender bathrooms, I postulate to regulate claustrophobic bathrooms (what is with those tiny, tiny stalls?) and germophobic bathrooms (all those people not disinfecting anything!) and... You catch my drift. This is not a mockery, mind you - in my country, we have gotten 26 000 pages of new laws... Last year. This is like 70 full-sized, A4 pages of text to read daily just to keep up with the law. And I do mean daily - including weekends, holidays and stuff. I don't think I know 5% of the laws in my country, and I'm pretty sure I couldn't even name all the felonies that could land me in jail, despite trying to keep up at least with that...

[smjjames]

I will try and chime in with a few points:
a) In Europe, we have all those laws about sexual violence, mobbing, and various other sex crimes. I'm pretty sure a (sex) man in a women's bathroom would be in for, like, a major fee and a few months in jail... Since law is the law, and common sense has no implication in the court. Also, really, if we are going to use common sense instead of billions of laws, I'm in for it, but we really need to get rid of, like, 85% of the laws already established.

Huh? We aren't talking about a man (and I mean 100% male, not transgender) going into a womans bathroom, we're talking about transgender because you've got someone who looks male, but has female bodyparts/functionality going into a womans bathroom.

Arg, I'm probably not explaining it clearly and I'm not transgender myself and don't happen to personally know anybody in RL who is transgender, so...

[Bauglir]

The actual solution is to let transgender people use the appropriate bathrooms without freaking out over it for no reason.  Trying to appease bigots with bizarre middle ground suggestions is a fruitless endeavor.

I like you.

[Neonivek]

I mean, I could ask all my transgendered friends...

But honestly I'd rather treat them as if they weren't transgendered at all. (I wonder which person is going to be the first to misinterpret this)

we're talking about transgender because you've got someone who looks male, but has female bodyparts/functionality going into a womans bathroom.

We aaaare talking about someone who looks like a woman (Or not at all, there is no rule that a Transgendered person needs to try to put on a convincing or particularly engendered look... In fact some don't... something I wish people would remember), who has a penis, going into a woman's bathroom.

Meaning if that penis is all you need to consider them a man... that means there is a man in the woman's bathroom... and since being transgendered doesn't mean you are homosexual. It means there is an excellent chance that you have a man, who likes women, in a women's bathroom with women.

And that is the crux of the paranoia.

It is the same reason why some people are scared to leave their children around homosexuals...

The actual solution is to let transgender people use the appropriate bathrooms without freaking out over it for no reason.  Trying to appease bigots with bizarre middle ground suggestions is a fruitless endeavor.

I like you.

Don't get into teaching or government work. For your sanity.

We don't exactly live in a world where you can just avoid the morons, especially when we are talking about places where the "bigots" are not the minority (or if they are, they are definitely the controlling minority)

[Sinistar]

I will try and chime in with a few points:
a) In Europe, we have all those laws about sexual violence, mobbing, and various other sex crimes. I'm pretty sure a (sex) man in a women's bathroom would be in for, like, a major fee and a few months in jail...

I'm pretty sure this is more of an exception than the rule though. Haven't heard of many places in Europe where someone would be doing time for JUST going into wrong bathroom. But there are such places in, I guess.

[Neonivek]

I will try and chime in with a few points:
a) In Europe, we have all those laws about sexual violence, mobbing, and various other sex crimes. I'm pretty sure a (sex) man in a women's bathroom would be in for, like, a major fee and a few months in jail...

I'm pretty sure this is more of an exception than the rule though. Haven't heard of many places in Europe where someone would be doing time for JUST going into wrong bathroom. But there are such places in, I guess.

I looked into it and the results are very muddled...

How muddled? It is hard to even find out if it is even illegal to go into the wrong bathroom normally... Anywhere!

It seems like some people believe it is illegal (Mostly store clerks), while others seem to say that there is no law specifically banning people from going into whatever bathroom they want in both Europe and the USA.

I am assuming, for sanity, that Canada doesn't have this issue... I know I've been in a women's bathroom before out of necessity and when I was so young that I was brought in there with my mother.

In fact when a couple had sex in the bathroom in the USA they were charged with public indecency.