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[Random_Dragon]

It's tough to look at it now that it's more work to get running in the main game. :c

Yeah, I'm...salty about it. ._.

[Rolan7]

Walkers would be useful on rocky, mountainous, or otherwise unstable terrain that wheeled or tracked vehicles would be hard-pressed to cross. It would actually be very useful in a survival setting, as roads are probably crumbling or just straight up not there anymore and there's not really much way to build new ones, but at the same time, Cataclysm is fairly flat and there's not really many places where that one advantage would actually come into play.

Yeah.  Walkers on stairs are still clumsy, but they manage, whereas wheels just don't.  Maybe I'm underestimating treads, but seems like legs *with futuristic algorithms* and foot-dexterity could actually do better.

[NullForceOmega]

Fairly dependent on how aggressive the track's profile is, but legs would have an undeniable edge on broken terrain.

[TheBronzePickle]

Treads and tracks have a high surface area, which means good traction (they stick to the ground well, letting them climb steep grades and maintain control on slick surfaces) and low ground pressure (they won't sink into soft ground as easily and get stuck), but they still need a reasonably flat surface to cross. Legs can be picked up over obstacles that tracks can't climb.

That said, tracks are way, way better over soft ground. Legs have the lowest surface area of any means of locomotion, which means they will sink very easily.

[Rolan7]

That's why you have jump jets /s

[Aseaheru]

 Tracks can allow for climbing some rather impressive slopes. The main issue is finding any imagery of them doing this...

[Culise]

This (apologies for Daily Mail in advance) was written on one tracked vehicle used in the new Mad Max, and includes it heading up a steep incline of grit and sand in both a picture and near the end of the video.  Of course, it's significantly and obviously under-weight compared to an actual military tank, but just talking the treads, it demonstrates what they are capable of when the vehicle is built appropriately. 

I do agree treads are much better than legs in areas where there aren't large numbers of significant obstacles with respect to the size of the vehicle itself, but indeed, walkers do have significant issues with surface pressure when scaled up from drone size (the Boston Dynamic drones mentioned before; their largest walkers are still comparable to humans in size) to, say, the size of an Abrams or T-14; the tyranny of the square-cube law strikes again.  It's obviously not impossible given that real-life creatures exist (the return of war elephants, now in mecha form?), but you also have to ask if it's more efficient than a treaded vehicle.  That said, this is a game where we can hook a gas canister up to a broadsword, light up, and go wild without incident or issue.  I'm not too fussed, especially if it ends in spider tanks a la Outpost 2 or Ghost in the Shell.

[Girlinhat]

Oh, a proper wheeled vehicle can navigate steep inclines and stairs very easily.  A common car can't, because they're designed for fresh road.  A military jeep can't even, because they're designed with the intent that they're backed by the infrastructure of the army.  But look at the hummers with half-deflating tires.  By combining exceptionally large wheels with half-inflated PSI, they can just sort of 'mold over' curbs and steps and would be able to progress up a big enough staircase slowly.

The point I'm trying to make is that for the effort of designing, engineering, and maintaining a walker, a wheeled vehicle could be designed, engineered, and maintained FAR more easily, for whatever its specific use is.  Sure, you could make a stair-climbing walker for $20,000 but you could also make a stair-climbing wheeled vehicle for like $1,000.  You could also make a walker for climbing, running, dealing with water, handling rubble, etc... but if you made a wheeled vehicle specifically to deal with any of those, it would be easier and cheaper.

The truth is that walkers aren't complicated.  A basic level walker would be 6 legs, with a lifting motion, a pivot forwards/back, and a lowering motion.  Down to basics, that could be 2 motors per leg.  With a human operator doing the fuzzy logic, you could just have those motors on individual controls and the pilot could determine how far forward and how far down each leg goes, and slowly traverse basically anything.  Making a self-adjusting walker, especially a two-legged or four-legged (which can't remain on a tripod at rest as a six-legged could), or a walker to carry weight or move at significant speed, would be VERY difficult.  Especially getting a robot that can see the terrain and determine how to walk.  But the most basic core of moving legs is actually pretty easy.

The thing is that wheels are even easier.  They just spin.  No articulation, no range of movement, no thought, just spinning.  But this is Cataclysm.  The engineering behind it doesn't matter because you can craft nuclear bombs in the back seat of your plasma powered hatchback.  The upkeep doesn't matter because you have whole cities to strip for parts and fuel, and don't have to pay for it or deal with a boss who's upset with your investment.  The speed doesn't even really matter because you're playing on your time, and if you decide to go slowly then that's fine, and 10mph is plenty to just make your way across the terrain.

TL;DR - Walkers aren't difficult, they're just inefficient.  I can find reasons to avoid a lot of things in game, but there's not a good reason to exclude walker legs when we do include flotation devices and plasma powered scooters and mounted glob launchers that you can put on top of your glob rollers.

[n9103]

Spoiler: *insert "Dixie" notes here* (click to show/hide)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zAKksqKR3pI

In seriousness though, tanks aren't as easily defeated by rough terrain as it's sounding in here.
Case in point, the Abrams can clear (as in climb over) a 4 foot vertical wall, cross a 9 foot trench, and traverse at least a 60% slope.
I would expect all those numbers to have been fudged a bit as well, since they're representative of current military equipment, thus actual figures would be classified.

[Neonivek]

Tanks have come a long way but it wasn't unusual for them to become disabled for the tiniest of reasons... such as a rock got in their tracks, or they tried to clear a speed barrier.

Heck one US tank rampage was only stopped because it managed to disable itself after plowing right through several buildings... how? A cement barrier.

[Aseaheru]

 That aint no 'murican tank.

 The new Japanese tank (the Type 10) manages 70km/h both forward and backwards. Which is probably just what the governor allows.

[Random_Dragon]

That's about on-par for governed road speeds for MBTs though, forwards at least. No idea about backwards.

[NullForceOmega]

Don't know what tanks you're talking about, Abrams governed speed is 65 MPH, not kph.  Also, all those methods gih talked about above still need aggressive traction profiles, tracked, tires, whatever.

And it was an American tank that Neo is talking about, but the concrete barriers in this case were highway dividers, so fairly heavily reinforced, it was a old tank tho', not a modern one.

Think the one in the picture above is a Russian T-90.

It is very interesting how often tanks get brought up in this thread, probably due to the lack of track components for vehicles.

[n9103]

That aint no 'murican tank.

Never said it was. That little tune is universal. If you're pulling an epic jump with a large vehicle, you've earned the right to play it. (in that instance)

[Strife26]

Tanks have come a long way but it wasn't unusual for them to become disabled for the tiniest of reasons... such as a rock got in their tracks, or they tried to clear a speed barrier.

Heck one US tank rampage was only stopped because it managed to disable itself after plowing right through several buildings... how? A cement barrier.

There's not a ground vehicle in the world that can deal with being high centered. I guess that might be an advantage of legs because they have a variable height, but that's definitely an edge case.