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[Jarod]

I found this interesting post on reddit:
http://www.reddit.com/r/dwarffortress/comments/2ualvk/has_everybody_been_receiving_sieges_frequently_in/
in which user kgtx thinks they've figured out why sieges are so infrequent in 40.xx. I can't rephrase it better so I'll just copy and paste the text here:

In the newest Future of the Fortress reply, Toady mentions how invaders path to your fortress:
>They walk over the land on a path avoiding water
I dunno about you guys but I've only been getting small sieges and they're rare at that. Nowhere near 34.11 levels, I haven't encountered a ~150 strong siege this version. As many people know from Adventure mode, there are brooks and rivers literally everywhere that aren't on the big map. As we also know, many go from mountains to lakes/oceans, effectively making a bunch of impassable walls on the map. Could it be that armiess literally can't reach your fortress some of the time? Or when they can, their path is long and convoluted?

So what do you guys reckon? Is this a possible reason that sieges are so infrequent and rare in the newer versions?

[Orange Wizard]

That seems reasonable, though I'm 90% sure Toady made armies ford rivers at some point.

AFAIK the main reason is a problem with the way sieges are sent out in the first place.

[Naryar]

You'll gotta ask toady.

I think the reason for rarity are that they are no longer randomly generated and dropped at your door.

From a realistic standpoint, placing myself in a medieval context, one siege per year for multiple years is a lot.

[Jarod]

That seems reasonable, though I'm 90% sure Toady made armies ford rivers at some point.

Was that not an upcoming feature or am I mis-remembering?

You'll gotta ask toady.

I think the reason for rarity are that they are no longer randomly generated and dropped at your door.

How would I go about doing that? Also yeah I figured that that had a factor in it but I've played forts for like 8 years with active goblins and not received one.

[utunnels]

The new version works fine for me.

Maybe the new system encourage your embark more until you have a siege.
My last fort used to get siege yearly for 7 years when suddenly they stopped sending anything. But after 4 or 5 years, they suddenly came back.

[Jarod]

The new version works fine for me.

Maybe the new system encourage your embark more until you have a siege.
My last fort used to get siege yearly for 7 years when suddenly they stopped sending anything. But after 4 or 5 years, they suddenly came back.

Woah really? How large are your sieges? Cause I've had sieges that are max ~25 and they come very rarely when they do. Nothing compared to 34.11 sizes that were about 150+ after a few of them.

[utunnels]

The new version works fine for me.

Maybe the new system encourage your embark more until you have a siege.
My last fort used to get siege yearly for 7 years when suddenly they stopped sending anything. But after 4 or 5 years, they suddenly came back.

Woah really? How large are your sieges? Cause I've had sieges that are max ~25 and they come very rarely when they do. Nothing compared to 34.11 sizes that were about 150+ after a few of them.

Yeah, probably fewer goblins.
With a 20 population limit (edited raws), I got up to 40ish goblins and trolls.
When I was playing normally (more than 100 dorfs), I got 60 to 80.

I don't know if your population is a factor, maybe my world has fewer goblins since I usually generate a pocket world.

[Burts]

Well, what i think could be done now is that if sieges are rarer, they should be bigger.


Some battles in world gen have more than a thousand people fightning for one side. I think it would be fun to ocasionally have truly massive sieges of say of 500+ goblins and trolls. Although some people have already experienced such things apparently http://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/mantisbt/view.php?id=7461


Also, there can be a few reasons goblins dont want to siege you. Most important factors are

1. The goblins must not be busy doing other stuff in worldgen (fightning other wars for example)
2. You must not be far away.
3. Wealth.

[SirQuiamus]

The problem may be widespread, but not universal. All of my 40.xx forts have frequently received several pages of invaders (the latest siege was probably around 100), and the last time I played a no-goblin fort was in 34.11. It is worth noting that my pop. limit is often unreasonably high (200+), so this could well be significant factor. Also, some players have suffered a lack of sieges after embarking right next to a dark fortress, and furthermore, I'm pretty sure my current fort is cut off from the nearest goblin site by at least one river (although it may have been a brook, actually). Brooks shouldn't be a problem since they are "roofed over," and can be walked across even while travelling in Adventurer mode, so its the larger bodies of water that one should watch out for when embarking.

[utunnels]

Well, what i think could be done now is that if sieges are rarer, they should be bigger.


Some battles in world gen have more than a thousand people fightning for one side. I think it would be fun to ocasionally have truly massive sieges of say of 500+ goblins and trolls.

Well, FPS is a thing. 500 goblins means unplayable to me. They should send some weapon masters.
An elite dorf can easily slay squads of goblins single-handedly. It is quite annoying to kill them and dump all the corpses and body parts (seeing 500 dead goblins may also drive them insane).

[Burts]

Well, what i think could be done now is that if sieges are rarer, they should be bigger.


Some battles in world gen have more than a thousand people fightning for one side. I think it would be fun to ocasionally have truly massive sieges of say of 500+ goblins and trolls.

Well, FPS is a thing. 500 goblins means unplayable to me. They should send some weapon masters.
An elite dorf can easily slay squads of goblins single-handedly. It is quite annoying to kill them and dump all the corpses and body parts.

Well, perhaps them sending weapon masters is a better idea. And more trolls with weapons. It is amazing that trolls now come with weapons and armor, just needs more of that.
I started a new fortress where the only civs in the world is my fortress and a huge goblin civ. So i will report what will happen to me.

[Melting Sky]

Well, perhaps them sending weapon masters is a better idea. And more trolls with weapons. It is amazing that trolls now come with weapons and armor, just needs more of that.
I started a new fortress where the only civs in the world is my fortress and a huge goblin civ. So i will report what will happen to me.

Yeah, I think goblins and trolls with improved skill levels and equipment are a better solution than increasing their numbers. Simply giving higher ranked goblins full suits of whatever the best material their civilization can produce would make a huge difference.   

[Burts]

Well, perhaps them sending weapon masters is a better idea. And more trolls with weapons. It is amazing that trolls now come with weapons and armor, just needs more of that.
I started a new fortress where the only civs in the world is my fortress and a huge goblin civ. So i will report what will happen to me.

Yeah, I think goblins and trolls with improved skill levels and equipment are a better solution than increasing their numbers. Simply giving higher ranked goblins full suits of whatever the best material their civilization can produce would make a huge difference.

Yeah, that is definately the way to go.


However, there definately are some serious issues with goblins and their attacks in this version. First of all, no babysnatchers come to your fortress at all, neither do ambushes.

[g2knee]

However, there definately are some serious issues with goblins and their attacks in this version. First of all, no babysnatchers come to your fortress at all, neither do ambushes.

I found this odd as well.  Were babysnatchers and ambushes taken out?  My last couple games went straight to sieges with no "warm up" activities, so to speak.

[Naryar]

What version are you playing ? Siege rarity was a thing before 40.20 due to a bug.