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[g2knee]

Good points, but I dont' think Toady's goal was ever to make the game better in terms of marketing and such.  I'm just saying, if we go into such detail over sexual/relationship preferences, it makes just as much (if not more) sense to go into more detail in terms of engineering and physical needs.


"Urist McPrissypants has been annoyed at not having his sanitation needs met"

I don't feel super strongly either way, but it's a good point.

[Putnam]

The Sims got positive reception for that in 2000, mind.

Good points, but I dont' think Toady's goal was ever to make the game better in terms of marketing and such.  I'm just saying, if we go into such detail over sexual/relationship preferences, it makes just as much (if not more) sense to go into more detail in terms of engineering and physical needs.

Not really, since romance was in the game before orientation was while excretory and urinary faculties aren't.

[mardouille]

Just because people are going to weaponize or abuse this by drowning goblins in poo doesn't mean it shouldn't be in the game. I would be just fine with just a poo zone and the cleaning labor that wash the floor once in a while. If you don't clean you get pooasmia and nauseous dwarfs. I agree that in a large fortress it should be important as it is in real life.

[Graknorke]

Let's keep it that way, eh?

[pisskop]

I would love to assign a caste/profession lower than hauler.

  Actually, I would make it a punishment for a crime if I could.

[Urist Tilaturist]

Personally I think sewage would be extremely !!fun!! and an excellent addition to DF, allowing both for better farming and for the inevitable weaponisation. If Toady is squeamish for some weird reason (he does it too, why would it disgust him?), then he should just make it possible for modders to add it.

[Putnam]

Personally I think sewage would be extremely !!fun!! and an excellent addition to DF, allowing both for better farming and for the inevitable weaponisation. If Toady is squeamish for some weird reason (he does it too, why would it disgust him?), then he should just make it possible for modders to add it.

Because right now DF is "that really complex game that makes great stories" and he's worried that, with this addition, it'll become "that really complex game with piss and shit all over the place".

[Naryar]

Personally I think sewage would be extremely !!fun!! and an excellent addition to DF, allowing both for better farming and for the inevitable weaponisation. If Toady is squeamish for some weird reason (he does it too, why would it disgust him?), then he should just make it possible for modders to add it.

Because right now DF is "that really complex game that makes great stories" and he's worried that, with this addition, it'll become "that really complex game with piss and shit all over the place".

You mean that's worse than mermaid farming, dwarven child care and shield babies ? Everything that needs to be found by moral guardians/ill-intentioned people to attack Dwarf Fortress is already in the game.

DF is simply ignored by these people because it is not mainstream. Also people do not pay for it.

I agree that it will probably bring some bad publicity, though, and there are more important things to do.

It WOULD be nice to use manure (both animal and dwarf) as a replacement for potash, though. Call it filth since it is already in the game ?

Edit: Now I am thinking of nest boxes and the LAYS_UNUSUAL_EGGS token... :O

[Graknorke]

Well, Toady actually put in work to disincentivise mermaid farming so...

[Urist Tilaturist]

Because right now DF is "that really complex game that makes great stories" and he's worried that, with this addition, it'll become "that really complex game with piss and shit all over the place".

Everybody excretes. Why is that more obscene than disgusting acts of violence? There is already blood and vomit everywhere in DF. Somehow they have not trashed the game's reputation. People did not complain about toilets in the Sims. All these fears are exaggerated; if anything was going to give DF a bad name, it is adventure mode and the chances it creates for horrible tortures at the hands of the player.

Comparing bodily functions that everybody does with animal (or mermaid) abuse is daft.

[Orange Wizard]

Tell that to the general public. Just don't mention how that one adventurer was so much worse.

Personally, I think sewerage mechanics would be great Fun.

[Putnam]

Personally I think sewage would be extremely !!fun!! and an excellent addition to DF, allowing both for better farming and for the inevitable weaponisation. If Toady is squeamish for some weird reason (he does it too, why would it disgust him?), then he should just make it possible for modders to add it.

Because right now DF is "that really complex game that makes great stories" and he's worried that, with this addition, it'll become "that really complex game with piss and shit all over the place".

You mean that's worse than mermaid farming, dwarven child care and shield babies ?

Player-created, player-created and unintended behavior.

[Arcvasti]

Personally I think sewage would be extremely !!fun!! and an excellent addition to DF, allowing both for better farming and for the inevitable weaponisation. If Toady is squeamish for some weird reason (he does it too, why would it disgust him?), then he should just make it possible for modders to add it.

Because right now DF is "that really complex game that makes great stories" and he's worried that, with this addition, it'll become "that really complex game with piss and shit all over the place".

You mean that's worse than mermaid farming, dwarven child care and shield babies ?

Player-created, player-created and unintended behavior.

Plus Toady changed bone values to stop the first and gutted the second with the newest release's changes.

[Urist Tilaturist]

Tell that to the general public. Just don't mention how that one adventurer was so much worse.

Personally, I think sewerage mechanics would be great Fun.

Comparing everybody's normal bodily functions to Obok Meatgod and his violations of sexual decency is also just a little strange. Maybe we need a "shit offenders registry" if this tide of toilet political correctness goes too far.

I am very happy to tell the general public that excretion is normal. They all do it too. Any other attitude stinks (pun intended) of hypocrisy.

[Malokin]

I would just like to point out that the "moat" around actual real life castles were very often the open sewer of the people inside those castles.  In fact, you may actually be able to find real life historical examples of "sewage" being used as a weapon.