Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Broseph Stalin]

Sososh Thusest (Jackal's Fury)


Kisat Dur is not for the faint of heart or weak of stomach. In the face of an armored enemy brutality may do what cunning cannot. Find the throat and bite down hard, ignore the mail, ignore the cracking of your teeth, bite down until you taste blood. Shake the enemy in your teeth, do not stop until you feel their spine snap in your jaws. When the enemy falls limp leave them. Even if they still curse your name they are already dead.

[Max™]

Goddamn dude.

[Broseph Stalin]

Yep. Between that and the discovery that gouging eyes now has the potential to smush skulls I've come to the realization that I'm kind of not a good guy.

They can wear full adamantine armor and six cloaks, if you're big enough to shake their neck you can kill them. Nobody is really ready to be mauled by a dwarf.

[Random_Dragon]

Also, I just realized that my earlier techique of killing a bronze colossus with a copper spear may fail to work now. At least, it may well outlast my spear.

[Max™]

In other news, if you have modded megabeast materials that are durable enough to keep skulls from just imploding, and are strong enough, you can punch something so hard the neck gives out.


With regular materials it should then be possible for a kisat dur practitioner to punch someone and have their head fly off.

[Random_Dragon]

I stabbed a kestrel in the face so hard that hapened in one hit, actually. :V

[Broseph Stalin]

I think that the odds of knocking someone unconscious may have been increased. It used to be rare enough that you really couldn't plan for it to happen. Now I just killed three giants a bear and a yeti in the arena by knocking them out and finishing them off. I think that the combat changes are enough for some serious retools to the way Kisat Dur works. With the knockout thing and the pulling and pushing mechanics pure striking is much more valid than it used to be.

I want to retool the style to be more helpful as a guide to adventure mode combat with an unarmed character. I want to keep the crazy tricks that made Kisat Dur so popular but I also want to address the problems and scenarios that might deter someone from using unarmed combat to it's full potential. So, I want to know what your adventures are like. What makes you feel helpless and what makes you feel unstoppable?

[snow dwarf]

boogeyman, definitely boogeyman, they make me very helpless

[IndigoFenix]

Pain effects are reduced, so some old tricks (breaking wrists, smashing fingers) no longer result in an instant knockout.  Not sure if the chances for scoring a knockout with a regular head blow was changed, or if you just got lucky.

Stealing weapons is still one of my favorite techniques when playing an unarmed fighter; no sense in letting an enemy have an advantage.  One technique you don't mention is my favorite coup de grace on an unconscious enemy, a heavy kick to the head, which is usually strong enough to kill a same-sized enemy.  I generally imagine it as a skull-shattering curbstomp.

One thing you might want to add to the guide is conflict levels, which is one of the main reason (besides roleplaying) a player might want to fight unarmed in the first place.  If you keep it to punches and wrestling, the conflict won't go above a brawl, so you can beat people unconscious in a tavern without getting a reputation as a psychopath.  Drawing blood tends to elevate the conflict, so scratching and biting should be avoided.  Breaking bones does too, so sometimes it happens anyway.

Biting is scary effective if you've leveled it up, but I generally don't use it unless I feel like roleplaying a deranged psychopath.  Or certain types of animal people.  Or a gnome.

[Random_Dragon]

I think that the odds of knocking someone unconscious may have been increased. It used to be rare enough that you really couldn't plan for it to happen.

It seems that yeah, head wounds that don't inflict brain damage seem to trigger that stunning KO effect more often.

I kinda wish that there were additionally head wounds that would stun without a KO. -_-

[Max™]

Don't know what the translated version is, but landing on someone and doing a Skullstomp is one of the most powerful feeling things ever, and I've punched people across the screen hard enough they died on impact.

The helplessness I resolved with some modding, adding elbow and knee strikes with different balance and timing from hand and foot strikes did a lot.

The muay thai neck-grab > knee strike move as a takedown > knee > head strike being one of my favorite "I have no reason to do this, but dammit I feel awesome as hell doing it" things.

[Broseph Stalin]

Pain effects are reduced, so some old tricks (breaking wrists, smashing fingers) no longer result in an instant knockout.  Not sure if the chances for scoring a knockout with a regular head blow was changed, or if you just got lucky.

Stealing weapons is still one of my favorite techniques when playing an unarmed fighter; no sense in letting an enemy have an advantage.  One technique you don't mention is my favorite coup de grace on an unconscious enemy, a heavy kick to the head, which is usually strong enough to kill a same-sized enemy.  I generally imagine it as a skull-shattering curbstomp.

One thing you might want to add to the guide is conflict levels, which is one of the main reason (besides roleplaying) a player might want to fight unarmed in the first place.  If you keep it to punches and wrestling, the conflict won't go above a brawl, so you can beat people unconscious in a tavern without getting a reputation as a psychopath.  Drawing blood tends to elevate the conflict, so scratching and biting should be avoided.  Breaking bones does too, so sometimes it happens anyway.

Biting is scary effective if you've leveled it up, but I generally don't use it unless I feel like roleplaying a deranged psychopath.  Or certain types of animal people.  Or a gnome.

The rewrite is going to start with a discussion of the different styles of unarmed attack and what they do to conflict levels.

I didn't include the stomp because even though it's very satisfying from a rp perspective I can't find any significant difference between the damage done by a punch and the damage done by a kick. Since punching is faster it's usually better.

It seems that yeah, head wounds that don't inflict brain damage seem to trigger that stunning KO effect more often.

I kinda wish that there were additionally head wounds that would stun without a KO. -_-

There absolutely are, I've been boxing bears and I tend to rattle them once or twice before they go down.

[Random_Dragon]

There absolutely are, I've been boxing bears and I tend to rattle them once or twice before they go down.

Ooh. Didn't realize that. Granted, I've generally been using weapons, so my "KO dragon by stabbing it in the head" example isn't an archetypal Kisat Dur example. :V

[Max™]

Legs are heavier, so 100 contact perc gives more force than 100 contact perc on an arm. It's not huge, I usually mod them so kicks have more velocity with slower recover, better prepare though since they're longer, you can hit with a kick before you can with a punch.

Just from looking at the vanilla values, I totally forgot there were scratch attacks, I removed those and all the "slaps with the flat" attacks due to being stupid.

[Broseph Stalin]

Legs are heavier, so 100 contact perc gives more force than 100 contact perc on an arm. It's not huge, I usually mod them so kicks have more velocity with slower recover, better prepare though since they're longer, you can hit with a kick before you can with a punch.

Just from looking at the vanilla values, I totally forgot there were scratch attacks, I removed those and all the "slaps with the flat" attacks due to being stupid.

Kicks are technically stronger but it really doesn't seem to be significant. I've never seen a skull that I could smash with a kick that I couldn't smash with a punch.