Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

I am religious and believe in free will

71 (27.7%)

I am religious and do not believe in free will

10 (3.9%)

I am not religious and believe in free will

114 (44.5%)

I am not religious and do not believe in free will

61 (23.8%)

Total Members Voted: 251

[Askot Bokbondeler]

i disagree with His reasoning tho, united we're pretty tame, it's when we're at (cold) war that we become impressive
also,

And the LORD was with Judah; and he drave out the inhabitants of the mountain; but could not drive out the inhabitants of the valley, because they had chariots of iron.

without any background i would interpret this as

And the LORD was with Judah; and Judah drave out the inhabitants of the mountain; but could not drive out the inhabitants of the valley, because they had chariots of iron.

why isn't this the mainstream view?

[TD1]

Because God was with him, and he still failed. Saying Judah, with the help of God, failed is really not all that different from saying God failed.

[Rolan7]

Also Judah in that case is the tribe, not the person.  Other translations make that more clear.  I don't remember if the person was even alive at this point.

[Descan]

I thought Judah meant the nation of Judah, not a singular person?

[TheDarkStar]

I thought Judah meant the nation of Judah, not a singular person?

Singular pronouns can be used to refer to nations. Judah was long dead by that time.

[Askot Bokbondeler]

Because God was with him, and he still failed. Saying Judah, with the help of God, failed is really not all that different from saying God failed.

i guess the difference is that god doesn't fight Judah's battles, just gives it a damage bonus to certain units and bonus resource production, so there's still margin for human merit

[TD1]

No indication of that in the Bible, though. Sounds a bit like Civ V being played by God, but yes, it could be that way. And there are a hundred other ways you could justify what it means - perhaps the people in Judah's army had lost divine faith by the time they got to the valley. Maybe God wanted the Valley people spared. And so on.

That just doesn't seem to be the case from what is written - God was with them, and they couldn't defeat the chariots.

[Calidovi]

I thought Judah meant the nation of Judah, not a singular person?

Do you mean Judea?

[Orange Wizard]

Judah refers to the tribe of Judah, Judea refers to the geographical region.

[Adragis]

the obvious answer is that iron is so scientific it defies the supernatural

[Rolan7]

I still like the idea that it's cold iron and OT God is a demon or fey.
Okay that's a joke.  But I seriously do think he acts like one would expect Satan to act.  Like a lot of ancient people believed.

[TD1]

the obvious answer is that iron is so scientific it defies the supernatural

Answering once and for all the question "can science and religion co-mingle?"

[Orange Wizard]

the obvious answer is that iron is so scientific it defies the supernatural

Answering once and for all the question "can science and religion co-mingle?"

Now I want to post that scene from The Simpsons where the judge rules that Religion must stay at least 200 metres away from Science at all times.

[scrdest]

I still like the idea that it's cold iron and OT God is a demon or fey.
Okay that's a joke.  But I seriously do think he acts like one would expect Satan to act.  Like a lot of ancient people believed.

No, it's just that GOD FUEL CANNOT MELT IRON BEAMS CHARIOTS

[Calidovi]

I still like the idea that it's cold iron and OT God is a demon or fey.
Okay that's a joke.  But I seriously do think he acts like one would expect Satan to act.  Like a lot of ancient people believed.

No, it's just that GOD FUEL CANNOT MELT IRON BEAMS CHARIOTS

God's wrath can't melt iron chariots.