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What's your opinion on free will?

I am religious and believe in free will
- 71 (27.7%)
I am religious and do not believe in free will
- 10 (3.9%)
I am not religious and believe in free will
- 114 (44.5%)
I am not religious and do not believe in free will
- 61 (23.8%)

Total Members Voted: 251


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Author Topic: Railgun and Spirituality Discussion  (Read 681196 times)

Frumple

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Re: Religion and Spirituality Discussion: Everyone's a Coptic in Their Own Way
« Reply #5355 on: March 05, 2016, 09:45:27 am »

I actually had those three in mind off the top of my head :P

Zoro was nice-ish but got ganked pretty hard and is now more or less very dead, Zen was pretty strongly correlated with the whole samurai thing (which came with nasty, nasty associations) -- it's branched out a lot since, but considering the starting point and initial run it definitely had/has a lot of things very, very wrong -- zionism's basically the conspiracy world's boogieman... I think the observation stands pretty well. They're either very badly flawed, dead, or have a rather rough reputation. I'm having trouble thinking of a Z* that doesn't have a fair amount of trouble, heh.
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Teneb

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Re: Religion and Spirituality Discussion: Everyone's a Coptic in Their Own Way
« Reply #5356 on: March 05, 2016, 09:48:07 am »

The Zunists got it right.
Praise the Zun!

...

Also RIP Zunism, victim of the Abbasids.
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Rolan7

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Re: Religion and Spirituality Discussion: Everyone's a Coptic in Their Own Way
« Reply #5357 on: March 05, 2016, 10:53:56 am »

I'm catching up with the thread, still 5 pages behind.  (Zunism is neat though!)
Fakedit:  Crap, didn't mean to type so much O_o  Sorry.

Those are easy commandments to confuse. "Coveting thy neighbor's wife" sounds a lot like adultery. Also that part does specify gender.

Quote from: Exodus 20:17 (NIV)
You shall not covet your neighbor’s house. You shall not covet your neighbor’s wife, or his male or female servant, his ox or donkey, or anything that belongs to your neighbor.
Quote from: Exodus 20:17 (KJV)
Thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's house, thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's wife, nor his manservant, nor his maidservant, nor his ox, nor his ass, nor any thing that is thy neighbour's.
What if you covet thy neighbour's husband? Or the neighbour himself/herself?

Since I shitposted in the past, I would like to point out this is an honest question. (though perhaps I should note that it is my religious duty to occasionally shitpost)
Covered in the KJV:  It's okay as long as you don't covet his butt.
(This is not an honest answer)
The real answer is that that commandment is telling you not to covet your neighbor's property.  Women were property, men weren't, so a woman coveting a man makes no sense.  IE it's "covet" in the "seek to own" sense.

That's why adultery is a separate commandment, which (while vague and long-debated) is probably gender neutral.
It takes a lot of assumptions to decide that god could have made the universe a lot better and that it deserves to die for the choices it's made. Maybe this is the best possible universe, and god is the only thing stopping it from being completely hellish. I sure don't know, so I wouldn't use the state of the universe as justification to kill anything.

If godlike entities revealed themselves, I would want to learn from them. I would try to ask them questions if they're a sentient entity and follow them if necessary. If the universe is run by an impersonal force like karma, I'd try to study it in a more scientific way.
"Best" is pretty relative...  But certain diseases and parasitic creatures make it hard to argue that this is the best universe for humanity.  Maybe if the universe was only created initially, and then passively observed as everything evolved...  In that case things are pretty decent.

But yeah, it'd probably be a lot smarter to be diplomatic with a superior entity.  Assuming the entity is "outside the universe", which basically makes the universe a simulation:  Even if there's a theoretical way to escape, like a program escaping a virtual machine (which is nearly impossible with proper safeties), we probably aren't nearly advanced enough to do so yet.  And we're just as guilty of running unpleasant simulations, so we can't really judge the entity without hypocrisy.

The main concern would be that we may be "ruining the experiment" by becoming aware of our situation.  Or, we could be completing the experiment (with similar results for us, but at least we won?)  Or possibly our universe was meant to develop a new race of unique sophonts, and we will be allowed to interact with the real world.

So either we try to hide what we know until we can escape, or we try to communicate with the Furthest Ring and hope they're benevolent.
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ChairmanPoo

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Re: Religion and Spirituality Discussion: Everyone's a Coptic in Their Own Way
« Reply #5358 on: March 05, 2016, 10:55:20 am »

What about Zuul the Gatekeeper?
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Rolan7

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Re: Religion and Spirituality Discussion: Everyone's a Coptic in Their Own Way
« Reply #5359 on: March 05, 2016, 11:22:07 am »

http://www.veritablehokum.com/comic/the-norse-god-family-tree/
Also:
http://www.veritablehokum.com/comic/the-egyptian-god-family-tree/
http://www.veritablehokum.com/comic/the-greek-god-family-tree/
I am only a third through the Norse deity descriptions and I'm literally crying with laughter.  I actually loved reading these stories when I was bored at school, but I forgot just how amazing they were.
I mean, that cow thing.

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TD1

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Re: Religion and Spirituality Discussion: Everyone's a Coptic in Their Own Way
« Reply #5360 on: March 09, 2016, 11:04:03 am »

I'm reading about Arkeology. It's amusing in a sad way.

http://ncse.com/cej/2/4/arkeology-new-science-support-creation
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Antioch

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Re: Religion and Spirituality Discussion: Everyone's a Coptic in Their Own Way
« Reply #5361 on: March 09, 2016, 11:12:34 am »

I'm reading about Arkeology. It's amusing in a sad way.

http://ncse.com/cej/2/4/arkeology-new-science-support-creation

They sure are enthusiastic about not having found their arc.
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Antioch

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Re: Religion and Spirituality Discussion: Everyone's a Coptic in Their Own Way
« Reply #5362 on: March 09, 2016, 11:57:25 am »

I'm reading about Arkeology. It's amusing in a sad way.

http://ncse.com/cej/2/4/arkeology-new-science-support-creation

They sure are enthusiastic about not having found their ark.
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Orange Wizard

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i2amroy

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Re: Religion and Spirituality Discussion: Everyone's a Coptic in Their Own Way
« Reply #5364 on: March 09, 2016, 08:03:02 pm »

On the Z topic, honestly Zoroastrianism's biggest issue is their whole "we don't accept converts" thing, which is basically tantamount to a religion's suicide. Honestly the only thing worse than not accepting converts in terms of helping to keep your religion alive is forbidding members to have children, since so much of people's religious choices is influenced by their parents. :P
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Kot

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Re: Religion and Spirituality Discussion: Everyone's a Coptic in Their Own Way
« Reply #5365 on: March 09, 2016, 08:05:47 pm »

The ultimate elitist religion - no converts and no children.
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penguinofhonor

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Re: Religion and Spirituality Discussion: Everyone's a Coptic in Their Own Way
« Reply #5366 on: March 09, 2016, 08:20:34 pm »

I looked up some stuff about Zoroastrianism and I discovered that there are still Zoroastrians! Who knew? They're mainly in India.

This gives me hope for the Shakers, who have managed to pull off the celibacy thing for less than three hundred years. But hey, if Zoroastrianism can last this long, they've got a shot.
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Putnam

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Re: Religion and Spirituality Discussion: Everyone's a Coptic in Their Own Way
« Reply #5367 on: March 09, 2016, 08:28:50 pm »

On the Z topic, honestly Zoroastrianism's biggest issue is their whole "we don't accept converts" thing, which is basically tantamount to a religion's suicide. Honestly the only thing worse than not accepting converts in terms of helping to keep your religion alive is forbidding members to have children, since so much of people's religious choices is influenced by their parents. :P

That and IIRC they encourage incest too...

Descan

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Re: Religion and Spirituality Discussion: Everyone's a Coptic in Their Own Way
« Reply #5368 on: March 09, 2016, 09:44:47 pm »

I thought that was only in royalty. There are no Zoroastrian royals anymore.

That and I think, even if they were, they'd just quietly drop that requirement, considering... well, everything about science and genetics. It's one thing to cling to a requirement that goes against science and biology if you've been doing it for hundreds or thousands of years, it's another when you're returning to said requirement after not doing it for said thousands of years.
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Rolepgeek

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Re: Religion and Spirituality Discussion: Everyone's a Coptic in Their Own Way
« Reply #5369 on: March 09, 2016, 11:37:43 pm »

I thought that was only in royalty. There are no Zoroastrian royals anymore.

That and I think, even if they were, they'd just quietly drop that requirement, considering... well, everything about science and genetics. It's one thing to cling to a requirement that goes against science and biology if you've been doing it for hundreds or thousands of years, it's another when you're returning to said requirement after not doing it for said thousands of years.
Fertility rates are highest between third cousins. Risks of inbreeding are also more or less minimized at that relation distance(relative to fertility,  at least). Attraction to people who look like you but not to much like you peaks about there as well.

Mild incest can go for a while. Takes time for the problems to build up.
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