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[UXLZ]

UXLZ seems to be relaying out good info about from deadchat, but I can't trust that he isn't subtly changing a few people's names around. If UXLZ were scum, everything relayed from yesterday must have been good information otherwise none of the other players would respond today. Of course UXLZ might be transcribing everything correctly even if he's scum since none of the people in deadchat are correct.

Erm, so what actually makes me a scumpick? All you've really said is 'he may or may not be lying/transcribing deadchat stuff incorrectly.' Come on, you've gotta have something more concrete than 'he might be scum and could be doing scummy things therefore he is a member of the scumteam.'
Even if your reason is 'gut feeling', please at least put that down.

Deus, Scripten, and UXLZ:  Can you summarize your cases on ZU?  I'm not sure I understand why he's getting the votes he is.

OMGUSing Scripten, general 'off' feeling, suspicious slot, OMGUSing me ( at least it seems that way thus far, though without the vote), weird night action.

In addition, UXLZ:  If you think Tiruin is so scummy, why aren't you voting her?

Where do I call her scummy? What makes you think I think she's more scummy than my current vote? The argument above us isn't me accusing Tiruin of being scum, it's just me arguing with her because she keeps insulting me and my scumhunting methods because she disagrees with them for personal reasons.

Who do you think are part of the scumteam? What's your opinion on Scripten thinking Tiruin was town yesterday and scum today? What are your thoughts on Persus?

Even on D4 it's pretty hard to pick an entire scumteam, especially given the lack of useful night-game we've had. I can give you my reads if you want, but asking me to name three people as definite scum is a bit much.
Erm... I have no thoughts? People's opinions are allowed to change due to new data, y'know. Especially given all the especially strange night-actions we had going on, I don't really see why his opinion on Tiruin changing is something to be considered suspicious. Is there a point where he's said something like 'I think you are scum because x', and is now saying instead 'I think you are town because x'?
Persus? Not sure, really. I'll have to look back over his posts to really decide, and I'm out of time now, so I'll do it tomorrow.

Another thing from Cheeetar. He also mentioned that he probably won't be active any more due to Uni starting up.

Spoiler: Cheeetar (click to show/hide)

Oh- for what it's worth, my alignment detector is pointing me in the direction of Tiruin being town. This is pretty tonally based. Obviously she hasn't had as much activity as anybody else, nor has she made as many cases. From reading her posts and the PMs between us, however, I do think she's probably (?) town.

Cheeetar's leaning town for Tiruin, though I personally disagree with the idea of using 'tone' as a major measurement. Of course, Mrs Anecdotal Evidence herself will probably disagree with me, for personally biased reasons (though not necessarily incorrect ones). Tone is a fair enough basis for finding people to suspect but I disagree with using it as the sole factor by which to judge. 

[Tiruin]

Err, UXLZ, I really think you're taking this the wrong way. I was poking your playstyle there to not rely on a subset of ideas that revolves more around quantitative ideas than qualitative notions--to look at the situation from many more perspectives than what you're seeing. I'm not insulting you there--that is...how you interpret it :/ ^{Sorry if that was ever taken that way though}

Where do I call her scummy? What makes you think I think she's more scummy than my current vote? The argument above us isn't me accusing Tiruin of being scum, it's just me arguing with her because she keeps insulting me and my scumhunting methods because she disagrees with them for personal reasons.

...I think its implied in your many posts.

Of course you didn't receive one Tiruin, you're in the DEFINITELY LYNCH section. >_>
The people I PM'd it to were: Scripten, Cheeetar, Deus, Persus. I was originally going to send it to Jim instead of Cheeetar since I didn't like the way he'd been acting since D3 but NQT didn't want me to Looks like he was right, too.

@Tiruin: It's not only lack of activity that's making NQT condemn you so much, you know, Mrs Anecdotal Evidence.

-snipped stuff about statistics-

You seem to be misunderstanding exactly what I'm doing with those numbers, but oh well, the choice is yours. If you want to neglect a part of your scumhunting arsenal then who am I to judge? Oh wait, right... That's what I'm supposed to do.
I guess it's understandable why you wouldn't like that kind of thinking though, Tiruin, after all, statistically you're by far the scummiest player here, Mrs 'I didn't do anything until day three.'

Given this note, it seems you're leaning more into NQT's way of scumhunting..than doing your own technique. Your secondary weapon to his primary weapon, so to speak. (That was, before you brought up his post)

Also why I asked

UXLZ, as the speaker of the dead, I would like you to speak for Cheeetar, NQT, and the rest of those who have been slain. I can detect errors in consistency of your words, if they are fraudulent or falsified.

In addition to your opinion, bring up those of Cheeetar (who is relevant due to his connection with me and other matters we've discussed in PMs), and the rest of the dead.

is because I want to hear from pisskop and the rest, too. Those who've been really tied into the lynch in the past days--and how they see those who have voted them; this is using NQT's scumhunting vote-pattern analysis, along with the ideas of those who were subjected to such a lynch.

...And you could drop that bit on Anecdotal Evidence when it doesn't really apply, thanks.

Also...

Sorry Urist but I really can't see that as anything but an OMGUS. The ask for explanation is understandable but the vote is completely unnecessary.

^ Could I ask what you define as an OMGUS, UXLZ?
By definition, it seems like you're seeing his vote as something without substance; What of it makes it already conclusive that it can be related to an OMGUS?

[zombie urist]

Erm, so what actually makes me a scumpick? All you've really said is 'he may or may not be lying/transcribing deadchat stuff incorrectly.' Come on, you've gotta have something more concrete than 'he might be scum and could be doing scummy things therefore he is a member of the scumteam.'
Even if your reason is 'gut feeling', please at least put that down.

Well you're one of the only people left who fits into the team I gave.

OMGUSing Scripten, general 'off' feeling, suspicious slot, OMGUSing me ( at least it seems that way thus far, though without the vote), weird night action.

These are some pretty terrible reasons. What do you mean by general 'off' feeling? How was my night action weird when I did exactly what I claimed I would do?

Where do I call her scummy? What makes you think I think she's more scummy than my current vote? The argument above us isn't me accusing Tiruin of being scum, it's just me arguing with her because she keeps insulting me and my scumhunting methods because she disagrees with them for personal reasons.

Then stop wasting time arguing with her and do some actual scumhunting.

Even on D4 it's pretty hard to pick an entire scumteam, especially given the lack of useful night-game we've had. I can give you my reads if you want, but asking me to name three people as definite scum is a bit much.

Yeah some reads would be nice, preferably with solid justifications and not "he feels off". I'll be very suspicious if your top few picks aren't compatible with each other though like Scripten's.

Persus? Not sure, really. I'll have to look back over his posts to really decide, and I'm out of time now, so I'll do it tomorrow.

Please do.

[Deus Asmoth]

Sorry Urist but I really can't see that as anything but an OMGUS. The ask for explanation is understandable but the vote is completely unnecessary.

So I can't vote him because he's voting me?

The implication that someone voting for you is an adequate reason for voting for them is bizarre.

Also you completely misunderstood what I'm saying here. I was going to vote him even if he wasn't voting me.

Oh, good. Why?

Jim would have nothing to gain by bussing you [Toaster]

Its true and if you think otherwise please explain how bussing Toaster at that point in the game would be helpful. When Jim first voted Toaster no one else was and he simply could have voted Shakerag because they were about equally lurky.

Already gone over this. Disassociating themselves in case one of them gets lynched later, for a start. Scum vote for each other quite a lot from what I've seen to accomplish that and go on to other cases later in the day, so I'm not sure why you think there's no possible benefit in scumJim voting for scumToaster early in the day with the intention of going on to a more likely lynch later on. Once the wagon built he wouldn't exactly have been able to go on to someone else when Toaster didn't defend himself without raising suspicion.

plus his claim that scum wouldn't be voting during LYLO, which is... odd.

It looks like you missed the part where I pointed out this was just a typing mistake.

I did miss that part. Since it seems to be coming up a lot, could you explain why scum buddies would not be trying to make themselves look like enemies by voting for each other?

Then his claim that he thought that Cheeetar was scum for defending Tiruin and wasting peoples' time by getting them to explain their votes which I can't really see as anything other than an attempt to get towncred by targeting their NK target with his power.

There was more reasons why I thought Cheeetar was scum. Also the last part is WIFOM.

1, Excellent, what were they?
2, Obviously.

Well one of the people you PM'd must have been scum since Cheeetar was killed last night and he was the top 'town' player according to that spreadsheet.

What brought about this idea? Cheeetar seems like a high-threat kill to me, given that NQT and Cheeet are very evident kill-targets given how they were doing their thing in the last 2 days.

Why was Cheeetar high threat? IMO he was totally useless D2 and D3 considering how wrong he was about Pisskop. I guess killing him would bring about LYLO faster but that's about it. I'm speculating the reason they killed Cheeetar because if the other people UXLZ PM'd trusted NQT, then Cheeetar would become a nearly confirmed town and that would be bad, especially since Cheeetar is enchanter.

You tell me I'm working with WIFOM and then come up with this gem.

[zombie urist]

Because he's scummy.
He could have easily voted Tiruin after I tied the vote, especially since he said that he was ok with a Tiruin lynch.
The benefit of looking like enemies is far less than the drawback of losing a scum member in almost every case, unless the scum member did something really stupid so that everyone thinks he's scum. Also in Mylo/lylo its much less reasonable to bus since a mislynch would secure the win for scum.
Spending most of the entire D2 focusing on Pisskop, suspicious voting/unvoting timing that coincided with my vote/unvote, saying that enchanter was a very visible role.

[Deus Asmoth]

Why are you giving your reasons for voting Jim when I asked you why you voted for Scripten and suspected Cheeetar?

[zombie urist]

I didn't. I realize I didnt post reasons for Scripten and I'm on phone so I'll do that later. But those reasons are for cheerar

[UXLZ]

You know, I had more stuff here but it seems to have just sort of... 'Unloaded' from the post and kind of disappeared (it contained replies to Tiruin and ZU, but I guess they weren't too major.) It's very irritating so there's some stuff I won't be responding to what I probably should have just yet. I did a spiel explaining why your method of scumhunting doesn't really work very well ZU (trying to figure out whole teams via associative reads rather than objective stuff.)

These are some pretty terrible reasons. What do you mean by general 'off' feeling? How was my night action weird when I did exactly what I claimed I would do?

Eh, did you? I thought it was strange that you'd choose to block Cheeetar when I believe you suspected Toaster more but my memory may be failing me. I may have been remembering incorrectly.

Then stop wasting time arguing with her and do some actual scumhunting.

It was during the post you're quoting that I stopped arguing with her.

Yeah some reads would be nice, preferably with solid justifications and not "he feels off". I'll be very suspicious if your top few picks aren't compatible with each other though like Scripten's.

'Not compatible'? What do you mean not compatible? Almost every scumteam is compatible, you're just leaning way too hard (as I said earlier) on associative reading. Saying that 'Persus and Deus can't be an a scum team because they PM'd each other' is NOT good reasoning. They're perfectly capable of doing that if they're on the same team.
Anyway. To put it on a continuum (though of course the actual opinion isn't so tidy.)
ZU and Tiruin are fairly close but ZU is currently ahead.

Tiruin    - Heavy leaning scum.
ZU        - Leaning scum.
Toaster  - Null leaning scum.
Jim        - Null. Very, very slight scum lean.
Persus    - Null leaning town.
Scripten  - Leaning town.
Deus       - Heavy leaning own.

Spoiler: More Detail (click to show/hide)

ZU: (Apparent, to me at least) OMGUSing of Scripten/Myself, D1 actions, D2 actions, weird tone, scummy slot, N4 actions (until I find where he said he'd be blocking Cheeetar at least). Actually, I don't really have many, come to think of it. I may have just been over reacting to the OMGUS or something... Hmm... Updated the readings list above, originally ZU was 'Heavy leaning scum.' Still have him as leaning scum, because for some reason I can't seem to shake the feeling that there's something wrong with him.

Toaster: Similar 'inactivity' to Tiruin's D1 and 2. Unlike Tiruin, he's actually contributing when he posts so there's plusses there. Still considered scum because D3/4 lurking is a big red flag.

Tiruin: Heavy active lurking D1/2, incredibly passive play, lack of suspects (she seems to be null or town on everyone in the game, incredible reluctance to vote (she had to be prompted by NQT several times Day 2 to actually place her first vote). Even the person she's voting for at the moment she doesn't seem to actually think is scum or be paying much attention to (she's defending herself and not really doing anything towards them). Lack of reasons. Overall tone of posts (highly obfuscating information as well as her intentions. However, this last reason may be a fault with me rather than her.) NQT's analysis (though outdated) places her as the most certain to be scum, as far as I can tell the only people she's pushed on have been people who've pushed on her.
Note: She may have unvoted and is currently not voting for someone (I may have seen a line earlier implying that but I'm not sure). However, in that case it's even worse than not pushing her voting target, not having someone to vote for on D4 is a pretty grievous sin.

Jim: Very hard to read for some reason. Normally I'd say he's scum but something about him is striking me as 'off' in a way that doesn't make me think that. If it weren't for the unlikeliness of a third party at this point (as well as NQT's N1 results) I'd call third party.

I can do the town reads reasoning as well if you want me to, but that seems quite a bit less important.

Actually... Sorry ZU,

Unvote

I really don't know why I wasn't voting for you over Tiruin.

Please do.

Noting that I haven't forgotten about this; I'm just at school and can't use the tracker. I won't be home for about 8 hours so it won't be up for at least nine.

[Mephansteras]

UXLZ, are you voting Tiruin?

[UXLZ]

Yeah, sorry Meph, I tried to do a correction post but the computer froze.

Tiruin.

[Mephansteras]

The Whiteboard
zombie urist: Deus Asmoth, Scripten
Persus13: Tiruin
Scripten: zombie urist
Tiruin: Persus13, UXLZ
Toaster: Jim Groovester


Day ends ~5pm Pacific Wednesday. There are no more extensions available for this day.


@UXLZ: It's cool. Just making sure. I fixed it.

[Deus Asmoth]

UXLZ, what are your actual reasons for voting for Tiruin? I'm finding it difficult for filter it out from all the tsundere going on between you.

[UXLZ]

Did you miss the spoiler in my recent post?

[Jim Groovester]

I'm not quite adjusted to my new schedule yet and if this game wasn't almost over I would probably replace out.

I'm not going to be online for the deadline tomorrow. I'll see if I can sneak a few minutes in to see which way the lynch is looking but don't count on it.

But back to the pertinent question: Why did you not use your power? Yes, its understandable that it would be a choice to 'catch me in my fakeclaim' under the situation where I am assumed to do the kill, but how did that situation overcome pretty much anything else in considering the nightly plan or...basically how you saw it?

Ugggggh haven't I already talked about this a lot?

I did it because I thought it was a good idea and it was part of my plan.

And your snide sense of superiority as well as your own personal traits are equally vulnerable and far easier to manipulate. I fail to see your point. I fail to see why I should care.

OH SNAPZ the trash talk is starting hey wait a second.

[color=transparent]Hum de hum~ Pushing Rinrin, as far as she goes, where she'll end up, nobody knows![/color]

Oh.

Why are you being deliberately abrasive towards Tiruin and what are you hoping to get out of it?

Jim:  Do you feel that the small chance to catch Tiruin out on the lie was worth giving up the chance on tracking the killer/watching the victim or following Plan A?

It wouldn't have been a small chance if people followed my plan.

:'(

It seemed worth it at the time, yes.

Jim: Any fishier than you complaining about people not following a plan that you had no intention of following yourself?

Except he did follow his plan.

No he didn't. His plan said that he'd follow someone. He didn't follow anyone, so he didn't follow his plan. Unless you meant the private plan that he shared with no one and that no one would have any reason to believe him about if he did catch someone out.

Here's what I said:

Jim Groovester visits a target of his choice.

Nobody is a valid target, so in a strictly pedantic way I actually did what I said I was going to.

I'm wondering whether or not you actually care or if you just want to point out how bad you thought my action was.

Already gone over this. Disassociating themselves in case one of them gets lynched later, for a start. Scum vote for each other quite a lot from what I've seen to accomplish that and go on to other cases later in the day, so I'm not sure why you think there's no possible benefit in scumJim voting for scumToaster early in the day with the intention of going on to a more likely lynch later on. Once the wagon built he wouldn't exactly have been able to go on to someone else when Toaster didn't defend himself without raising suspicion.

Why would I push for his lynch very near the end of the day though? It wasn't a sure thing that there would be enough people to jump on Shakerag. I just could've been quiet instead.

That's a really shitty scum gambit. It risks getting two votes for the scumteam killed when that's something worth keeping around.

Jim: why did you decide yesterday was a good day for a massclaim?

Because it was the day before milo/lylo. When would be a better time for a massclaim? There's a whole night for the town to gather information to make a good judgment about who t lynch on Day 4.

[UXLZ]

Oh.

Why are you being deliberately abrasive towards Tiruin and what are you hoping to get out of it?

Entertainment, venting, the joy of curiosity. I also felt obliged to defend myself from her seemingly senseless attacks on my method of playing the game.
Also, since people kept calling me a tsundere I felt like I had to, y'know.
There was also the small chance it would cause a slip-up or something but honestly that was never that likely.