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[Naryar]

Are tantrum spirals On their way out now? it seems that since not all dwarves respond to stress with unrestrained violence, it doesn't seem like one unhappy dwarf will cause the collapse of the entire fortress anymore.

It seems tantrum spirals are a thing of the past, yes.

Although this "Urist has been terrified by seeing a goblin die" is annoying. They didn't even see them die.

I can understand the stress due to seeing that corpse of a dehydrated child that died out of failed mood, but the goblins ?

[Larix]

Well, it's called empathy. It's a dwarven thing. A goblin just won't understand

[Naryar]

Well, it's called empathy. It's a dwarven thing. A goblin just won't understand

You mean empathy for people who are trying to kill you, and your family, friends and most of what you hold dear ?

[Larix]

Yep, it's an emotional reaction which doesn't always agree with cold-hearted rationalism.

PS: i just wanted to state that you're not speaking for all players and aren't voicing an uncontradictable factual position.

[bluephoenix]

Well, it's called empathy. It's a dwarven thing. A goblin just won't understand

You mean empathy for people who are trying to kill you, and your family, friends and most of what you hold dear ?

Yeah it's like in The Lord of the Rings how everyone started crying after they saw an Orc get killed.

[Naryar]

Well, it's called empathy. It's a dwarven thing. A goblin just won't understand

You mean empathy for people who are trying to kill you, and your family, friends and most of what you hold dear ?

Yeah it's like in The Lord of the Rings how everyone started crying after they saw an Orc get killed.

And the worst is despite all this "Urist has been horrified due to seeing a goblin die", they don't even progress to "gets used to tragedy" "is a hardened individual" etc scale.

Seriously I have some dwarves which have entire screens of these thoughts at the same time (like +- 30), but no.

[Eldin00]

Dwarves can still get "is getting used to tragedy", "doesn't care about much of anything anymore", etc. But I've noticed that some of them seem to get it much more slowly than others, and some never seem to become used to tragedy at all, no matter how much of it they experience.

[Meneth]

I've used single militiadorfs instead of hunters, and they tend to get "doesn't care about anything anymore" in a few years, without getting horrified, just by killing a lot of animals.

"Urist didn't feel anything after seeing a Porcupine die."

[Kestrel]

In my long-lived forts this has become something of a problem.  Each goblin invasion litters my entrance with enemy corpses, and their subsequent disposal brings panic and depression amongst my dwarven populace.  Half the population is stressed out, and about 5% of the population regularly throw tantrums.  The fort is utterly decadent; its residents live in abject luxury.  They don't care.  They'll never be happy.

I'm considering using burrows in future forts to dedicate a small team of unfortunate souls in charge of surface cleanup and recovery.  It's frustrating to have to micromanage something else, particularly because I doubt the new stress system is fully working as intended.

[Reelya]

Maybe change how you deal with invasions. A quick fix is to stick an atom-smasher in the battle zone, then you can just obliterate the remains. longer term you can direct siegers to a specific area for the battle. Either drown them or fight them followed by magma flooding.

[Kestrel]

Thank you for the suggestion.

Generally I let archers soften up invaders, then let a few get mangled in traps, then my fortress guard come out and finish what's left.  They're all bunkered outdoors fulltime, and I've had no morale problems with any of them.

I don't care for atom smashing the goblins.  Such a waste.  In my most recent embark I've modified the raws so dorfs will butcher sapient_other. 

[Reelya]

You might like a little thing I invented once. a 1-wide tunnel with 3 hatches linked to 1 pressure plate. Two hatches are in front and behind, and the third one is above, holding back river water. a goblin hits the plate, opening all 3 hatches then gets flushed down by water pressure. These tunnels let dwarves through but automatically trigger on invaders. A very useful component.

Below the floor hatches, i used to put a 3x1 retracting bridge, so goblins would auto-drown in there (dead goblins accumulate in there like a roach trap). Then the goblinite could be dropped below via a lever pull, to my forge level. The only flaw with this set-up was that goblins would run away once enough drowned, so I'm planning a version which uses 3x1 floor grates rather than the 3x1 retracting bridge, so I can keep the goblins alive until I want to dispose of them (this would give many options too on how to handle them).

Yeah, so it's totally possible to quickly and simply trap large sieges to deal with them later.

[Kestrel]

Very clever!  I'll have to check that out sometime.

I do love the creative solutions DF players come up with.

[FukkenSaved]

Once dwarves get stressed you'll need to first relieve them of noble and military duty if possible, then give them a bedroom and if that is not enough you'll have to make a special burrow for them without negative stimuli. With Dwarf Therapist you can sort in caste by happiness to see the most stressed dwarves, and look at their thoughts to se the causes.

[Skullsploder]

Most of my fort's population is getting used to tragedy or is a hardened individual. Pretty much all the full time military don't care about anything anymore, including the mid and lower level soldiers.

The correlation I've noticed is between discipline skill and rate of tragedy training. My entire fort is in military squads, so in their off time they practice with crossbow or do individual drills. The dwarves with the most discipline tend to be more hardened.

However, this may be correlation without causation because I know discipline is also trained by seeing dead bodies and combat, which also harden an individual.

The other point is that surviving major injuries has given many of my dwarves doesn't care about anything anymore. A stressed Stoneworker got his leg lopped off in an undead siege and went straight to negative stress levels. So, amusingly, an excellent stress cure seems to be the lopping off of dwarves' limbs.