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[Angle]

It really is a stupid pretense to act like the political parties aren't a part of our government, if they can do that o our elected officials.

Thiiiiiiiiiiiis. So much this. If the quote was a bit more self explanatory, I'd sig it.

[Flying Dice]

That's ultimately a product of the electoral system and the state of campaign finance though, not the parties. They just recognized which way the wind was blowing and institutionalized it.

[redwallzyl]

you talking about the John Oliver video? yes that stuff is really stupid.

also burn republican party: http://www.cnn.com/2016/04/24/politics/charles-koch-hillary-clinton-2016/ 

[Rolepgeek]

Yes, those are the common cliches.  Politicians are whores to the fundraisers and are incapable of independent thought or conviction.  I too am familiar with such cliches.  My personal favorite rendition of this song is the Gilbert and Sullivan version.

They aren't cliches, and that wasn't what I was saying. They very much are capable of independent thought and action. The ones who succeed are the ones who use those actions to do things that will get them elected. Politicians have a job to do, and that job is get into office, before all else. That has to be priority one, even for people who genuinely want to make a difference. Hell, I said basically nothing about fundraising, and while it was a bit wall-y, if you actually think I'm wrong on some of those, I'd love to hear where.

[Andux]

CBS did a story on the fundraising thing, too; they even got some video from inside one of the call centers:

http://www.cbsnews.com/videos/dialing-for-dollars/

Forget the Capitol, that's where people should be picketing if they want money out of politics.


Point of interest: David Jolly, the congressman in the CBS video, also debated Rep. Alan Grayson in the Florida Open Debate yesterday.

[mainiac]

They aren't cliches,

They are cliches if you insist they are an explanation to everything.  Someone said they thought Donald Trump or Ted Cruz would pick a woman VP.  I said I thought they wouldn't.  I do not see how fundraising sheds light on this issue.  When every conversation comes back to "oh but remember the whole system sucks!" despite that's irrelevance, it's conversation by cliche.

[Shadowlord]

They aren't cliches,

They are cliches if you insist they are an explanation to everything.  Someone said they thought Donald Trump or Ted Cruz would pick a woman VP.  I said I thought they wouldn't.  I do not see how fundraising sheds light on this issue.

Aren't you the one who brought fundraising up?

I stopped reading rolepgeek's post after the fourth "Think like someone who"

[mainiac]

No?

Me and my brother went to vote.  My brother had forgotten to change his registration from Green.  One man, one vote.  I am the one man.  It feels good.

[SalmonGod]

On topic?

Just saw a collection of little graphics shared around about the democrat superdelegates.  I wonder if there's a comprehensive information source on all the superdelegates somewhere?

Spoiler: Sample (click to show/hide)

[mainiac]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Democratic_Party_superdelegates,_2016

[smjjames]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Democratic_Party_superdelegates,_2016

The president can be a superdelegate? Huh, didn't know that.

[mainiac]

Every former democratic president and vice president is a super delegate.  They are the leadership of the democratic party...

This idea isn't complicated.  The party exists to do stuff.  It's not an exercise in democracy as an intellectual exercise, it's a collection of like minded individuals for collective action.  Those like minded individuals place value in those who have loyalty to the cause including everyone from your state black leadership committee chairwoman and that skeezy prison lobbyist all the way up to the POTUS.

[smjjames]

Every former democratic president and vice president is a super delegate.  They are the leadership of the democratic party...

I knew that, just wasn't sure if the currently sitting president could actually go to the convention or something. If his schedule allows it anyway.

[mainiac]

Sitting presidents dont endorse by tradition but that's only by tradition.

[Shadowlord]

On topic?

Just saw a collection of little graphics shared around about the democrat superdelegates.  I wonder if there's a comprehensive information source on all the superdelegates somewhere?

Spoiler: Sample (click to show/hide)

Was that the worst one?

Spoiler: instead of clicking maniac's wikipedia link, I made this, because it was more fun (click to show/hide)