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[Powder Miner]

The EU isn't like the US at all, it is separate countries with sovereign governments and the Eurozone isn't one combined economy, just multiple with a lot of tying factors bringing them to cooperate, which is really important to note. Besides, I can hear the constant bickering about the NHS, for example, from here. That said, if an administrative redesign could somehow raise benefits while massively destroying cost, I'd be all for it -- I'm just skeptical it could.

As for defense spending -- first you go out of your way to make a point about percentages of budgets and now you make a point about absolute spending? I see that stat over and over and over again, but it's important to remember that A. our GDP is... really really big, and a lot of industry goes into the military so that's more applicable than it would be with things like Social Security. It may be bigger than the next ten combined in terms of absolute money, but it sure isn't in terms of percentage. Not at all. And then there's another thing. One of the reasons we are so much bigger is because most of the top ten there is far lower than it would be if we didn't have their backs. That stat is only true because we support NATO, Japan, and South Korea.

But this is irrelevant to my earlier point. My earlier point is that cutting defense as the spending mainstay is very silly because it really isn't the big spending giant of the budget -- it doesn't even come close, and the size of other nations' militaries doesn't really affect this. Cutting defense spending wouldn't be all that effective, because it isn't that big of a percent of a budget compared to, again, entitlements, which are ever-increasing due to demographic trends.

[mainiac]

Because it isn't comparable at all to entitlement spending, which constantly increases in percentage.

And has a dedicated revenue stream. 

The US government is basically two different things.  You have a government that does military and the DMV and FCC and stuff.  And you have an insurance and retirement company that uses payroll taxes to pay for stuff.  And it's a really efficient insurance and retirement company.  It's not the very most efficient like Vanguard but it's more efficient then most of the private ones, especially in healthcare.  For decades the insurance company has been loaning money to the government at sub market rates.  This money was used to pay for general government stuff.  And most general government stuff is the military like the Iraq war for instance.

Now the retirement and insurance company isn't running a huge surplus anymore.  It was running that surplus because it was stashing that money away for future payouts when the demographics shifted.  People paid into the system and they expect a payout.

But some people are saying that the retirement and insurance company needs to run a surplus in every year.  Well if that was the case, why the everliving fuck did people spend three decades paying extra retirement and insurance money to finance a future need?  It's stealing money that working class people paid into a financially sound system.  That money is then used to pay for general government in place of general tax revenues.  And most of general government is the military.  Then to cover the shortfall because you just stole from the retirement and insurance company, you cut benefits for the next generation but still expect them to pay the same amount.

[birdy51]

To me the question is less; "How much are we paying?", but more "Who is getting paid here?"

It makes me curious.

[Powder Miner]

According to the SSA itself, at the present rate, Social Security cannot sustain itself as it is now and will take a huge hit before the next generation rolls in. It's not that it's scooting along super happily and now people want to take it away because they want a surplus constantly; it's because social security is falling apart and at the current rate it's going to take HARSHER benefit cuts that would be necessary if we just cut a bit right now.

[mainiac]

I don't remember jesus saying Ceasar was the one to be giving generious.

Nah I was just saying after taxes Jesus would still be saying give your money. Please don't assume that I think the bible should be US law.

I just want to point out that you lied about your earlier statement and then said that I was strawmanning you.  Your statement was about government spending and you said I shouldn't accuse you of talking about anything other then personal actions.  So I engaged with your statement and then you lied about what you said.

According to the SSA itself, at the present rate, Social Security cannot sustain itself as it is now and will take a huge hit before the next generation rolls in. It's not that it's scooting along super happily and now people want to take it away because they want a surplus constantly; it's because social security is falling apart and at the current rate it's going to take HARSHER benefit cuts that would be necessary if we just cut a bit right now.

Which is a completely different thing then saying that entitlement spending is the cause of our problems.  I would be willing to address this statement but I refuse to jump from topic to topic like this where addressing a point doesn't matter because the topic is change.

[Powder Miner]

Here, give me a second to try to unify my thoughts, I'm beginning to dizzy myself with all the back and forth too.

[Shadowlord]

I'm going to bow out here. I should be doing anything other than arguing on the internet and I realize that if I get into this much I'll be here for the next four hours. (Which is mostly why I've said barely anything so far!)

Have fun, I guess?

[mainiac]

Be like me and work from home so you are stuck here for the next four hours anyway.

[Powder Miner]

I'm at school :V
break periods ahooooy

[mainiac]

One day you can graduate to sitting in a completely different chair in front of a completely different desk.

[Frumple]

Ideally, anyway. Gods help you if you end up working for one of those businesses that has their employees work from a treadmill.

[Powder Miner]

Well, my present plan of action is to go into a political field of some variety, so, hey, this is almost practice.

[Frumple]

And now we shall call you Graft Miner, in consideration for your intended field of work

[mainiac]

Ideally, anyway. Gods help you if you end up working for one of those businesses that has their employees work from a treadmill.

I believe that is the mythical unsubsidized energy source that Sprin was talking about before.

And now we shall call you Graft Miner, in consideration for your intended field of work

Let the shitposting commence.

[origamiscienceguy]

apparently there's some monkey business going on in Colorado for the GOP.