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Author Topic: Murrican Politics Megathread 2016: There Will Be Hell Toupée  (Read 1570772 times)

Ibid Straydrink

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Re: Donald J. Trump's Jet Fuel Can't Melt Steel Beams 2016 Megathread
« Reply #15060 on: March 19, 2016, 01:36:34 am »

By adding a third, overlapping political influence, I feel that it would necessarily establish a more contiguous legislative and even judicial trend.
I don't know why people keep bringing this up, as if it would even work.

The problem with the American system is that, because for the most part it's winner-take-all first-past-the-post percentage based, any third party would mean the party most opposite to them would always win. If you have 51% of the vote one time, and 49% of the vote the next time, and it keeps switching back and forth every election, then what happens if a party that's very similar to you (like Democrats compared to Green party) gets 5-10% of the vote? Or worse, 25+%?

Then that makes you got between 25 to 45% of the vote, the republicans can get maybe 45-49% of the vote (I'm sure some people would go from republican to green, but their bases aren't exactly 100% overlapping, yeah?) and then the Republicans win. And the next time, greens take from democrat party, republicans get under 50%, and win again. And again. And again.

Unless and until the American system starts switching over to proportional, where (for example) the House of Representatives are based on percentages in the entire state rather than who gets the plurality in a single district, then this will keep happening. Eventually, as people get fed up with never having a say in government and pivot so that everyone votes on the same party instead of splitting the vote, the system will re-stabilize on either the Democrat/Republican two-party system again, or Green-Republican two-party system again, but either way, the third party will wither and die back to the point where it no longer acts as a spoiler to their closer ideological ally. 

tl;dr it is literally impossible for a third party to become viable in America, unless and until structural changes to the voting system are made, and saying "man it would be great if we added a third party" is completely ignoring this
What about partisan alliances? I.e., party A and party B jointly nominate a candidate in the best interest of both after extensive compromises, to overcome party C, while still retaining borders due to the distinct difference of values among their electorate?

Direct democracy would also remedy that problem, but... I'd prefer robots. :P
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“I am the spirit that negates. And rightly so, for all that comes to be. Deserves to perish wretchedly; 'Twere better nothing would begin."

Ibid Straydrink

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Re: Donald J. Trump's Jet Fuel Can't Melt Steel Beams 2016 Megathread
« Reply #15061 on: March 19, 2016, 01:39:07 am »

Oh, Trump's motivations are clear: time spent debunking and mocking his absurd remarks is time not spent on digging up some actually meaningful dirt that could hurt his campaign. His supporters don't care what people say about what he says, so he can say whatever he wants. The rest love to lament, movk, and debunk his remarks, to no effect on his constituency. He is throwing steaks to wolves so they don't chew up his legs, and it's working.

That's exactly it. If nothing else, his opponents should go ahead and just frame the man for something damnable, though, at this point, I'm not sure his base would really care or believe any accusations brought against him, true or false.
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“I am the spirit that negates. And rightly so, for all that comes to be. Deserves to perish wretchedly; 'Twere better nothing would begin."

BFEL

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Re: Donald J. Trump's Jet Fuel Can't Melt Steel Beams 2016 Megathread
« Reply #15062 on: March 19, 2016, 02:41:20 am »

If nothing else, his opponents should go ahead and just frame the man for something damnable
Yes, because what American politics really needs is MORE straight up lies.
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Ibid Straydrink

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Re: Donald J. Trump's Jet Fuel Can't Melt Steel Beams 2016 Megathread
« Reply #15063 on: March 19, 2016, 03:35:34 am »

If nothing else, his opponents should go ahead and just frame the man for something damnable
Yes, because what American politics really needs is MORE straight up lies.

At this point, who would know the difference, and to what effect if the end was good?
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Morrigi

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Re: Donald J. Trump's Jet Fuel Can't Melt Steel Beams 2016 Megathread
« Reply #15064 on: March 19, 2016, 03:36:44 am »

New anti-Hillary attack ad out, Trump has been shitposting on Instagram.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=17EOM3RTD1Y
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Rose

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Re: Donald J. Trump's Jet Fuel Can't Melt Steel Beams 2016 Megathread
« Reply #15065 on: March 19, 2016, 03:42:34 am »

If nothing else, his opponents should go ahead and just frame the man for something damnable
Yes, because what American politics really needs is MORE straight up lies.

At this point, who would know the difference, and to what effect if the end was good?
I'm seeing some hypocrisy here.
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Reelya

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Re: Donald J. Trump's Jet Fuel Can't Melt Steel Beams 2016 Megathread
« Reply #15066 on: March 19, 2016, 03:43:51 am »

We should stop with the Trump / Hitler comparisons. Basically the reality is totally different. I mean, it's not like the choice of US president has ever lead to massive human rights abuses, and millions of deaths.

RedKing

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Re: Donald J. Trump's Jet Fuel Can't Melt Steel Beams 2016 Megathread
« Reply #15067 on: March 19, 2016, 03:46:18 am »

It never starts out as a fascist dictatorship...

So what?  Redking isn't going to become a fan of fascism as an alternative to the two party system after three or four months.
I shot who in the what now?  ???

We should stop with the Trump / Hitler comparisons. Basically the reality is totally different. I mean, it's not like the choice of US president has ever lead to massive human rights abuses, and millions of deaths.
*cough* LBJ
*cough* Nixon
*cough* Reagan

Maybe not millions of *American* deaths, but a large swath of Indochina and South/Central America would like to have a word with you.


EDIT:
Speaking of Romney....isn't his family like an integral part of the Mormon hierarchy? ???
That's like saying "I love Catholics, I have a lot of Catholics friends....and the Pope is not among them. Are we sure he's Catholic? Are we really sure?" (which admittedly, would probably have some traction among conservative Catholics).
« Last Edit: March 19, 2016, 03:56:37 am by RedKing »
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Reelya

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Re: Donald J. Trump's Jet Fuel Can't Melt Steel Beams 2016 Megathread
« Reply #15068 on: March 19, 2016, 03:59:56 am »

Apparently the massive sarcasm of my remark didn't translate into text. And you missed a couple more guys from that list.

RedKing

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Re: Donald J. Trump's Jet Fuel Can't Melt Steel Beams 2016 Megathread
« Reply #15069 on: March 19, 2016, 04:04:34 am »

It's 5am, and I've been on a conference call with the Netherlands for 3 hours. Sarcasm detector is offline.

And yeah, I realized later that that was a fairly short list. Didn't even think of Dubya until later.
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Remember, knowledge is power. The power to make other people feel stupid.
Quote from: Neil DeGrasse Tyson
Science is like an inoculation against charlatans who would have you believe whatever it is they tell you.

Ibid Straydrink

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Re: Donald J. Trump's Jet Fuel Can't Melt Steel Beams 2016 Megathread
« Reply #15070 on: March 19, 2016, 04:10:30 am »

If nothing else, his opponents should go ahead and just frame the man for something damnable
Yes, because what American politics really needs is MORE straight up lies.

At this point, who would know the difference, and to what effect if the end was good?
I'm seeing some hypocrisy here.

Care to elaborate? Critical thinking is hard work. Ultimately, though, insofar as the rights and liberties of individuals remain intact... it's a game of ends, means, and interests.
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Rose

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Re: Donald J. Trump's Jet Fuel Can't Melt Steel Beams 2016 Megathread
« Reply #15071 on: March 19, 2016, 04:27:01 am »

If you're framing somebody to stop them from getting lawfully elected, you're the bad guy.
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Ibid Straydrink

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Re: Donald J. Trump's Jet Fuel Can't Melt Steel Beams 2016 Megathread
« Reply #15072 on: March 19, 2016, 04:29:49 am »

If you're framing somebody to stop them from getting lawfully elected, you're the bad guy.

So, attempting to assassinate a tyrant is wrong, because it's against the law?

Law = morality, or..?
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Shadowlord

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Re: Donald J. Trump's Jet Fuel Can't Melt Steel Beams 2016 Megathread
« Reply #15073 on: March 19, 2016, 04:31:53 am »

New anti-Hillary attack ad out, Trump has been shitposting on Instagram.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=17EOM3RTD1Y

Quote from: Hillary
arf arf arf



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Rose

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Re: Donald J. Trump's Jet Fuel Can't Melt Steel Beams 2016 Megathread
« Reply #15074 on: March 19, 2016, 04:37:34 am »

If you're framing somebody to stop them from getting lawfully elected, you're the bad guy.

So, attempting to assassinate a tyrant is wrong, because it's against the law?

Law = morality, or..?
Not because it's against the law, but because if he gets elected, it's what the people want.
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