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[Frumple]

Bloody blue crumbling bumblefuck, get that goddamn ukraine out of the US politics thread. Out! Get the hell out!

[smjjames]

Holy crap, you are worst than Bush. Never go full Bush or below that  .
Also your not correct on "Ukraine can use its airforce with impunity, Russia cannot", or the bomber/yugoslavia reference. Except in case you are asking for USA and NATO to go directly in combat against russia. But in both cases not sure how it will be faster or in any way better for europe, and is very strange thinking I must say.

Helgoland the war mongler from the shadows .

I suppose I am a war monger - a short, intense war saves the lives that pacifists squander.
Russia can't use its airforce, because then everyone would have to admit it was involved directly.
Ukraine can use its airforce - but there's plenty of AA down there, which would have to be removed.
The Serbs in the 90s had one of he most advanced AA systems on the planet - the German Tornados however could pick up their radar, so anytime there was a Tornado in the air the AA systems would go unused, and NATO could drop its bombs unhindered. Giving Ukraine these capabilities would give it a huge advantage in this war.
And no, I am not arguing for direct Western intervention (here), just for arms sales to Ukraine and various other behind-the-scenes stuff. Nothing more than Russia does at the moment.

No, you silly German Warmonger.

*puts a WWI style German helmet on helgo*

[miljan]

Holy crap, you are worst than Bush. Never go full Bush or below that  .
Also your not correct on "Ukraine can use its airforce with impunity, Russia cannot", or the bomber/yugoslavia reference. Except in case you are asking for USA and NATO to go directly in combat against russia. But in both cases not sure how it will be faster or in any way better for europe, and is very strange thinking I must say.

Helgoland the war mongler from the shadows .

I suppose I am a war monger - a short, intense war saves the lives that pacifists squander.
Russia can't use its airforce, because then everyone would have to admit it was involved directly.
Ukraine can use its airforce - but there's plenty of AA down there, which would have to be removed.
The Serbs in the 90s had one of he most advanced AA systems on the planet - the German Tornados however could pick up their radar, so anytime there was a Tornado in the air the AA systems would go unused, and NATO could drop its bombs unhindered. Giving Ukraine these capabilities would give it a huge advantage in this war.
And no, I am not arguing for direct Western intervention (here), just for arms sales to Ukraine and various other behind-the-scenes stuff. Nothing more than Russia does at the moment.

If you want short war than USA can help out russia in forming the rebel regions. That one will be the shortest and fastest 
The thing is, if USA went to openly support ukraine, be sure, russia will do the same.
If you are talking about "arms sales to Ukraine and various other behind-the-scenes stuff", than you should already know that is happening, from giving them radar equipment, credits for buying weapons, to things like commanders, cia and other personnel helping them out.
Serbs did not have most advanced AA systems on the planet, not even close. Not sure where you got that from as they had the old and modified soviet equipment from around 1960.

[smjjames]

How about we shift the Ukraine stuff to the EuroPol thread?

As for the whole 'pendulum towards isolationist', while I myself do think that we should meddle much less, especially military intervention wise, I don't think we need to go full isolationist. Just because we don't meddle as much militarily doesn't mean that we can't be involved in other ways. Plus other countries need to share more of the role that we're in.

If you want full isolationist, look at Ron Paul.

[SalmonGod]

I just want the U.S. to be less of a blank check to "Defense" companies and contractors.

[mainiac]

We all do, sweetie.

[Guardian G.I.]

-I think I'll delete this and crosspost it to the Europol thread instead-

[FearfulJesuit]

Meanwhile, from Michele Bachmann...

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Bless her heart.

[Bauglir]

Sadly Happily Apparently, snopes suggests it never happened.

[RedKing]

Somewhere in the mists of time, I wound up on a Republican Party mailing list of some kind. I've never donated money to a Republican. I've never registered Republican. The only Republican I consistently vote for is our state Agriculture Commissioner, because dude's pretty awesome at his job and isn't an ideologue (as witnessed when he took a lot of heat recently by banning public carry of firearms at the State Fair, because WTF? Why is that even an idea??)

Might have to do with me signing a thing online back in 2000 that I might be interested in working with the McCain campaign locally. Back when McCain still had a shred of decency. (He got knocked out of the primaries before it ever got anywhere near NC, btw.)


Anyways....so today in the mail I got a platform survey from the RNC, asking me to represent voters in my congressional district in helping to choose the Presidential platform for 2016.

There is not a troll face trolly enough to encapsulate the trolldom creeping into my brain.

So....how bout it B12? Do I respond with well-reasoned responses that try to bring the GOP back from the brink to talk about the real, substantive issues that need to be addressed?

Or do I talk about how the voters of this district won't even consider a candidate who doesn't ask again to see Obama's birth certificate, and talk about crackpot shit like Agenda 21 and Communists defiling our natural bodily essence with fluoride?

[Bauglir]

Tough call. Do you think anybody actually reads these things? If so, you may have to pass up on short-term satisfaction.

[Frumple]

Either play it straight or go full left-wing crackpot, I'd say. There's already going to be plenty mumbling things about obamuoride.

[Helgoland]

Get them to put up the mmost unvotable-for candidate in the history of the US. It'll be for the best.

[mainiac]

Somewhere in the mists of time, I wound up on a Republican Party mailing list of some kind.

Me too despite years of working for and donating to Democratic candidates.  I think they just know that I am politically active from profiling.

AFAIK, trolling that mailer wont accomplish anything.  They dont use them as a poll, they use it as part of their voter targeting and mobilization efforts.  It's just phrased that way because it makes people more likely to respond.

[RedKing]

Get them to put up the mmost unvotable-for candidate in the history of the US. It'll be for the best.

You mean, keep on doing what they've been doing? The problem is that candidates who would have been unelectable 40 years ago are almost de rigeur these days.

@mainiac: Yeah, I think it's basically a fundraising gimmick wrapped in a "we actually give half a shit what you plebs think" veneer. As noted by the $15 "processing fee" that I'm supposed to send in to make sure my responses are tabulated. Because the RNC has never heard of an optical scanner.