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Author Topic: Visible Sexualities  (Read 6114 times)

SixOfSpades

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Visible Sexualities
« on: January 02, 2015, 12:11:03 am »

In a society where homosexuality (and/or bisexuality) is common enough to be a norm, it stands to reason that it would be socially accepted.
If homo- and bisexuality are widely accepted, there is no reason for people (dwarves) not to be open about it.
If dwarves are open about which gender (or genders, or lack of gender) they are sexually attracted to, that information should be visible to the player. Hey, the dwarf has a preference, why isn't it listed in his Thoughts & Preferences screen? If I want to get Dwarf A & Dwarf B to shack up & have kids, I should have some forewarning, so I could tell that Dwarf B will never agree to marriage before Dwarf A irrevocably falls in love.

If a flat-out statement of "Urist prefers the affections of [gender]" seems too blunt, perhaps the dwarves could advertise it in more subtle ways, such as adopting specific styles of hair/beards, or preferring certain garments over others.
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Pyrite

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Re: Visible Sexualities
« Reply #1 on: January 02, 2015, 01:43:55 am »

Personally I'd vastly prefer a flat out statement to any kind of signalling like that.

I'd be fine though with 'Urist prefers the affection of males and females equally and looks forward to settling down one day" or something like that.
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Cptn Kaladin Anrizlokum

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Re: Visible Sexualities
« Reply #2 on: January 02, 2015, 01:46:22 am »

Personally I'd vastly prefer a flat out statement to any kind of signalling like that.

I'd be fine though with 'Urist prefers the affection of males and females equally and looks forward to settling down one day" or something like that.
Yeah, this would be good to have.
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Deboche

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Re: Visible Sexualities
« Reply #3 on: January 02, 2015, 08:48:13 am »

You wouldn't really be able to do it with dwarves' external appearance without it being offensive. And I've met some gay people who don't look it at all, boys and girls. A message about the preferences would do.

It'd also be cool to have vain dwarves though and when they're able to buy their own stuff, I'm sure we'll see interesting things.
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Dyret

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Re: Visible Sexualities
« Reply #4 on: January 02, 2015, 11:49:31 am »

You wouldn't really be able to do it with dwarves' external appearance without it being offensive. And I've met some gay people who don't look it at all, boys and girls. A message about the preferences would do.

His nose is upturned, his close-set eyes are somewhat round, his double-braided beard is extremely gay.
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Deboche

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Re: Visible Sexualities
« Reply #5 on: January 02, 2015, 11:52:51 am »

His shoulders are broad and powerful, his glutes are hard as gabbro, his jawline is dreamy but he greets everyone with "HAY GIRLFRIEND!".
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Witty

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Re: Visible Sexualities
« Reply #6 on: January 02, 2015, 11:54:37 am »

Personally I'd vastly prefer a flat out statement to any kind of signalling like that.

I'd be fine though with 'Urist prefers the affection of males and females equally and looks forward to settling down one day" or something like that.
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SixOfSpades

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Re: Visible Sexualities
« Reply #7 on: January 02, 2015, 08:21:41 pm »

You wouldn't really be able to do it with dwarves' external appearance without it being offensive. And I've met some gay people who don't look it at all, boys and girls.
It would only be offensive if it implied that certain hair styles / garments were interpreted as being "gay" by human standards. "Oh, her hair is cleanly shaven? She must be a bull dyke!" But we're talking about dwarven standards, which of course could be vastly different from how it is in [culture you're from], and could even be randomly generated with each dwarven civ.

Not that I'd like to see that happen. I'd much rather be able to see Urist's sexual preference, alongside his general level of interest in both romance and sex, stated right there alongside his favorite color, hated vermin, & aspirations for the future.
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Zammer990

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Re: Visible Sexualities
« Reply #8 on: January 02, 2015, 08:42:17 pm »

His nose is upturned, his close-set eyes are somewhat round, his double-braided beard is extremely gay.
His shoulders are broad and powerful, his glutes are hard as gabbro, his jawline is dreamy but he greets everyone with "HAY GIRLFRIEND!".
I just want this to be a RAW modification.
Please toady...
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Putnam

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Re: Visible Sexualities
« Reply #9 on: January 03, 2015, 02:32:20 am »

You can do that, but it won't actually be connected to said creature's orientation.

Deboche

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Re: Visible Sexualities
« Reply #10 on: January 03, 2015, 10:41:05 am »

But we're talking about dwarven standards, which of course could be vastly different from how it is in [culture you're from], and could even be randomly generated with each dwarven civ.
It still assumes you can know a person's sexuality based on a stereotype, that's why it's offensive.
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Dirst

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Re: Visible Sexualities
« Reply #11 on: January 03, 2015, 10:52:57 am »

But we're talking about dwarven standards, which of course could be vastly different from how it is in [culture you're from], and could even be randomly generated with each dwarven civ.
It still assumes you can know a person's sexuality based on a stereotype, that's why it's offensive.
I wound be fine if explicit signals arose randomly as "fashions" within civs, with some possibility of spread via trade.  Basically if someone becomes legendary, there's a chance that some acquired trait about that person becomes a popular signal for some inherent or different acquired trait he/she has.  For example, Urist the legendary carpenter prefers orange and socks, and due to the economy being in place she actually has a pair.  There's some chance that her orange socks (and acquired trait) become a fashionable signal for some category she is in (which could be carpenter, female, bisexual, female carpenter, female bisexual, bisexual carpenter, etc.).  The narrower the category, the less competition there is to "win" the signal for it.

This would allow specific hair styles to become popular among male macedwarves, green capes to become popular among human swordsmen, braided beards to become popular among homosexual female dwarves (because dammit everyone should mod beards onto female dwarves), and so on.

It would add flavor to civilizations, and the randomness should avoid offending anyone.

But even before any of that is in place, I'd like to see lover/marriage interests on the Thoughts and Preferences Screen.
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Deboche

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Re: Visible Sexualities
« Reply #12 on: January 03, 2015, 11:01:21 am »

That would be really cool. Another factor would be social standing so that you'd have noble fashions and peasant fashions.
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Dirst

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Re: Visible Sexualities
« Reply #13 on: January 03, 2015, 11:24:19 am »

That would be really cool. Another factor would be social standing so that you'd have noble fashions and peasant fashions.
Not to veer too far off-topic, but the price for fashionable clothing would probably rise well above its baseline, making it much easier for the wealthy to be fashionable.  But one does not need to be wealthy to be the trend-setter.  It would probably look fairly banal in Legends "In 199, Urist McCarpenter popularized orange socks among bisexual carpenters in The Glazed Steel" but the underlying social dynamic could either be solidarity or the elite trivializing the dwarf's accomplishments.  I'd put guys wearing camo scarves with business suits in the latter category.
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SixOfSpades

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Re: Visible Sexualities
« Reply #14 on: January 03, 2015, 01:41:20 pm »

But we're talking about dwarven standards, which of course could be vastly different from how it is in [culture you're from], and could even be randomly generated with each dwarven civ.
It still assumes you can know a person's sexuality based on a stereotype, that's why it's offensive.
Ah, but it wouldn't be a stereotype, that's the point. It would be a universally agreed-upon social shorthand, free of any stigma. It wouldn't be "if u wear nickel silver amulet means ur gay lol", it would be, "Yes, we citizens of The Subtle Treaties have adopted a sort of 'amulet etiquette' to help avoid awkward questions and unrequited infatuations. Wearing an amulet made of nickel silver indicates that you are more attracted to members of your own gender, rose gold means the opposite gender, bismuth bronze means you're roughly equally into both genders, and black bronze means that you're not interested in any romantic or sexual contact at all, at least at this time." If people take offense at a system like that . . . then that's their problem, not mine--or the system's.
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