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Author Topic: Dog birth rate  (Read 1067 times)

Mea Culpa

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Dog birth rate
« on: October 14, 2006, 10:07:00 am »

It seems to me that war/hunting dogs give birth far more rarely than untrained dogs?

After I trained all my dogs my dog population sticked and no new born but only die of age...

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Mad Jackal

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Re: Dog birth rate
« Reply #1 on: October 14, 2006, 10:34:00 am »

I have had my initial 2 WarDagos have litters at least once a year. Ranging from 1 to 4 puppies per litter (I think).

I believe the time(s) I took 3 WarDogs to start I got the litters sooner, but I don't recall a deviation in the average size.

Of course all of them were "puppies" and grew to stray dogs. Which I then trained inot WarDogs, so I don't think there is a Breed or size differential.

I have never tried regular Dogs though. Do they give litters more often? Are thier litters larger? Can WarDogs and Regular dogs intermix for breeding pairs? (I can not see why not if regular dogs can be trained into WarDogs.)

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SquidDNA

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Re: Dog birth rate
« Reply #2 on: October 14, 2006, 11:33:00 am »

I suspect that war dogs assigned to work don't breed-- I also am having a sterility issue in my dog population, although the fact that horses don't give foals anymore makes me think the temperature is off in the caves and there's some kind of wider issue with pet reproduction (although the cows only recently stopped giving calves and my cats are still giving kittens.)

Any other experiences with pet lines dying off?

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Captain_Action

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Re: Dog birth rate
« Reply #3 on: October 14, 2006, 12:31:00 pm »

There is a pet population limit and a pet species limit as well.
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Mea Culpa

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Re: Dog birth rate
« Reply #4 on: October 15, 2006, 07:34:00 am »

I realized a new issue...

I found that my horse/mule population are also dimmed while my cats are growing...

My main defence now is some pet patrol point made by wells, dogs might not have enough time and number to "breed" while I make them spread, scattered from well to well... :P

I suspect this cos I guess cats,unlike other animal, don't seems to scatterd through out meeting halls, they stray more freely.

[ October 15, 2006: Message edited by: Mea Culpa ]

[ October 15, 2006: Message edited by: Mea Culpa ]

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Mea Culpa

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Re: Dog birth rate
« Reply #5 on: October 15, 2006, 07:36:00 am »

quote:
Originally posted by Mea Culpa:
<STRONG>I realized a new issue...

My main defence now is some pet patrol point made by wells, dogs might not have enough time and number to "breed" while I make them spread, scattered from well to well... :P

[ October 15, 2006: Message edited by: Mea Culpa ]</STRONG>


If this is true, I really admire the devs..they even care about dog's sex activities.....

[ October 15, 2006: Message edited by: Mea Culpa ]

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SquidDNA

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Re: Dog birth rate
« Reply #6 on: October 31, 2006, 01:11:00 pm »

Well, dogs don't procreate by dispersing spores or something-- you've got to have a male and a female get together and do that.

Regarding caps, it would be nice if this were player-set so that healthy populations of a variety of pets can be balanced against client slowdown and pathfinding issues as necessary. My dogs are all dying out but the slots for new pets are being taken by calves.

In the meantime I'm trying to get a breeding pair of leopards but there's almost nothing in the wilderness on this map.

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Ancient Whale

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Re: Dog birth rate
« Reply #7 on: October 31, 2006, 05:30:00 pm »

Just grab a few butchers(or give other dwarves the butchery labor), build a few butcheries outside(or inside if you think you can handle the miasma, those chunks rot fast) and designate a few dozen cows to be slaughtered. If you also have loads of barrels, dedicated food haulers and perhaps tanners you'll also get mountains of food and lots of leather.
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psychologicalshock

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Re: Dog birth rate
« Reply #8 on: October 31, 2006, 10:54:00 pm »

I attempt to breed a good sum of animals at first and then later I slaughter them en masse for food.
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Mea Culpa

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Re: Dog birth rate
« Reply #9 on: November 01, 2006, 10:17:00 am »

I'd rather slaughter horses earlier when they are not too much.
since dwarves will get upset on the wide  slaughter, they "have seen death" too much.

The food they provide won't trade the upset they bring...

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psychologicalshock

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Re: Dog birth rate
« Reply #10 on: November 05, 2006, 11:20:00 pm »

That's why you always have a seperate butcher's room. The butcher quits caring after the first few.
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ricree

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Re: Dog birth rate
« Reply #11 on: November 06, 2006, 04:52:00 am »

Ohhh.... so that's where all these "seen death" negatives have been coming from.
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Skyrage

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Re: Dog birth rate
« Reply #12 on: November 06, 2006, 05:33:00 am »

The whole "seen death" system is way too extreme. Sure, it fits in perfectly when it comes to witnessing other dwarves dying, but animals that are being slaughtered for food?

Not only is it annoying if you tend to keep a wide variety of food going, it also makes dwarves look pathetically wimpy.

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Angela Christine

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Re: Dog birth rate
« Reply #13 on: November 06, 2006, 08:32:00 am »

Maybe distaste for butchery is one of the reasons dwarves are not traditionally ranchers.   It is only the moment of death that bothers people, coming into the room seconds later to find chunks everywhere doesn't bother them at all.  There is no glory and little skill in killing a trusting, friendly animal that isn't even fighting back.  It just isn't very dwarfish.

They really don't seem set up well for raising livestock in an organized way.  Dogs and cats are well integrated into the village, but horses, cows and other large animals just wander around aimlessly and get in the way.  You can keep them as livestock, but dwarfs are bad at it in a variety of ways.  They either leave the horses wandering around the caves loose, tie them up one at a time, attempt to lock them in a room, or cram way too many of them into cages.  Despite all their craft skill dwarfs have still not invented the corral. Feeding the livestock and cleaning/harvesting the dung isn't mentioned at all.  If you keep them in outdoor pastures then it could make sense that they need almost no care, but if you lock them in cages deep underground or allow them to congregate in meeting halls, then it is very odd.  It would be nice if animals that eat grass had a natural preference for being outside.  Having dogs congregate at the well can be useful, but stray horses and cows are just a nuisance.

Butchering animals doesn't seem to give a very strong negative "seen death" thought.  I recently slaughtered a good chunk of my out of control horse population, and I checked on the butchers periodically to make sure none of them were getting too unhappy.  To my surprise all of them were at least "content", many were "happy" and one one of them was "ecstatic" despite every one of them having the "seen death" thought.  

Things that may help:

-- I give many dwarves the butchery job, so one guy doesn't have to do it all the time.

-- I check the individual preferences, and disable butchery for anyone that has a preference for dogs, cats, horses, mules, cows, or any other animal that I plan on farming.  I don't know if it makes a difference or not, but I assume that someone who really loves cats will be more upset by killing cats than someone who is indifferent to them would be.

-- I keep all of my indoor workshops, including the butchery, in enclosed rooms.  The rooms are usually 7*6 or 9*6, and each contains two workshops and some storage space.  This is mainly to contain or slow down miasmas, invaders, berserk and tantruming dwarves, but it also means that usually no one but the butcher sees the moment of death.

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