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[Rolan7]

On the subject of game ratings(and censorship in general), do they even doing anything? Isn't censoring the world fundamentally worse than preparing youth to face it's truths?

Exposing kids to sex too early can really screw their development.  Just look at pedophilia victims.
The same may be true of exposure to violent themes, I dunno.  Seems like a likely derail topic.

But some concepts really shouldn't be examined until a person is mature enough to handle them healthily...  Maybe some countries are too careful these days, but the principle is sound.

Besides, game ratings aren't censorship (except for cases like unrated games in Australia).  For the US, I don't think even Adults Only actually carries any weight.  They're just guidelines that stores tend to follow.

Though I'm pretty sure it's illegal for stores or parents or anyone to allow pornography to minors...  That's different from the Adults Only rating though.  I don't know the details really.

But yes, content restrictions can serve a important purpose.

Jew is both a race AND religion.

Yeah, not all Jews are Jewish.  Heh.

[alexandertnt]

I only skimmed the last few posts, but did anyone actually advocate censorship? It seems that discussions on females in games (or any social analysis of games) seems to bring with it a discussion of censorship.

[Caz]

I only skimmed the last few posts, but did anyone actually advocate censorship? It seems that discussions on females in games (or any social analysis of games) seems to bring with it a discussion of censorship.

Smeep was advocating stopping the depiction of violence against females in games iirc.

[alexandertnt]

As in "People should stop making so many thing with violence againt women" (which is not censorship), or "the government should ban media with violence against women" (which is censorship)?

[Graknorke]

Exposing kids to sex too early can really screw their development.  Just look at pedophilia victims.

Unless victim has more implications than legal here, I haven't come across anything that says anything far off this. The negatively affected are primarily in cases where there's already a negative aspect to the relationship.

[Neonivek]

I only skimmed the last few posts, but did anyone actually advocate censorship? It seems that discussions on females in games (or any social analysis of games) seems to bring with it a discussion of censorship.

The one thing you will find on here

Is that someone will advocate that a company shouldn't do something... and that it is wrong for them to do so... and that we should make them stop

But will not go as far as censorship or direct government intervention.

Which makes this whole thing WEIRD given that frankly games are rarely flawed on an individual level.

[Caz]

Exposing kids to sex too early can really screw their development.  Just look at pedophilia victims.

Unless victim has more implications than legal here, I haven't come across anything that says anything far off this. The negatively affected are primarily in cases where there's already a negative aspect to the relationship.

Yeah, there's a big difference of a kid accidentally seeing their parents have sex and being shooed away, or finding some porn on the internet vs being purposefully exposed to sex by an abuser or forced to watch porn, etc.

[Caz]

I only skimmed the last few posts, but did anyone actually advocate censorship? It seems that discussions on females in games (or any social analysis of games) seems to bring with it a discussion of censorship.

The one thing you will find on here

Is that someone will advocate that a company shouldn't do something... and that it is wrong for them to do so... and that we should make them stop

But will not go as far as censorship or direct government intervention.

Which makes this whole thing WEIRD given that frankly games are rarely flawed on an individual level.

This is the thing that doesn't make sense to me. If you'd rather a company doesn't do something to the point of arguing about it to people, why don't you go the full mile and want it to be put into law? If you don't feel strongly enough to do that, why are you wasting your time on it?

[Sheb]

Well, that's perfectly normal, innit? Like I feel people should avoid using words like nigger, but I wouldn't want a nigger police enforcing that.

[Caz]

Well, that's perfectly normal, innit? Like I feel people should avoid using words like nigger, but I wouldn't want a nigger police enforcing that.

Well, that already exists here. Hate speech is a thing, and you go to jail over it.

[Sheb]

Well, but surely there are some behaviors that you frown upon but don't want a law against? Cheating on your significant other? Being an ass to serving staff at the restaurant? Wrongly using the word "selfie" to refer to any photograph? Calling for censorship of violence against women in video games?

[Arx]

Wrongly using the word "selfie" to refer to any photograph?

I want a law against that, not just tacit disapproval.

[scrdest]

Well, that's perfectly normal, innit? Like I feel people should avoid using words like nigger, but I wouldn't want a nigger police enforcing that.

Well, that already exists here. Hate speech is a thing, and you go to jail over it.

I *think* that it takes more than using a racial slur to constitute hate speech.

[Caz]

Well, but surely there are some behaviors that you frown upon but don't want a law against? Cheating on your significant other? Being an ass to serving staff at the restaurant? Wrongly using the word "selfie" to refer to any photograph? Calling for censorship of violence against women in video games?

1. Nah, strangely I never had a problem with this.
2. Restaurants should grow a pair and kick the customer out at this point. Which is what happens in places I've been to. We don't really have the 'smiling, ass-kissing waitress' routine here.
3/4. People can call things what they want.

[AlleeCat]

I only skimmed the last few posts, but did anyone actually advocate censorship? It seems that discussions on females in games (or any social analysis of games) seems to bring with it a discussion of censorship.

Smeep was advocating stopping the depiction of violence against females in games iirc.

I would honestly say that this is the wrong attitude to take, and probably taking her words a bit out of context. I would say that the current type of violence against women usually shown in video games is bad, usually making them a victim, rather than a combatant. Now, that's still fine, as long as it carries the weight and gravity that it would in real life. This is the same reason why I would be OK with rape scenes in games under very specific circumstances. (Dealt with maturely, important to the plot, not too gratuitous, warning somewhere on the box or in the game, etc.)

I'd like to give the new Tomb Raider as an example of how not to depict violence against women. Let's compare this game to, say, Uncharted. How come when Nathan Drake gets beaten up, shot, and otherwise pummeled, we can brush it off, but when Lara Croft goes through the same stuff, it seems horrible and wrong? It's not just because Nate is a man and Lara is a woman. It's because Nate goes through it all with a wry sense of humor and witty one-liners. Lara, on the other hand, stays deathly serious through it all. Her attitude makes her a victim, and we empathize with her.
Now, that's not to say that it's the only problem with how that stuff is portrayed, but it's a big issue. I guarantee you that if Lara went through that entire game cracking jokes, there would have been a lot less outcry. That, and making the death scenes a bit less gratuitous. (I mean, seriously, it's pretty gorram brutal when you fail a QTE in that game.)

Equality isn't just about including more females in games. It's about how we portray them. I honestly don't think it would be that hard to make another character like Buffy the Vampire Slayer. Someone who can kick just as much, if not more ass than the male characters, while still being feminine and able to like girly stuff. Basically, we need a Buffy for gamers.

inb4 someone takes my quote about rape scenes entirely out of context...

I would be OK with rape scenes in games

Spoiler: A little off topic, but since I brought up Buffy... (click to show/hide)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cYaczoJMRhs#t=163
"So, why do you write these strong female characters?"
"Because you're still asking me that question."