Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[alexandertnt]

I think he mean that is how he sees female characters, not how female characters actually are. I find that view rather archaic though.

Also Eurylochus, you can edit your posts by clicking the modify link on your post.

[smeeprocket]

I think males are seen by people as epic and heroic, I'd prefer to play a male character over a female character, simply because I don't female characters that exciting and inspiring to great deeds. I see them as feminine.

see that's the kind of thinking society promotes and is part of the problem. Now that you recognize that you perceive things that way, it's up to you to correct that wrong-headed thinking in yourself. That's part of it all, correcting the stereotypes and biases we have within ourselves, because no one is ever going to be perfect in how they perceive others.

Also, you can be feminine and epic and heroic. This negative connotation attached to being feminine is another part of the problem. Men and women both perceive it many times as weak and inferior. That's why calling someone a pussy or saying they have a mangina (you are a sexist if you use that term, just to be clear) has the connotations that it does. Because being feminine is weak and bad.

You guys might ignore what developer is making the game, and I would argue that just putting the gender of the developer as a blurb, while it would prove my point, is gimmicky and wouldn't be the best way to go about it, but there are plenty of male gamers more involved in the process that would be hypercritical of female developers, and that, if they made a strong female character would label them as having "an agenda"

We see this in comic books with the writer for Ms. Marvel (I think she stepped down recently, and is releasing an awesome new series called Bitch Planet.)

When I talk about people being part of the problem, the issue isn't that men that don't feel this way need to start fights with men that do, but you just need to be a voice of opposition to that. You don't have to be antagonistic. I don't think that would necessarily help.

[Eurylochus]

I think males are seen by people as epic and heroic, I'd prefer to play a male character over a female character, simply because I don't female characters that exciting and inspiring to great deeds. I see them as feminine.

see that's the kind of thinking society promotes and is part of the problem. Now that you recognize that you perceive things that way, it's up to you to correct that wrong-headed thinking in yourself. That's part of it all, correcting the stereotypes and biases we have within ourselves, because no one is ever going to be perfect in how they perceive others.

Also, you can be feminine and epic and heroic. This negative connotation attached to being feminine is another part of the problem. Men and women both perceive it many times as weak and inferior. That's why calling someone a pussy or saying they have a mangina (you are a sexist if you use that term, just to be clear) has the connotations that it does. Because being feminine is weak and bad.

You guys might ignore what developer is making the game, and I would argue that just putting the gender of the developer as a blurb, while it would prove my point, is gimmicky and wouldn't be the best way to go about it, but there are plenty of male gamers more involved in the process that would be hypercritical of female developers, and that, if they made a strong female character would label them as having "an agenda"

We see this in comic books with the writer for Ms. Marvel (I think she stepped down recently, and is releasing an awesome new series called Bitch Planet.)

When I talk about people being part of the problem, the issue isn't that men that don't feel this way need to start fights with men that do, but you just need to be a voice of opposition to that. You don't have to be antagonistic. I don't think that would necessarily help.

tl;dr

[smeeprocket]

I think males are seen by people as epic and heroic, I'd prefer to play a male character over a female character, simply because I don't female characters that exciting and inspiring to great deeds. I see them as feminine.

see that's the kind of thinking society promotes and is part of the problem. Now that you recognize that you perceive things that way, it's up to you to correct that wrong-headed thinking in yourself. That's part of it all, correcting the stereotypes and biases we have within ourselves, because no one is ever going to be perfect in how they perceive others.

Also, you can be feminine and epic and heroic. This negative connotation attached to being feminine is another part of the problem. Men and women both perceive it many times as weak and inferior. That's why calling someone a pussy or saying they have a mangina (you are a sexist if you use that term, just to be clear) has the connotations that it does. Because being feminine is weak and bad.

You guys might ignore what developer is making the game, and I would argue that just putting the gender of the developer as a blurb, while it would prove my point, is gimmicky and wouldn't be the best way to go about it, but there are plenty of male gamers more involved in the process that would be hypercritical of female developers, and that, if they made a strong female character would label them as having "an agenda"

We see this in comic books with the writer for Ms. Marvel (I think she stepped down recently, and is releasing an awesome new series called Bitch Planet.)

When I talk about people being part of the problem, the issue isn't that men that don't feel this way need to start fights with men that do, but you just need to be a voice of opposition to that. You don't have to be antagonistic. I don't think that would necessarily help.

tl;dr

Do yourself a favor and stop posting if you are just going troll. The rest of us are trying to have a productive conversation.

[Toady One]

I banned him.  Seems like a troll account.

[Urist Tilaturist]

But will his lung end up well minced in a +turkey hen egg roast+?

[Toady One]

We eagerly anticipate the recipe release so that our options become manifold.

[Arcvasti]

We eagerly anticipate the recipe release so that our options become manifold.

AAAAND sigged. Assuming no one else took it before me.

[Pseudopuppet]

It's mostly men who play games. Do not cite statistics that include Facebook and iPhone games which have little to no budgets and require little to no effort to play. Large game developers target the male audience because they make more money that way. It's called a demographic. Appealing to everyone takes more money, work, time, and it doesn't make the game necessarily "better" either. Sometimes you even begin to alienate your old fanbase if you make some drastic changes to appeal to a wider audience. It's not worth the effort.

[10ebbor10]

Might be entirely circumstantial, or just an unfortunate namechoice?

Edit: Probably an unfortunate name choice.

[smeeprocket]

It's mostly men who play games. Do not cite statistics that include Facebook and iPhone games which have little to no budgets and require little to no effort to play. Large game developers target the male audience because they make more money that way. It's called a demographic. Appealing to everyone takes more money, work, time, and it doesn't make the game necessarily "better" either. Sometimes you even begin to alienate your old fanbase if you make some drastic changes to appeal to a wider audience. It's not worth the effort.

you might want to read back through the previous posts in this thread because it's exhausting arguing these points repeatedly.

But you are welcome to provide new sources to back up your claims.

edit: actually, there's no way you're not trolling.

[Urist Tilaturist]

A summary of the demographics debate:

Most FPS players are male.
RPGs have around 2/5 female players, more than FPS, and to appeal to this big demographic usually allow female player characters, though they are often put in stupid, revealing "armour" that somehow functions identically to the slightly more covering and sensible male versions. This sexualisation is off-putting to some female players, but that does not stop them from playing as the high proportion of female players shows.
Not all female gamers play nothing but candy crush, but some do, constituting part of the big casual games audience that also includes some men.

[smeeprocket]

A summary of the demographics debate:

Most FPS players are male.
RPGs have around 2/5 female players, more than FPS, and to appeal to this big demographic usually allow female player characters, though they are often put in stupid, revealing "armour" that somehow functions identically to the slightly more covering and sensible male versions. This sexualisation is off-putting to some female players, but that does not stop them from playing as the high proportion of female players shows.
Not all female gamers play nothing but candy crush, but some do, constituting part of the big casual games audience that also includes some men.

also 44% of mmo players are female.

Lots of women play bejeweled, but candy crush saga is more evenly spread. Both genders like social app games. It is not an all female phenomenon.

Also, if your argument is that it would be a waste of time to appeal to women, please find a better argument or stay out of the thread. Women gamers do not represent a "waste of time".

[Urist Tilaturist]

Massively mutiplayer online what? If you mean MMORPGs, that is included under RPGs. There are also MMOFPS (Planetside 2), but I doubt these have so many female players, though Planetside 2 notably has sensibly dressed female soldiers.

It is not a waste of time for developers to appeal to a demographic which is 44% of their audience. I already suggested that putting female characters in vaguely sensible armour would help with this, but I also think that they cannot be putting female gamers off too much if so many of them are playing their games.

[smeeprocket]

Massively mutiplayer online what? If you mean MMORPGs, that is included under RPGs. There are also MMOFPS (Planetside 2), but I doubt these have so many female players, though Planetside 2 notably has sensibly dressed female soldiers.

It is not a waste of time for developers to appeal to a demographic which is 44% of their audience. I already suggested that putting female characters in vaguely sensible armour would help with this, but I also think that they cannot be putting female gamers off too much if so many of them are playing their games.

I was actually talking to the other poster about the waste of time.

I am referring to MMORPGS, as I said. Let me see your number on RPGs because I don't think they include MMORPGs and even if they do, the number of females playing MMORPGs would still be significantly higher than the combined women playing RPGs in general (also, that's multiple genres crowded together)