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Author Topic: Double/dual striking skill.  (Read 4210 times)

StagnantSoul

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Double/dual striking skill.
« on: November 29, 2014, 08:45:00 pm »

So, dwarves have two arms. Dwarves strike with one weapon at a time. This is because the majority of dwarves are left or right handed. But couldn't we train them in some form duel wielding? Korea used dual wielding extensively, Japanese samurai were taught to dual wield, the Mamluk had duel wielding, and Shikendo contains duel wielding a pair of full sized swords. Yes, it's normally played for looks in anime and gaming industries. Yes, Korea eventually phased it out after a few hundred years. Yes, Samurai normally fought with one sword. But it was used historically. My proposition is a skill and physical trait to go with dual wielding. An ambidextrous dwarf would have something mentioning it in his description. Only a dwarf who's ambidextrous would be able to get the dual wielding skill, and would, in combat, use both hands' weapons. Slash with the sword, then bash with his shield, in the same move. Quite like how you can lineup your adventurer to kick and punch twice, bite, and strike with whatever is in each hand all in one turn, but less overkill. Only 3% of the world is ambidextrous. Out of a 200 dwarf fort, that's 0-6, maybe more, dwarves who are ambidextrous. A dwarf who reaches legendary dual wielding will be just like a legendary fighter who's a novice swordsman, just a swordsman. A legendary dual wielding swordsman would be a legendary swordsman. Train him to legendary in two different weapons, and he'll be a weapon master. Still, get an ambidextrous dwarf, give him a hammer and pick, and let him loose on the enemy. What do you think of the idea?
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Magistrum

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Re: Double/dual striking skill.
« Reply #1 on: November 29, 2014, 10:10:15 pm »

That's actually pretty nice, only the dual wielders wouldn't last very long, they would be a scarce resource (that's good).
Other problem is that dwarves aren't right handed or left handed, everyone is ambidextrous as of now, so we would need to have that implemented before adding that...
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StagnantSoul

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Re: Double/dual striking skill.
« Reply #2 on: November 29, 2014, 10:20:17 pm »

(Le facepalm) Forgot that bit. 
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Quote from: Cptn Kaladin Anrizlokum
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Places to jibber madly at each other, got it
Quote from: NJW2000
If any of them are made of fire, throw stuff, run, and think non-flammable thoughts.

utunnels

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Re: Double/dual striking skill.
« Reply #3 on: November 29, 2014, 10:35:34 pm »

Yeah I like this idea.
A dual wielding axedarf sounds right to me.
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tonnot98

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Re: Double/dual striking skill.
« Reply #4 on: November 30, 2014, 12:17:15 am »

A hammerer with two addy hammers sounds like a fun prospect...
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4maskwolf

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Re: Double/dual striking skill.
« Reply #5 on: November 30, 2014, 12:17:43 am »

A hammerer with two addy hammers sounds like a fun prospect...
Is this a joke about how adamantine hammers are horrible?

Putnam

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Re: Double/dual striking skill.
« Reply #6 on: November 30, 2014, 12:42:20 am »

Other problem is that dwarves aren't right handed or left handed, everyone is ambidextrous as of now, so we would need to have that implemented before adding that...

Nope, there's a number in the unit body structure that represents a given unit's dominant hand. I don't think it actually has any effect, though.

utunnels

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Re: Double/dual striking skill.
« Reply #7 on: November 30, 2014, 12:43:20 am »

The hammer lord srikes the goblin spearman in the head with his dual wielding ☼adamantine war hammer☼ and +adamantine war hammer+, lightly tapping the target.
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StagnantSoul

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Re: Double/dual striking skill.
« Reply #8 on: November 30, 2014, 12:48:14 am »

I did some tests in arena mode, and using the one-strike-a-turn AI dual wielding, axe and hammer combo came out heavily on top in a 5 squad of 10, every squad for themselves, fight. 1st place: axe and hammer. 2nd place: dual shielding. 3rd place: whip and pick. 4th place: dual swords, one long, one short. 5th place: hammer and spear.
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Quote from: Cptn Kaladin Anrizlokum
I threw night creature blood into a night creature's heart and she pulled it out and bled to death.
Quote from: Eric Blank
Places to jibber madly at each other, got it
Quote from: NJW2000
If any of them are made of fire, throw stuff, run, and think non-flammable thoughts.

Magistrum

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Re: Double/dual striking skill.
« Reply #9 on: November 30, 2014, 10:31:59 am »

Nope, there's a number in the unit body structure that represents a given unit's dominant hand. I don't think it actually has any effect, though.
Yes, but it doesn't make any (visible) effect so, "technically" everyone is ambidextrous.
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Urist Tilaturist

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Re: Double/dual striking skill.
« Reply #10 on: November 30, 2014, 10:40:28 am »

Why did all your examples have to be non European? Dual wielding rapier and dagger was common in street fights in early modern Europe, with the rapier used for striking and the dagger for defending.

Dual wielding is fine in single combat or street fights, but it suffers in battle because of the lack of a shield to block arrows and blows from other, adjacent combatants. No shield walls can be formed with no shields, and no 2 handed weapons can be used for extra reach either. Overall it's just not as good for 1 army facing another. Of course, given the individual nature of dwarves, they may do it anyway, but there are good reasons why shields or 2 hand weapons are just better in battle.
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On the item is an image of a dwarf and an elephant. The elephant is striking down the dwarf.

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StagnantSoul

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Re: Double/dual striking skill.
« Reply #11 on: November 30, 2014, 11:45:07 am »

Well they can't equip two handed weapons because of a glitch. And combat in Dwarf Fortress is like parking lot gang wars, really.
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Quote from: Cptn Kaladin Anrizlokum
I threw night creature blood into a night creature's heart and she pulled it out and bled to death.
Quote from: Eric Blank
Places to jibber madly at each other, got it
Quote from: NJW2000
If any of them are made of fire, throw stuff, run, and think non-flammable thoughts.

darknessofthenight

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Re: Double/dual striking skill.
« Reply #12 on: November 30, 2014, 12:37:04 pm »

Well they can't equip two handed weapons because of a glitch. And combat in Dwarf Fortress is like parking lot gang wars, really.
It currently is but there is no reason why it should be for all races civs...
Its just that formations haven't been implemented
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StagnantSoul

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Re: Double/dual striking skill.
« Reply #13 on: November 30, 2014, 12:42:16 pm »

I don't really see the point in adding formations, until we get to the point where multiple creatures can't fit in a tile, orientation is super important, armies get larger, and tons of other things. Until then, we're stuck with gang wars. I like this combat more than if we had formations, really.
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Quote from: Cptn Kaladin Anrizlokum
I threw night creature blood into a night creature's heart and she pulled it out and bled to death.
Quote from: Eric Blank
Places to jibber madly at each other, got it
Quote from: NJW2000
If any of them are made of fire, throw stuff, run, and think non-flammable thoughts.

Splint

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Re: Double/dual striking skill.
« Reply #14 on: November 30, 2014, 01:51:05 pm »

Combat in Dwarf Fortress is like parking lot gang wars, really.

I just wanna say, that's the most hilariously appropriate way of describing battles in fort mode I've seen yet.
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