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[WDDworf]

Hello my fellow Dwarvenphiles,


I am in the middle of pre-designing a complete fortress layout.
The basic layout idea is to have the grand dining room (/royal rooms/general dormitory) in the center.. Using 4 main road in each wind direction.
North entrance goes to surface, East goes to first cavern level, South to second, West to third.
Each direction should get their own barracks (2 each, 1 ranged/1 melee) and hospital.
All Dwarven rooms are lined along side the main roads, going up 3 z levels with roadside windows. (You should get an apartment feeling, when entering the fort)

This all isn't relevant to my question, because I want to make an automated bathing system for each of the fort's entrances.

The 'bath' will be 5 tiles wide and only 1 tile 'long'. (unless someone gives the advice to increase the size).
The front/back of the 'bath' will be ramps and here is my question.

Say I want to use a water level of 3 (not more than 3 and not less than 2).
5 tiles x 3 = 15 'units' of water, but how much do the ramps 'absorb'?
If the ramps work like regular tiles, the calculation would become 5 tiles (width) x 3 (2 channel lines + 1 regular) x 3 (water units)
Somehow it sounds logical for ramps to 'use' 1/2 of the volume.. But I think it's either 100% or 0%, I forgotten.

So I am wondering how much water there has to be for a steady 3 water level.

The second part of my question is a bit more complicated, but I am sure it's possible. (as there is dwarf computing :p)
I would like to use pressure plates, so I can flush the bath after each 'use'.
However flushing it every time might just be annoying, so I would want to use a logic like.. every 5 dwarves, activates lever, which activates the flush.

What would be the best way of getting this done.. using several gears.. each iteration activates 1 gear.. all gears activate the main functionality?

[Codyo]

I think the ramp wouldn't absorb any water, it would act as if it was a completely empty space for fluids.

[taptap]

People are all crazy about 3/7 water, I don't know why. It is even in the wiki. In my current fort (40.14) dwarves did NOT path through 3/7 water when I filled the decontamination trench to exactly 3/7. They even preferred drinking unclean water from the trench to going through the trench to the booze stockpile.

Computing: It could also be 5 doors, when all are opened goblin will move on pressure plate to trigger flushing (or the doors/hatches are simply in the way of the water, when all five are open water flows). Making the counter / reset is the complicated part not the AND.

Edit: Can't reproduce the not pathing through 3/7, but it did indeed happen. Best forget it.

[WDDworf]

People are all crazy about 3/7 water, I don't know why. It is even in the wiki. In my current fort dwarves did NOT path through 3/7 water when I filled the decontamination trench to exactly 3/7. They even preferred drinking unclean water from the trench to going through the trench to the booze stockpile.

Computing: It could also be 5 doors, when all are opened goblin will move on pressure plate to trigger flushing (or the doors/hatches are simply in the way of the water, when all five are open water flows). Making the counter / reset is the complicated part not the AND.

Hmm.. I could increase the width to 7 tiles.. and use 2 full tiles to fill it.. (from both sides, so it wouldnt disturb the center, which should be made high traffic therefor)
It should give an almost guaranteed result of 2/7 fill all around. I am quessing it is possible for a bit of water to evaporate during filling time.
Maybe 2 pressure plates could work..
> 2/7 fill : flush
< 1/7 fill : draw water
It would disturb traffic a while, but might even itself out?

I am liking the idea of using live 'mechanisms' to atleast provide a delay for the flush and will probably opt for that.. But still thinking about a true mechanic solution.
In Dwarfputing terms.. I'd need a counting mechanism..
I'll read up on some stuff here, but maybe using a liquid could work here..

Each hit opens a hatch with 1 filled tile into a 4-5 tile long channel.
Pressure plate on the last tile of the channel for 7/7 water should provide a 'reliable' trigger after 4-5 iterations?

The 'drinking unclean water' might be a problem, but I am integrating several wells into the layout. (4 in the main large dining/meeting hall and 4 in the outer-ish rim each corner.)
Designing a nice network at the moment for it.. I'd like to think the bearded fellows would atleast be good in designing sewers and such.

[gchristopher]

I have had no problem with dwarves pathing through a 3/7 water-filled decontamination trench. (v34.11) A single tile's width of ramp across a hallway is sufficient. So in your case, for a 5 wide hallway, dig a 1x5 trench of ramps across it, fill to 3/7 of water, and you're done.

The problem with systems of this type is that contaminants tend to accumulate in the water, affecting any barefoot creatures or animals that path through it.

I don't have a good solution to this problem in general. You can set it up to atom-smash the water by putting a raising bridge over the ramps, then fill the trench with magma to clean out the contaminants, then atom-smash the magma, then refill with water, but that's moderately complicated and hard to safely automate.

[taptap]

I have had no problem with dwarves pathing through a 3/7 water-filled decontamination trench. (v34.11) A single tile's width of ramp across a hallway is sufficient. So in your case, for a 5 wide hallway, dig a 1x5 trench of ramps across it, fill to 3/7 of water, and you're done.

The problem with systems of this type is that contaminants tend to accumulate in the water, affecting any barefoot creatures or animals that path through it.

I don't have a good solution to this problem in general. You can set it up to atom-smash the water by putting a raising bridge over the ramps, then fill the trench with magma to clean out the contaminants, then atom-smash the magma, then refill with water, but that's moderately complicated and hard to safely automate.

Cleaning jobs have a higher priority in current versions. In a compact fortress trenches are cleaned rapidly, trenches far away from the main area, however, are still mostly ignored.

[Max™]

This is a degunkable dorfwash, all craftsdorfship is of highest quality. It menaces with spikes of my own obscure numeral system (those are 3's) and vomit. The dorfwash is built with a pump which can pull goopy water from the ramps and feed it back into them through fortifications underneath it. In the tile under the output is an occasional image of dorfs wrestling after somehow teleporting through the wall around it. The overseer is stricken by a fey mood and ordering the pump to be activated. The trapped dorfs are being washed through the fortifications. The dorfs are all clean and happy.
Top floor:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

The pump is set up to pull the goopy water out of the ramps without losing any of it, so the water drops down from the output and flushes all the gunk out really efficiently.

Bottom floor:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

It's just a constructed 3x1 ramp (so the ramps are olivine like the rest of the wall around the wagon, you can just use channeled ramps if you like, I have put soap ramps in though they don't really do anything special, it just amuses me) with walls around the ramp tiles and fortifications extending down from the center. Walls around the fortifications, with the open tile at the end (you can put a grate over it at the output tile if you want) and pond fill it to 3/7.

Set up the entrance so the dorfs have to path through the ramps to get into the fort and it takes care of itself. Now and then when you see it is all goopy just tell a dorf to pump it clean then shut it back down.

If dorfs manage to get stuck in the wrong part you can just pump flush them back to the right side of the fortifications.

Here's a couple of earlier images from before I switched to the Courtney's Modern numerals, in case it helps make better sense of it.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

[gunpowdertea]

The tile set is... difficult to understand, but the idea is very nice (and I really like the description on top). I might borrow the design and adapt it to my needs.

[WDDworf]

I think I also understand.. If I see it right, dwarves have to path through the pump / channel part.. Leaving them only with the watered tile to path through.

I'll have to double check to see how to pumps are excately placed.

I wonder how easy it would be to do, if you'd have a bigger entrance.. I would like to try having a 5 tiles wide minimum entrance (3 is the absolute minimum, to allow caravans).

I could try to see if it's posible integrate this version inside the fort. (rather than the entrances)

[Max™]

Z+1 for an indoor one I did while playing with a mockup of a 30x30 Duerer that HaterSkater inadvertently teased me with and then gave me a copy of to tinker with. Kept crashing because I was trying to keep the 15x15 text and just size it up a little bit, doing a size up and then panning across the map rapidly, especially if trying to place buildings = segfault. T.T Gonna have to try to get the Duerer working again later on:


Z+0, I designed the stairs so I could have them split apart then drop into the dorfwash room in a way that I could still force them to path through the water on their way into the rest of the fort:


Z-1, I ended up having to replace some of the fortifications with grates because the additional variables of dorf entry directions and where the water was being taken from meant I couldn't count on the pumping not pulling them into the water, and unless the single ramp/pump version, this one doesn't have an easy way to flush trapped dorfs back out onto the ramps:


Z-2, the standard 3x3 staircase with side rooms layout takes over from here down:

[WDDworf]

That tileset is very cute.. I'm going to design an idea, based on your inputs. (Still got to look at it a second time, the cuteness blocks my interpretation of it all).

Will probably share that design here later, although the practical implementation of it, can still take a while.

Too bad there isn't a dirtiness-pressureplate or something for automated flushing :p

I do like the idea of using 'pond' water, rather than a regular water supply through long channels.
Still in doubt wether I want it completely automated or not.. (having a dwarf manually operate the pump being the issue here)
Maybe I could use my former idea and construct a counting mechanism, which would run non-stop.. and flushes the bathing area automatically, regardless of traffic.
Need a bit of Dwarmatics to see how good I can make that work.

It does sound nice.. having a limited amount of 'pond water', which gets recycled by the pumps. (which needs a dwarf to operate, like your case).
And just link it to one of the counting Dwarmatic to make it fully automated.

I will share it later today (maybe as much as 10 hours later).. because this needs some Dwarfigning first.