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Petro Poroshenko

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Yulia Tymoshenko

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Oleg Lyashko

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Total Members Voted: 17

[Knit tie]

A lot of people talk like that.  Yourself for example.

Well, why don't we change for the better together, then?

[mainiac]

That's an admirable goal but I was trying to explain something if IIRC...

[Knit tie]

So did I! But it's nice that we are finally in agreement and striving to be the better people.

[mainiac]

So after a page of trying to explain why I am frustrated by having my points not being acknowledged, I find that once again my point is not acknowledged.

Well I am somewhat frustrated by this.

[Guardian G.I.]

Enough arguments about reading comprehension, here's some photos and videos:

Photos:

Spoiler: A burned out husk of a BTR in the town of Peski. The source where I found the photo claims the vehicle was Ukrainian. (click to show/hide)

Spoiler: Damage from the fighting in the Lugansk Region (click to show/hide)

Videos:
A Ukrainian soldier walks around the ruined terminal of Donetsk Airport.
Novorossiyan forces use a quad bike as an improvised combat vehicle. Note the jeep with LDPR markings.
Fighting on the outskirts of Donetsk, 23.11.2014

[Knit tie]

All-right, let's get this started again.

Here's a very good, in my opinion, explanation of why Russia annexed Crimea and started to support the rebels in Ukraine.

What do you think?

[Guardian G.I.]

Spoiler: A group photo of some Azov Battalion troopers. The European spirit is palpable. (click to show/hide)

[Erkki]

The guy at the left doesnt look like he wants to be in the group photo. We dont need to wonder why...

[Sheb]

Yeah, the facepalming soldier is pretty cool.

[Helgoland]

All-right, let's get this started again.

Here's a very good, in my opinion, explanation of why Russia annexed Crimea and started to support the rebels in Ukraine.

What do you think?

It's filled to the brim with tu quoque, has a major non sequitur (asking 'why the Western agression' immediately after talking about the annexation of Crimea), repeats old cliches about the West (these cliches are true to a degree, but rehashing them shows a horrible lack of wit), and has a few very hard to believe points (Russia as a whole just wants to leave the Soviet past behind? Really?).
Oh, and it en passant claims Ukraine should not be a sovereign country.

Seriously, Knit, your standards are sinking...

[Ukrainian Ranger]

Spoiler: A group photo of some Azov Battalion troopers. The European spirit is palpable. (click to show/hide)

What an idiotic fake....

NATO Flag and nazi flag in one picture made me lol so hard. Dear Russian propagandists add Israeli flag to the mix next time.

BTW, guys, note how Russian propaganda works on crating NATO=Third Reich formula in heads of Russians

[Knit tie]

All-right, let's get this started again.

Here's a very good, in my opinion, explanation of why Russia annexed Crimea and started to support the rebels in Ukraine.

What do you think?

It's filled to the brim with tu quoque, has a major non sequitur (asking 'why the Western agression' immediately after talking about the annexation of Crimea), repeats old cliches about the West (these cliches are true to a degree, but rehashing them shows a horrible lack of wit), and has a few very hard to believe points (Russia as a whole just wants to leave the Soviet past behind? Really?).
Oh, and it en passant claims Ukraine should not be a sovereign country.

The man who wrote this is not a good writer, I'll give you that, and also likes whataboutism too much, but he's right when he describes the current Russian mentality - most of us, aside from a few hardcore communists and imperialists, really don't want to have to do anything with the USSR. It's sometimes remembered fondly (and other times it has megatons of mud poured on it), but overall, modern Russians couldn't care less about reviving the old empire. But what they do have, and you could've noticed that from yours truly, is a very strong national pride (or madness if you wish) that drives them - us - to defend our own. In today's world, this means that the majority of Russians were against the Ukraine joining NATO and supported the annexation of Crimea, because it is mostly Russian, and we didn't want our own peole to join the enemy, however irrational and Cold War-ish that sounds. The reason behind the Donbass rebellion was similar - people who were pro-Russian simply didn't want to join NATO, the people back in Russia supported them, and Putin was forced to keep up his image and go with the popular opinion.

And so the reason behind this bloodshed is simple, irrational belief in some transient qualities that differ between the two warring factions. Not that unusual for a war, is it?

Seriously, Knit, your standards are sinking...

Cut me some slack, Helgo, it was 5 am in Edinburgh when I found that article 

[mainiac]

Cut me some slack, Helgo, it was 5 am in Edinburgh when I found that article 

But it's not the first time or the second time it's like the 10th time you have posted stupid fringe crap.

[Knit tie]

Cut me some slack, Helgo, it was 5 am in Edinburgh when I found that article 

But it's not the first time or the second time it's like the 10th time you have posted stupid fringe crap.

I am moderately pro-Russian when it comes to pollitical stances on Ukraine, so a lot of what I say would appear to be stupid fringe crap to those who are pro-Ukrainian, what can I say? Quantum truth and all.

[mainiac]

Of course the old kneejerk fallback, we just hate Russia and can't be trusted.