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Author Topic: How do you build your fort? Growth strategy, depth, and ressources routes.  (Read 2618 times)

Swonnrr

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I'm curious, how do you build your fort?
I'm not talking the design of the fort itself, but rather how do you set it up in the grande scheme of things, and how does your fort grow?

early (~20-60 dwarves)
I usually go for an early above-ground fort (if lots of wood), or shallow one (from -1 to -10).
In some very rare cases, I will dig until the first caverns, and build in there.

In this time, I mostly try to get all industries running. I used to not even care about defence, but time taught me that even 2 dwarves with (-copper short sword-) training from the first summer can spare a lot of troubles.

Around the 60-80 dwarves, I usually have everything running, and idlers/useless dwarves begin to accumulate.
That's around that time that I begin thinking about metal industry, and forming/equipping an actual army.
There, it depends of fuel availability. If lots of wood, I just pile up wood and charcoal, and don't move. If magma is in sight, I move my forges up/down there.
If lots of bituminous coal/lignite, I mine everything I can without going too far. Then, and with the need for ore, begin my true bottleneck:
Ore mining and hauling.

If I survive until then, when I reach my popcap (around 200) I begin the construction of the true, final, giant fort, above the magma sea.

-How do you manage your access to ressources? How do you extend? Magma is rarely close to my fort, and I've never been comfortable with spreading around. Getting dwarves and stuff there is a mess.  When it's not magma it's wood, or water, or sand, or some specific ore. How do you manage access to remote strategical resources?

-I like staying close to the surface, maybe too much, and maybe too long. Also like I said, I'm uncomfortable with spreading. How do you manage your fort extension?
Either the fort quickly end up cramped and too small, or I aim too big and things takes years, and problems accumulates.

-Moving fuel to the ore, moving the ore to the fuel? I heard minecarts are awesome.
I actually manage to have a pretty efficient setup too gather wood from the forest to the door of the fort through scattered stockpiles and minecarts routes.
But ore veins are a mess, and there is a bunch of them. Could someone who use minecarts for mining show me a map of how your operations are set up and progress as mines deplete and the fort extends?


So, how do your fort grow? How do you keep it efficient?
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Aranador

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Re: How do you build your fort? Growth strategy, depth, and ressources routes.
« Reply #1 on: November 01, 2014, 01:14:22 am »

I like building above ground forts, with towers and battlements and flying walkways and all sorts of 'cool' stuff.  In my current game, I experimented with the minimalist magma moving minecart method, and having got that worked out, I can now start putting smelters, kilns, forges, and furnaces almost anywhere - so this fort has a perimeter wall (well - it doesn't, it has a few stone pillars where the wall will eventually be), multi-tiered crafting halls, and an apartment tower.  Only a short time in so when I say they're there, they are, but not necessarily fully functioning yet.

I use a lot of auto-quantum piles to automate all the hauling and sorting and stuff.  It can mean slightly more hauling initially, as everything is moved around to a feeder pile, then moved again to the quantum cart - and I mean everything is moved - nothing is ever left lying around outside its designated pile.

I have taken to having everyone who isn't a dedicated soldier being put into a squad, and equipped with a crossbow, quiver and bolts, and a wineskin, plus what ever armour I am comfortable with diverting to the civilian squads.  I hate relying on trap corridors and the like.

I usually have a fairly large dedicated military though, but it takes me a little while to ramp that up past a small handful.  I dedicate a lot of time to getting every single weapon used by them to masterwork quality.

Then I die due to some oversight or just a little too much FUN - and it is time to start again :)
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Max™

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Re: How do you build your fort? Growth strategy, depth, and ressources routes.
« Reply #2 on: November 01, 2014, 01:24:04 am »

I generally get the veins dug out and prioritize getting the stuff out of them, then close them back up and use my new favorite toy, tiletypes -> paint h 1 to rehide them if revflood won't do it. I like to expand downwards if I'm doing a natural fort, but sometimes I feel like just having fun and will add layers of stone to expand upwards as well (natural stone so I can engrave it) but recently I've had an obsession with doing big projects involving the removal of large amounts of material around obelisks or a massive up/down stair filled cube with a meeting area in the top layer.

I tend to leave my pop cap at 100~120 maximum, but I start out at 20 and build the initial fort with the first two waves+starter 7, so I can get things set up without feeling rushed by an overload of migrants.

I also like what Aranador said about having a civilian uniform, keeps clothes wear from being a hassle as well, and leather is easy enough to come by. Leather armor+leggings+high boots and a shield+crossbow works really well I find. Later I mix in a squad or two with hammers if it's an undead heavy area. Then as I cycle better gear into the military heavy squads I begin to rotate the older stuff to the civvies bit by bit.

For stockpiles I do a single feeder pile which takes everything but corpses/refuse and then set up quantum piles off of it for food/animals, stone/wood/gems/leather/cloth/bars, weapons/armor, furniture/finished goods. I like to channel down to the food pile so it is counted as light and won't get miasma if stuff rots there for some reason.

I also like to set a single tile garbage dump over it when caravans show up and after they leave I mass designate everything in the depot for dumping so everyone rushes right out to haul it into the food pile, then I can reclaim it and they'll sort it to the right piles without anything being left to rot in the depot anymore.
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StagnantSoul

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Re: How do you build your fort? Growth strategy, depth, and ressources routes.
« Reply #3 on: November 01, 2014, 01:30:09 am »

Always a 3x3 staircase going down as far as possible while avoiding caverns, with the first level that has to have a seperate staircase being the main hall, 60+ by 100+ room with a ton of eating and sleeping on one side, military stockpile and facilities on the other. 1x20x1 wall surrounding the stairs, with roof. Avoid caverns like the plague, and smooth every stone before anything goes there.
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utunnels

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Re: How do you build your fort? Growth strategy, depth, and ressources routes.
« Reply #4 on: November 01, 2014, 01:39:53 am »

Well I usually don't have plans.

Basically I make my food industry running first (farms, kitchen, still and other related workshops .... all on level -1 or -2). Dig bedrooms (around -5 below soil) as soon as possible, in this way I can train my miners quickly, then recruit some of them to start my early military. I also recruit marksdwarves from hunters.

If everything runs smoothly, I'll start digging all the way to the magma, seal the caverns along the way. Then I increase my pastures, butcher extra kittens and puppies, turn their bones to bolts for training. By now I should have plenty of prepared food so usually I buy whatever I want from the caravans.
« Last Edit: November 01, 2014, 01:42:19 am by utunnels »
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Re: How do you build your fort? Growth strategy, depth, and ressources routes.
« Reply #5 on: November 01, 2014, 01:44:58 am »

-Starting out: dig an entrance and main stairwell. Shallow fort, no need to go deep yet. Set up food stockpile, food related workshops and farms. Cut trees and make a wood stockpile and carpenter shop. Dis rooms and dining hall, furnish with wood. Set up manager office and build trade depot.
Keep making more rooms as population grows.
-At 60 dwarves: have metal industry going, dig a cistern and build a hospital.
-After 80 dwarves: make sure to have a military.
-Later: magma forges/furnaces. megaprojects.

Max™

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Re: How do you build your fort? Growth strategy, depth, and ressources routes.
« Reply #6 on: November 01, 2014, 01:49:33 am »

Yeah, once I get my first beds and chairs/tables ready I set up a manager and bookkeeper, can't live without them anymore.
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EvilJapYaY

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Re: How do you build your fort? Growth strategy, depth, and ressources routes.
« Reply #7 on: November 01, 2014, 02:28:43 am »

I usually start a fort with 2 miners (both also masons), 2 planters, 1 engraver, 1 carpenter/woodcutter and 1 trader, who will be the expedition leader, broker, manager and the bookkeeper.

First I dig big stockpile halls to soil, they are enough to store thousands of items and train miners a few levels.

Then I dig through the soil. I dig a deep fortress because it seems to reduce pathfinding lag and dwarves can move much faster.

Level 1: Trade depot
Levels 2-4:  Workshop levels
Levels 5-10: Bedrooms and barracks
Other levels are used only for getting rid of useless dwarves and mining

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miauw62

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Re: How do you build your fort? Growth strategy, depth, and ressources routes.
« Reply #8 on: November 01, 2014, 08:10:01 am »

I start off with a shallow fort with a small dormitory and dining room, but later on everything apart from the farms and the barracks goes below the soil so I can smooth and engrave everything.
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Insert_Gnome_Here

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Re: How do you build your fort? Growth strategy, depth, and ressources routes.
« Reply #9 on: November 01, 2014, 08:32:04 am »

I immediately dig for caverns and magma.
Farming is set up in sealed-off (to a certain extent) cavern and main fort goes upwards from magma sea.
Metalworking commences very soon.
I later add some shallow/outside things such as wind farm, perimeter wall etc.

Only flaw is when a GCS or cave croc gets into the farm and kills half the fort.
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Itnetlolor

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Re: How do you build your fort? Growth strategy, depth, and ressources routes.
« Reply #10 on: November 01, 2014, 10:19:40 am »

I layout the foundation/framework ahead of time (primarily inspired by the Fallout series of Vault-Tec vaults); establish stockpile setups with a MASTER-IN pile (half of the piles set for light stuff, and the other half for heavier stuff. Stone and wood are separate.) and such, and progressively refine them as I grow.


Defense, unfortunately, I am kinda crappy about, unless it involves re-routing outsiders through a gauntlet of traps. Now with climbing added, might not be a good idea anymore. On the plus side, I can more easily tell which of my civilians are more dead-set for military work and what aren't; I just need to train them so they're good at fighting.

Unfortunately, I'm more economy-minded when it comes to DF; however, my resourcefulness does make my forts plenty-ready for any (mega)project you sling it's way. If no project, then an epic dining hall with a watering hole nearby it, is usually a target project (SEE: Wavehandle).
« Last Edit: November 01, 2014, 10:24:26 am by Itnetlolor »
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vjek

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Re: How do you build your fort? Growth strategy, depth, and ressources routes.
« Reply #11 on: November 01, 2014, 02:27:03 pm »

I make the world as shallow as possible, one layer of caverns, so it's typically under 20 Z levels until magma.  I remove all volcanism to get sedimentary layers for the resources I want.

Surface is bare except for stairs downward, which leads through a short protected hallway to the interior of the fort.

Fort itself is 2 main levels:
Main meeting area, well, workshops and stockpiles in a single room 21 x 21
1x2 bedrooms in the level below for 40 dwarves, which is my hard cap limit.
Two or three 3x3 farms either on the housing level (mud on stone) or above in the soil layers.
Well is typically fed by an aquifer.

That's pretty much it.  That design has lasted well over 20 years in-game with no issues, so it's my default now.  Dwarves typically have to walk less than 10 tiles for food/drink, and less than 20 tiles to reach their bedroom.

miauw62

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Re: How do you build your fort? Growth strategy, depth, and ressources routes.
« Reply #12 on: November 01, 2014, 05:42:55 pm »

I arrange my workshops in a grid of workshop-sized cells with an up/down stair in the middle of every wall so the stockpile is both out of the way and easy to access. It doesn't look pretty and it's probably not very good for those fancy minecart systems that I understand literally nothing about, but it works. I just dig another level whenever I need more space and allocate a stone stockpile under my masons and a wood stockpile under my carpenters.
« Last Edit: November 01, 2014, 05:44:30 pm by miauw62 »
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pisskop

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Re: How do you build your fort? Growth strategy, depth, and ressources routes.
« Reply #13 on: November 01, 2014, 05:44:45 pm »

In a nutshell, I dig out mature (but not 'royal') rooms out at once, and akwardly shuffle around quarters until I get around to their rooms.  The masons Im more okay with, since I can clear a populated area of stone while growing, but other shops are worse off for it.
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Chevaleresse

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Re: How do you build your fort? Growth strategy, depth, and ressources routes.
« Reply #14 on: November 01, 2014, 05:52:06 pm »

I designate areas in a certain order, typically.
1. Central stockpile
2. Farms+related stockpiles (usually in a soil layer
3. Initial workshop area
4. Dining room, well room/indoor pond
5. Enough bedrooms for ~30 dwarves, plus two to four bedrooms for surprise nobles

Then I expand as needed. Dining room's always big enough for dozens of chairs and tables, and bedrooms usually end up being most of the area of the fort in their own wing because they're all 3x3 with two-wide halls.
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