Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Cthulhu]

I'm trying to scratch an itch.  I was playing Wolfenstein which is tons of fun but arcadey, and I got a sudden urge to play something more realistic and tactical, preferably open world but that's not super important.  Something with good ballistics, realistic enemy behavior and damage models (hint: Red Orchestra's 90% of shots are instant kills isn't all that realistic), preferably not military, single player, something along the lines of STALKER but less shitty.  Early scenes in SoC when you mostly used the MP5 and fights were intense and drawn out with flanking and cover (I'm particularly remembering a fight in Garbage against bandits holed up in a pile of concrete debris) are what mainly got this itch going.  I don't want to spend hours persuading those games to function though, I already tried with Call of Pripyat and was rewarded with a guy in an exoskeleton shooting me in the safehouse every time I load.

Something along those lines though, preferably with less bug and mods-are-mandatory-to-make-the-game-worth-playing problems than the STALKER series.  I figure I'm not gonna find much, a game like that would be ambitious enough that if it exists I'd probably know about it.

Oh and preferably no zombies.  Sick of zombies.

Basically I'm looking for something where I can use guerrilla, irregular tactics in fights that are tough and realistic.  Far Cry 2 and 3, STALKER, etc. are all in various parts of the neighborhood of scratching that itch.

[Graknorke]

So kind of like ArmA3's wilderness thing but single player?

[Mailo]

I'm no expert in shooters, but the first Crysis might be a close enough match ... doesn't quite fit the "no military" though.

[MasterFancyPants]

(hint: Red Orchestra's 90% of shots are instant kills isn't all that realistic)

Off topic, but good luck surviving a shot in your center mass from a high-powered rifle within 100 meters. 7.62x54R is a bit larger than 5.56x45, like leaving a 3 inch diameter hole larger.

[Cthulhu]

Instant kills are what I'm talking about.  Outside of damaging the central nervous system, the body's very resilient.  Like, even if a 50 caliber round hits you in the chest and destroys your heart completely, there's not really any physiological reason you shouldn't be able to keep fighting until your brain runs out of oxygen which is at least five or ten seconds, as long as your spine wasn't hit.  It's mostly psychology; pain, fear, even conditioning (action movies and the like teach us that falling down is what happens when you get shot) that determines whether or not you fall down immediately when shot, unless you're hit in the head or spine.

Red Orchestra 2 it doesn't really matter where you hit someone or what gun you use, as long as it's not a handgun he's almost always instantly down.

Max Payne 3 was too actiony (tons of fun on its own merits though) but is sort of the kind of gunplay I'm thinking of.  The bulletproof vests were especially cool.

[Shadowlord]

Have you played Max Payne 1 and 2? Not that they are in any way realistic open-world tactical shooters, but ...

[Graknorke]

So you want a realistic shooter that's like Max Payne?
I'm not sure that's even really possible.

[Cthulhu]

No, no.  I just meant the actual shooting.  Nothing else.  I played on the hardest mode when one or two shots would kill you and htere was no revive mechanic so you couldn't really do the matrix shit, it was mostly cover to cover, flanking, etc.

That kind of stuff is what I mean.  Stuff where you can't just run in guns blazing and have to use some actual tactics.

STALKER and Far Cry 2 and 3 are really closer to what I was thinking.  Far Cry I've played too much and STALKER is too clunky for me.  And I've played the shit out of it.

[Leatra]

Spec Ops: The Line was pretty good but it's absolutely not open world.

[TheBronzePickle]

Red Orchestra 2 is actually pretty realistic. Unless you're on some serious drugs, all the adrenaline, epinephrine, and other sympathetic chemicals your body can create are not enough to prevent you from going into shock from getting your lung torn out of the back of your chest. If you note, most of the 'dead' are still perfectly alive, screaming and moaning in pain and shock.

Welcome to war.

[Cthulhu]

That one's in range too but honestly I'm so sick of Heart of Darkpocalypse Now being the only "deep" subject video games will ever even attempt to engage with.

I'm so sick of it.

And yeah, I was thinking of that as I typed it, a lot of htem do roll around and stuff.  I wish they did something more interesting with the instant bleedout though.  Watching htem stop and stand and sway is kind of silly looking.

I dunno how much any of us can really say what's realistic or not though, I dunno how many of us have killed people.  I know somebody who was shot with a pistol though and they didn't realize they'd been shot until afterward.  The body is very good at suppressing pain and shock when it's life and death.

[TheBronzePickle]

I've seen a few people in various wounded states thanks to half of my family either working or having worked in the same hospital near where I live, including my single mom. I've also had the good misfortune of seeing a few die. It's obviously not a good direct example because of the fact that the sympathetic nervous system's usually already shut down, but I have heard plenty of 'this just happened' stories about people getting all kinds of varying injuries.

Most people get fucked up pretty badly pretty quickly. A single round of pistol ammo, even 'light' pistol ammo like .320 ACP, can usually put someone down if they're not in a fight-or-flight state when they're shot. Of course, most people in a fight for their life are very much in fight-or-flight mode, and it can sometimes take several .45 ACP rounds or up to take them down. Anyone on a good amount of something like cocaine or meth is basically invincible to anything that doesn't outright cripple them like spine or brain damage.

Soldiers are a bit weird, though. The closest thing I can compare them to is gang members. The problem with these guys is that they can basically run out of fight-or-flight if they're in an engagement long enough. The body can only store so much adrenaline, epinephrine and norepinephrine and once that shit runs out it takes a while for them to build back up. After an extended firefight, gang members literally get easier to take out (assuming anyone can even shoot straight enough any more, gang members aren't exactly known for their training), and I imagine that the same can be said for a soldier.

As for STALKER, you're playing on the highest difficulty setting, right? The rest of the difficulty settings are... 'broken', to put it nicely.

[Cthulhu]

Of course.  Again the issue with stalker is mainly the bugs and shit.  When I played CoP a guy in an exoskeleton decided to kill me in the safe zone. 

I'm playing I am Alive and it's scratching some of the gritty violence itch.  It's like The Road with parkour and guns, a lot of the people you find are just as scared and hungry as you are, so it's not like everybody's an ice cold killing machine.  Fun fights.

One issue is everyone taking one shot to kill like in RO2 is that it can make the fights kind of easy.  Part of what would make a real fight more difficult is that you don't know for sure if you've got somebody.  You pop out of cover, shoot somebody, he just shoots you back, you know?  A lot of cops have died like that.

[Shadowlord]

One issue is everyone taking one shot to kill like in RO2 is that it can make the fights kind of easy.  Part of what would make a real fight more difficult is that you don't know for sure if you've got somebody.  You pop out of cover, shoot somebody, he just shoots you back, you know?  A lot of cops have died like that.

Which is probably why they spray bullets from their pistols until their target goes down or they run out of bullets (to the detriment of bystanders).

Back on games, have you played the original Deus Ex? On Realistic? If you shoot a regular human enemy early in the game in the head with your basic pistol, they die. But their bullets to your head are just as lethal, and your foes have pretty accurate aim up close. Mind you, it's a game where you're a nano-technologically augmented agent in a plausible semi-near-ish future world.

[ThtblovesDF]

There was a hlČ/source mod that did damage very well in a ww2 scenario - sure, most shots would kill you, but small arms fire you could surive and regardless if it was a deadly or a "non" deadly shot, you would go ragdoll for a short while, so often you'd shot a fella in the window, but could never be certain if he was dead unless you see the body. Supression was also very done there, sadly i forgot the name, thou moddb will spit it out if you bug it.