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[Persus13]

NQT:

Persus

I'd have to determine it by contextual evidence. However, lacking that, I'd say a laughably weak case, because scum players would try to put a bit of effort into their case, instead of just voting someone for no reason.

That's a fair amount of faith you have there in the prowess of the scum team. Do you see yourself forming a case by the end of today?

Yeah, I tend to operate on the principle that scum are smart, or at least try to be smart, because that's usually what happens or is the best case scenario. As for forming a case today, it depends on how much info we get out of today.

Worldmaster

Persus13: I think I learned how to, at least adequately, portray myself as town when I'm scum. I learned a bit about conducting a scumhunt and I adopted an outlook of "playing to learn". Aside from that, just general purpose what-not-to-do and what-to-do things as well as how the mechanics work in general, for a BM at the very least.

What do you think is important to do on the first day, if nothing else?

Do you think you have an idea on actually hunting scum instead of pretending to?

I think it's important that people talk and get good conversations going on D1. Often what happens with D1 is people say D1 is useless and so don't do much work, but D1 lays the groundwork for the rest of the game. Canvassing everyone with questions is usually too much to handle and too much spread of information, but if you get a few good dialogues going with people you can get a good amount of info on someone. Hopefully other people are doing the same thing with other people as well. D1 usually is one of the longest days because it takes a while to get these conversations going well.

flabort: Trust? Myself. Really though, anyone could be scum so I'm going to try to avoid completely trusting one person. If you're asking who seems like town, then I'd say yourself.

As far as suspects, I'm not sure. At the moment I'm thinking to see who the scum kill during the night and evaluate this day. If I had to say at this moment, I'd go with Persus. He's been lurking, as he admits, and he hasn't altogether contributed much to the discussion by asking questions. He seems content to sit on the sidelines.

If I'm your top suspect, then why aren't you voting me? It's not like you're voting anyone else?

Flabort:

UI, TDS: The day ends today, without extensions. Are you satisfied with lynching Varee today? Is lynching what is essentially a completely random pick for you alright?

Are you (or were you) satisfied with a Varee lynch? If yes, why didn't you extend if you were concerned about the other lynch votes being random, if no, why didn't you unvote or extend?

EBWOP:

Persus, Worldmaster: The day ends today, and you haven't used your votes yet. Are you OK with just sitting on the sidelines, letting RVS continue?

I was asleep (or trying to) when the votecount was posted, but this morning I voted for an extension. As for voting someone, your vote on me today was the first non-RVS vote, so I don't see how me not using my vote makes me sit on the sidelines. How does me not using my vote early D1 make me not participating? How about worldmaster, who voted and then unvoted?

PFW

EBWOP:

Persus, Worldmaster: The day ends today, and you haven't used your votes yet. Are you OK with just sitting on the sidelines, letting RVS continue?

Yes, because I have yet to see anything really scummy yet.

Extend, I'll post more after class.

How about lurking, not participating in RVS by only asking two token questions, and having no desire to hunt scum? I can name one person doing that, Persus13.

This is really odd for you. First of, its D1 and your voting me for lurking. Generally that isn't a D1 vote thing, because it's freaking D1. The only people who currently have more then 5 posts are you and Varee. I have 2 (now 3), Deathsword has 1, UI has 2, NQT and TDS both have 3. You have 11, and Varee has nine, but both of you have a lot of short posts so your probably about equal in content to NQT or UI's posts. Lurking should not be a major part of your vote and if you were really hunting people based on lurking, you would have mentioned Deathsword too.

As for your accusation that I only asked two questions in RVS, that is a ridiculous statement to have in a case. First of, it's false, I asked UI question as well as Deathsword and Worldmaster. Secondly, saying this statement takes that one fact out of context. It completely ignores the fact that the game started late Monday night when I was asleep, and that Tuesday is an extremely busy day for me, which meant I couldn't participate in the first day of the game. This meant that plenty of people already had questions for me and so I didn't need to initiate a conversation. People only need to ask huge amounts of questions when D1 has just started because the conversation needs to get moving somehow. after that you only really need to ask questions to people you want to talk to and haven't. Finally, asking a large number of RVS questions is not a measure of how town you are. If it was, Toaster wouldn't have been scum in your BYOR.

As for having no desire to hunt scum, how did you get there from me saying I hadn't seen anything scummy?

So, why are you attacking me with your awful case with unusual aggressiveness early on, right after the day got extended? Why did you make a snide poke at me with a vote attached instead of waiting until after work and pulling up a better case then?

[Scripten]

Scripten
Ask me one such question.

Do you believe that Persus13's crossvote and push on Flabort are essentially OMGUS?

If so, do you find it to be scum-motivated? If not, do you find Flabort's vote on Persus13 to be suspicious?

Flabort: I've only asked a few RVS questions and have been mostly reactionary. What drove you to vote for Persus13 instead of me?

[notquitethere]

Urist Imiknorris
I apparently omitted to add a question mark to my question here:

Nope. D1 is basically a crapshoot because nobody knows anything (except the scum but they aren't telling). The primary objective is to start gaining information, and worrying about everyone doing it in a specific way is just a distraction.

OK, what's the most useful kind of information to draw out of people at this stage (assuming, you know, that scum don't typically openly spill their alignment on D1)?

Now that's cleared up, could you answer me?


Varee

NQT i got an interesting idea, what do you think of" not reading role pm so you dont act suspicious?"

I think that's stupid for all the obvious reasons. I'm sure you can see why. Also, could you answer this please:

In the games you've played before do you think you should have been able to work out who the scum were in hindsight?

Worldmaster

NQT: I expect this to be a fair bit more difficult than #49, as there are more experienced players here.

Surely it'd be easier with so many experienced players: town outnumber scum after all. Or are you already worried you might be found out?

Do you think it is better to have many or few power roles?

It's a different kind of game with more roles.  Town information roles tend to make the game easier for town, too many roles ends up in a chaotic game where stuff just happens and no one knows why.


TDS

You asked me a yes/no question and I didn't have much time to answer before I had to do other stuff. As for the summary, I'll give that later when I have time.

I eagerly await this blessed day.


Flabort

In your opinion, with your knowledge of the players present:

• Who is the greatest threat to town as scum?
[0]Who is the Least beneficial to town as town?


• Who is the least beneficial to scum as scum?
[0]Who is the greatest threat to scum as town?

Me, maybe World as he's the least experienced, ditto, me again. If I can't include myself, then maybe Deathsword, he's pretty good (though he's a bit too easy to annoy: just try calling him 'death's word'...). Do you think Persus is the best fit for scum at this stage?

Notquitethere, Deathsword, Varee, Scripten: The day ends today. If you are not satisfied with lynching Varee, why aren't you trying to get us out of RVS? I don't see much discussion from any of you.

Every time I post I talk to everyone and keep pushing on questions, can't move any quicker than that. Day 1 is always extended.


Persus

Yeah, I tend to operate on the principle that scum are smart, or at least try to be smart, because that's usually what happens or is the best case scenario. As for forming a case today, it depends on how much info we get out of today.

Will you just not vote if you don't have a case then?


Scripten

Do you believe that Persus13's crossvote and push on Flabort are essentially OMGUS?

If so, do you find it to be scum-motivated? If not, do you find Flabort's vote on Persus13 to be suspicious?

Good questions. Flabort appears to have fairly legitimate reasons to vote someone, but Persus points out that the lurking claim is ill-founded and he has some kind of defence for the low post count. I wouldn't have voted Flabort over his case, but it's not exactly scummy to vote a weak case and it isn't an OMGUS: an OMGUS in the proper sense of the word is a purely reactionary vote. Persus has some semblance of a justification. At this stage I see nothing that distinguishes this spat from the typical thing townies get into it. I'll see how it develops. Do you find either of them suspicious for this?

[TheDarkStar]

UI, TDS: The day ends today, without extensions. Are you satisfied with lynching Varee today? Is lynching what is essentially a completely random pick for you alright?

I'd extend if we hadn't already. Anyway, no, I'm not satisfied with lynching Varee because it's completely random. I've seen nothing suspicious from him so far, so I'll unvote to help avoid a random lynch.

TDS

You asked me a yes/no question and I didn't have much time to answer before I had to do other stuff. As for the summary, I'll give that later when I have time.

I eagerly await this blessed day.

THIS BLESSED DAY HAS ARRIVED, ONE DAY LATER!

I apologize for poor wording, though; playstyle descriptions are hard to word.

1. TheDarkStar: A simply amazing player  .
2. Scripten: New, less active than other people usually. I have less experience playing with him.
3. Urist Imiknorris: I haven't played with him much.
4. flabort: Makes use of his vote for pressure
5. notquitethere: Likes long posts and lots of questions.
6. Varee: I haven't played with him much, but he seems like a cautious player. He's fairly new.
7. Persus13: Very experienced; questions just about everyone for everything.
8. Worldmaster27: New; scumhunts moderately well and tends to be fairly active
9. Deathsword: He's decent at playing, but he's often less active than other people.

In this group, everyone is relatively skilled, but that's a given because of the game type.

[Urist Imiknorris]

PFP, crap day, thx4extend.

Varee:

umm answering our question carefuly? i dont know.....

Why would town need to be careful?

Also UI, I was ignoring the question because it just a joke, i dont think it is important for me to answer it right?

Indeed. I asked you that question as a way of applying pressure, however little, because I couldn't be bothered to do RVS 'properly.' Your reactions to it and answers to flabort are making it stay.

NQT: The most important thing is a preliminary read on everyone, as well as material to question them over, such as why they tied the vote or why they didn't vote x or why they attacked y for voting x. Basically, reads and leads.

[flabort]

Flabort:

UI, TDS: The day ends today, without extensions. Are you satisfied with lynching Varee today? Is lynching what is essentially a completely random pick for you alright?

Are you (or were you) satisfied with a Varee lynch? If yes, why didn't you extend if you were concerned about the other lynch votes being random, if no, why didn't you unvote or extend?

I saw the two other votes on Varee as random by the people who voted them. I had not voted randomly, as I was getting minorly annoyed at his complete lack of drive towards working to get us out of RVS; he could have answered the questions of those voting him to their Satisfaction (VAREE, the word I was looking for was SATISFACTORILY), he could have asked questions and pursued leads, he could have just asked for them to change their votes, he could have drawn a number out of his hat and started pursuing that person, he could have used reactionary tactics like TDS was using on him ("I'm voting you back, how does that make you feel?"), any number of tactics would have worked.

EBWOP:

Persus, Worldmaster: The day ends today, and you haven't used your votes yet. Are you OK with just sitting on the sidelines, letting RVS continue?

I was asleep (or trying to) when the votecount was posted, but this morning I voted for an extension. As for voting someone, your vote on me today was the first non-RVS vote, so I don't see how me not using my vote makes me sit on the sidelines. How does me not using my vote early D1 make me not participating? How about worldmaster, who voted and then unvoted?

Second non-RVS vote, as detailed above. My second vote on Varee was my first, as implied when I replied to an answer to somebody else's question.
During the RVS, also known as "Random VOTING stage", it is expected that you will vote for SOMEONE. Someone who does not vote until RVS is over is a lazy player, and even a player who withdraws their vote is doing far more work and putting more time into their scum-hunting play than someone who does not even lay a vote during a stage of the game that has "VOTING" right in it's name. Therefor, Worldmaster is politely excused, because he put in that effort, not just to vote, but to unvote as well. TWO actions to your ZERO.

PFW

EBWOP:

Persus, Worldmaster: The day ends today, and you haven't used your votes yet. Are you OK with just sitting on the sidelines, letting RVS continue?

Yes, because I have yet to see anything really scummy yet.

Extend, I'll post more after class.

How about lurking, not participating in RVS by only asking two token questions, and having no desire to hunt scum? I can name one person doing that, Persus13.

This is really odd for you. First of, its D1 and your voting me for lurking. Generally that isn't a D1 vote thing, because it's freaking D1. The only people who currently have more then 5 posts are you and Varee. I have 2 (now 3), Deathsword has 1, UI has 2, NQT and TDS both have 3. You have 11, and Varee has nine, but both of you have a lot of short posts so your probably about equal in content to NQT or UI's posts. Lurking should not be a major part of your vote and if you were really hunting people based on lurking, you would have mentioned Deathsword too.

Odd for me? What is odd for me? My play style changes by the game, one day blindly sheeping and getting in arguments with Tiruin over semantics, the next wildly firing off gambits and aggroing every serial killer in the game. I keep learning, assimilating, and revising.
And technically, speaking, Day 1 is the best time for lurkers to lurk BECAUSE nobody suspects them for it.
Let's see... who posted first, you or Deathsword?
Reply #24 on: October 21, 2014, 01:41:07 pm
vs
Reply #40 on: October 22, 2014, 10:34:14 am
Hmm... whoever posted first posted posted 21 hours before the other.
Let's see... it was Deathsword who posted first! He's way ahead of the game than you, in terms of activity. Oh, you have more posts, yah. Barely.

As for your accusation that I only asked two questions in RVS, that is a ridiculous statement to have in a case. First of, it's false, I asked UI question as well as Deathsword and Worldmaster.

A joke question in response to a joke question. I count that as flavor text.
To compare, the other person that you're accusing of heavily lurking, Deathsword, posted three, which is one more than you, plus a flavor text joke question to match yours.
He also used his vote. Can you say that you did, before you OMGUSed?
NEXT QUOTE PLEASE.

Secondly, saying this statement takes that one fact out of context. It completely ignores the fact that the game started late Monday night when I was asleep, and that Tuesday is an extremely busy day for me, which meant I couldn't participate in the first day of the game. This meant that plenty of people already had questions for me and so I didn't need to initiate a conversation.

This stinks of lazy scum.
"I didn't feel like being good town and asking questions, so I just waited until I could brush of other people's questions by admitting to lurking"
Your longest answer could have been answered in 10 words: "Town with powers sometimes lie, but most liars are scum"
Yeah.... you just described a core mechanic of the game. You didn't state what was really your opinion, you just took a simple truth and fluffed it up with "I don't believe in Policy A because Truth X".
Your other answer that wasn't "I lurk" was "I'd have to determine it by contextual evidence." "I'm too lazy to think about that because that is not the current situation".
I wanted to be the ScumIC in Beginner's Mafia for a good reason. I know what lazy scum think, I know what good scum think. I am pretty sure I know what good and lazy town think. Lazy town think "I'll post my questions in an hour". Lazy scum think "I'll post my questions later... oh, it can wait for tomorrow, maybe next week".

People only need to ask huge amounts of questions when D1 has just started because the conversation needs to get moving somehow.

True. Accepted. Wolverine can heal himself. God is considered to be Good. The earth is round.

after that you only really need to ask questions to people you want to talk to and haven't.

You only need to breath every wednesday. Martians are real. People are born with naturally blue, green, pink, and magenta hair.
In other words, false.
If you don't follow an answer with another question, conversation stagnates, and you are back in square one, right where the scum want town to be. Therefore, you ask questions of everyone, even those you don't want to talk to, even those you have already talked to. 

Finally, asking a large number of RVS questions is not a measure of how town you are. If it was, Toaster wouldn't have been scum in your BYOR.

It's a measure of how much effort you are willing to put into the game.
Scum want to get the most bang for the least buck. They don't like putting effort into the game. Especially lazy scum.

As for having no desire to hunt scum, how did you get there from me saying I hadn't seen anything scummy?

"Are you OK with sitting on the sidelines?" "Yes"
"Letting RVS continue?" "Yes"
You're honestly OK with those two things, because you "Haven't seen anything scummy". Did I ask you if you'd seen anything scummy? The question wasn't "Who do you suspect", it was "will you get off your lazy scum ass and play the damn game?"

So, why are you attacking me with your awful case with unusual aggressiveness early on, right after the day got extended? Why did you make a snide poke at me with a vote attached instead of waiting until after work and pulling up a better case then?

I'm learning to be: Active. Aggressive. Attentive. The three As of winning Mafia. I am learning to use my vote better, by pressing my suspicions early, and by not reactively OMGUSing someone just because they have a weak case on me.
Oh, look, somebody did a reactive OMGUS on someone who they believed had a weak case. Hmm. YOU.

Now, if you'll excuse me, your tunnel vision is distracting me from hunting other scum, and looking under other rocks for signs of scumminess.


Varee You still have two votes on you. Instead of whining about being powerless, I would like you to read the posts of the people voting you, figure out why they're voting you besides random, and provide satisfactory answers to those two people. Can you do that?

Flabort: I've only asked a few RVS questions and have been mostly reactionary. What drove you to vote for Persus13 instead of me?

Let's see. I've kept seeing your face pop up, so you're active. You have asked questions, and they were not questions not even relating to THIS game. OK, one was relating to my meta, but at least you asked if it was something I was going to continue with in this game, so it's still related to THIS game.
When I said his questions were Token Efforts, I mean really, asking how another game went and what you like about the rules?

Question for you: Who do you think has a better chance of winning the game: Deathsword or NQT? I am aware that they could be on the same team, but taking that into account only evens the odds slightly.

TheDarkStar What do you think about Notquitethere's attack on Worldmaster? Do you see it as an extension of the RVS or as a genuine attack?

UI: In answer to your question to Varee, town needs to be not careless. A careless town gets themselves accidentally lynched and wastes a day for their allies. Now, why would you ask that kind of careless question?

Deathsword While you did have an earlier start than Persus, he does have a small point in that he is starting to get ahead of you in post count, and if this continues, maybe content. Where are you? And more importantly, which is better: to ask a few good questions, or a LARGE number of bad questions?

NQT: Yes, at this stage, I am becoming increasingly convinced that Persus is the best fit for scum. Do you think that Worldmaster is the best fit for scum?
Also, I think a sufficiently skilled player could actually, uh... Varee has a point. In an elaborate setup-dependant gambit, which would only WORK if the player actually wound up scum, if they didn't read their role PM they could actually play as town until LYLO, and then, believing themselves to be town, lynch another town and win the game for scum. However, this is a meta discussion that should be taken to the out of game banter thread.
What is, in your opinion, the strongest kind of scumtell on day 1?

Worldmaster: I feel like you should have posted again since your last post, which was purely a response to me. Do you intend to?

[Jack A T]

In an elaborate setup-dependant gambit, which would only WORK if the player actually wound up scum, if they didn't read their role PM they could actually play as town until LYLO, and then, believing themselves to be town, lynch another town and win the game for scum.

This (not reading one's PM) would be an incredible violation of the Play to Win rule, and I can't see many mods here responding kindly to it.

Votecount:
*TheDarkStar - Deathsword (1)
*Scripten - (0)
*Urist Imiknorris - Varee (1)
*flabort - Persus13 (1)
*notquitethere - (0)
*Varee - Urist Imiknorris (1)
*Persus13 - Scripten, flabort (2)
*Worldmaster27 - notquitethere (1)
*Deathsword - (0)
Not voting: Worldmaster27, TheDarkStar

Extension requests: (0/3)
Shorten requests: (0/5)

Day ends Monday, Oct. 27th, at 9:30 PM PST.

[Varee]

Sorry but quoting thing on the phone is rather tedious and hard so I cant really properly answer question in WoT. And the browser like to eat my post half way though .....

Varee: Why did you choose to ignore my question until Persus asked me about it?

Quote from: Varee on 22,October 2014, 06:49:24 am
@TDs, my question to you would be "What can you do?" If people are voting you during  RVS, there not really anyhing info you can use to prove that you are on their side, or maybe they are conspiring against you, in that case.... Not thing yo can do.....

But if it's RVS, they're not voting you because they think you're scum. They're voting at random. Why would you need to prove that you're on their side in that case? And why are you trying to paint yourself as a victim with that conspiracy talk?

1st- I was doing that as a joke and I assume you did it as a joke also, I dont want to drag on the joke more than necessary so I just ignore the question.
2nd-What I want to say is the the vote on me is not base on the reason that the people thing that i am a scum therefore I dont have the infomation that I need to prove to the people that they should not vote me because their reason is wrong as there is no reason in the first place. Also I dont know what conspiracy you are talking about?

Why would town need to be careful?

I am guessing flabort puzzle as I got no clue what he is talking about then .....


@NQT :

Quote from: notquitethere on 23,October 2014, 12:20:41 am
In the games you've played before do you think you should have been able to work out who the scum were in hindsight?

I dont remember all the game I played in before but for the last few of them the answer would be no ......
The latest flabort game, I was less focus on helping the town and more on just getting to day 3 as the alternate wincon look more flavorable.  I remeber having a really hard time guessing who the scum is in dead chat.
The BYOR before that was a little hectic and there no scum so to say......
The CYOM was err i dont remeber that too well but I was not doing a very good job except for causing trouble....


Looking back I kinda realise how bad of a job I did at scumhunting.......

[Scripten]

Good questions. Flabort appears to have fairly legitimate reasons to vote someone, but Persus points out that the lurking claim is ill-founded and he has some kind of defence for the low post count. I wouldn't have voted Flabort over his case, but it's not exactly scummy to vote a weak case and it isn't an OMGUS: an OMGUS in the proper sense of the word is a purely reactionary vote. Persus has some semblance of a justification. At this stage I see nothing that distinguishes this spat from the typical thing townies get into it. I'll see how it develops. Do you find either of them suspicious for this?

Fair enough. I'd like to see more interaction between the two of them before I lay down any suspicions. My gut is siding with Persus13, but I realize that the reason I feel that way is due to Flabort tunneling Persus13 more. I've learned over time that tunneling is usually not a scum tell, though people like to think it is. People pushing others to tunnel are often actual scum.

So, town v town makes a lot of sense right now.

Question for you: Who do you think has a better chance of winning the game: Deathsword or NQT? I am aware that they could be on the same team, but taking that into account only evens the odds slightly.

To be honest, I couldn't tell you. I've never seen either of their scum games, and the last game I saw Deathsword in, he was inactive due to life things. (He was also an IC for a newbie game, so that can affect playstyle a lot.) That's a strange question. Why did you ask it? Why direct it toward me?

[Persus13]

NQT:

Persus

Yeah, I tend to operate on the principle that scum are smart, or at least try to be smart, because that's usually what happens or is the best case scenario. As for forming a case today, it depends on how much info we get out of today.

Will you just not vote if you don't have a case then?

No, I would likely use my vote for pressure or to vote someone I find scummy but don't have a full case on to break a tie, if necessary. What do you assume about the scum?

Spoiler: Long response to Flabort (click to show/hide)

Flabort:

Flabort:

UI, TDS: The day ends today, without extensions. Are you satisfied with lynching Varee today? Is lynching what is essentially a completely random pick for you alright?

Are you (or were you) satisfied with a Varee lynch? If yes, why didn't you extend if you were concerned about the other lynch votes being random, if no, why didn't you unvote or extend?

I saw the two other votes on Varee as random by the people who voted them. I had not voted randomly, as I was getting minorly annoyed at his complete lack of drive towards working to get us out of RVS; he could have answered the questions of those voting him to their Satisfaction (VAREE, the word I was looking for was SATISFACTORILY), he could have asked questions and pursued leads, he could have just asked for them to change their votes, he could have drawn a number out of his hat and started pursuing that person, he could have used reactionary tactics like TDS was using on him ("I'm voting you back, how does that make you feel?"), any number of tactics would have worked.

Are you (or were you) satisfied with a Varee lynch? If yes, why didn't you extend if you were concerned about the other lynch votes being random, if no, why didn't you unvote or extend?

EBWOP:

Persus, Worldmaster: The day ends today, and you haven't used your votes yet. Are you OK with just sitting on the sidelines, letting RVS continue?

I was asleep (or trying to) when the votecount was posted, but this morning I voted for an extension. As for voting someone, your vote on me today was the first non-RVS vote, so I don't see how me not using my vote makes me sit on the sidelines. How does me not using my vote early D1 make me not participating? How about worldmaster, who voted and then unvoted?

During the RVS, also known as "Random VOTING stage", it is expected that you will vote for SOMEONE. Someone who does not vote until RVS is over is a lazy player, and even a player who withdraws their vote is doing far more work and putting more time into their scum-hunting play than someone who does not even lay a vote during a stage of the game that has "VOTING" right in it's name. Therefor, Worldmaster is politely excused, because he put in that effort, not just to vote, but to unvote as well. TWO actions to your ZERO.

If the bolded part were true, you'd have a point. How does me voting someone with a question at the start of the game help me find scum better then me just asking a question? How does an unvote count as a scumhunting action in your book?

PFW

EBWOP:

Persus, Worldmaster: The day ends today, and you haven't used your votes yet. Are you OK with just sitting on the sidelines, letting RVS continue?

Yes, because I have yet to see anything really scummy yet.

Extend, I'll post more after class.

How about lurking, not participating in RVS by only asking two token questions, and having no desire to hunt scum? I can name one person doing that, Persus13.

This is really odd for you. First of, its D1 and your voting me for lurking. Generally that isn't a D1 vote thing, because it's freaking D1. The only people who currently have more then 5 posts are you and Varee. I have 2 (now 3), Deathsword has 1, UI has 2, NQT and TDS both have 3. You have 11, and Varee has nine, but both of you have a lot of short posts so your probably about equal in content to NQT or UI's posts. Lurking should not be a major part of your vote and if you were really hunting people based on lurking, you would have mentioned Deathsword too.

Odd for me? What is odd for me? My play style changes by the game, one day blindly sheeping and getting in arguments with Tiruin over semantics, the next wildly firing off gambits and aggroing every serial killer in the game. I keep learning, assimilating, and revising.
And technically, speaking, Day 1 is the best time for lurkers to lurk BECAUSE nobody suspects them for it.
Let's see... who posted first, you or Deathsword?
Reply #24 on: October 21, 2014, 01:41:07 pm
vs
Reply #40 on: October 22, 2014, 10:34:14 am
Hmm... whoever posted first posted posted 21 hours before the other.
Let's see... it was Deathsword who posted first! He's way ahead of the game than you, in terms of activity. Oh, you have more posts, yah. Barely.

What. part. of. I. wasn't. available. at. day. start. for 24. hours. doesn't. register?
What part of you can't lurk on D1 because lurking can only be seen after a long period of time do you not understand?
How does one post at the start of the game when there is nothing to work with mean more content then multiple posts later on in the day?

As for your accusation that I only asked two questions in RVS, that is a ridiculous statement to have in a case. First of, it's false, I asked UI question as well as Deathsword and Worldmaster.

A joke question in response to a joke question. I count that as flavor text.
To compare, the other person that you're accusing of heavily lurking, Deathsword, posted three, which is one more than you, plus a flavor text joke question to match yours.
He also used his vote. Can you say that you did, before you OMGUSed?
NEXT QUOTE PLEASE.

Except I actually asked that question seriously. How could you take a question that goes "Are you being serious about this or are you joking?" to be a joke?

Secondly, saying this statement takes that one fact out of context. It completely ignores the fact that the game started late Monday night when I was asleep, and that Tuesday is an extremely busy day for me, which meant I couldn't participate in the first day of the game. This meant that plenty of people already had questions for me and so I didn't need to initiate a conversation.

This stinks of lazy scum.
"I didn't feel like being good town and asking questions, so I just waited until I could brush of other people's questions by admitting to lurking"
Your longest answer could have been answered in 10 words: "Town with powers sometimes lie, but most liars are scum"

Completely twisting my words. Check. Attacking me for being absent for RL reasons. Check. I love lynching people who behave the way you're behaving.

Yeah.... you just described a core mechanic of the game. You didn't state what was really your opinion, you just took a simple truth and fluffed it up with "I don't believe in Policy A because Truth X".

And that makes me scum because....

Your other answer that wasn't "I lurk" was "I'd have to determine it by contextual evidence." "I'm too lazy to think about that because that is not the current situation".

And your ignoring the fact that I went on and answered the question anyway because....
Also, I say something along the lines of "I'd prefer to know the context" the majority of the time I'm asked a hypothetical scenario. Come up with good reasons why I'm scum.
Also also, the I lurk parts were a joke. I thought that came across, but I guess I was wrong.

I wanted to be the ScumIC in Beginner's Mafia for a good reason. I know what lazy scum think, I know what good scum think. I am pretty sure I know what good and lazy town think. Lazy town think "I'll post my questions in an hour". Lazy scum think "I'll post my questions later... oh, it can wait for tomorrow, maybe next week".

So you're insinuating that I'm lazy scum. When was the last time you saw me be lazy, town or scum?

after that you only really need to ask questions to people you want to talk to and haven't.

You only need to breath every wednesday. Martians are real. People are born with naturally blue, green, pink, and magenta hair.
In other words, false.
If you don't follow an answer with another question, conversation stagnates, and you are back in square one, right where the scum want town to be. Therefore, you ask questions of everyone, even those you don't want to talk to, even those you have already talked to.

You're assuming that the person originally asked the question won't follow up when they have a duty to do so. All it took was me pointing out that your case was wrong for you to follow up. I haven't asked many questions to NQT, but he's been following up my answers to him with more questions. If you want more information about something or see something odd, you ask a question. I did that. Also I apologize, I should have specified that "you only really need to ask RVS questions" in my statement above.

Finally, asking a large number of RVS questions is not a measure of how town you are. If it was, Toaster wouldn't have been scum in your BYOR.

It's a measure of how much effort you are willing to put into the game.
Scum want to get the most bang for the least buck. They don't like putting effort into the game. Especially lazy scum.

Really. Why do scum not want to put effort into the game? Shouldn't they be the ones who want to put the most effort into the game since they have to fool everyone else? Also you completely ignored my point but whatever.

As for having no desire to hunt scum, how did you get there from me saying I hadn't seen anything scummy?

"Are you OK with sitting on the sidelines?" "Yes"
"Letting RVS continue?" "Yes"
You're honestly OK with those two things, because you "Haven't seen anything scummy". Did I ask you if you'd seen anything scummy? The question wasn't "Who do you suspect", it was "will you get off your lazy scum ass and play the damn game?"

I don't play well unless I notice something odd. So I'm not very good in RVS. This isn't as unusual among mafia players as you think it is, its just that usually (especially when I'm scum) I make a lot of effort to participate in RVS. Things change when you become more busy.

So, why are you attacking me with your awful case with unusual aggressiveness early on, right after the day got extended? Why did you make a snide poke at me with a vote attached instead of waiting until after work and pulling up a better case then?

I'm learning to be: Active. Aggressive. Attentive. The three As of winning Mafia. I am learning to use my vote better, by pressing my suspicions early, and by not reactively OMGUSing someone just because they have a weak case on me.
Oh, look, somebody did a reactive OMGUS on someone who they believed had a weak case. Hmm. YOU.

Stop sounding like a politician and answer the question please.

Now, if you'll excuse me, your tunnel vision is distracting me from hunting other scum, and looking under other rocks for signs of scumminess.

I'm sorry I'm making you tunnel and then have to work to not tunnel.

Flabort: I've only asked a few RVS questions and have been mostly reactionary. What drove you to vote for Persus13 instead of me?

Let's see. I've kept seeing your face pop up, so you're active. You have asked questions, and they were not questions not even relating to THIS game. OK, one was relating to my meta, but at least you asked if it was something I was going to continue with in this game, so it's still related to THIS game.
When I said his questions were Token Efforts, I mean really, asking how another game went and what you like about the rules?

The content of the questions don't matter, as long as they are mafia relevant and you can learn something.

Question for you: Who do you think has a better chance of winning the game: Deathsword or NQT? I am aware that they could be on the same team, but taking that into account only evens the odds slightly.

Actually if they're on the same team, they win together. So both would win or both would lose. Why do you think Deathsword and NQT are on different teams? The most likely scenario is they are both town.

[Teneb]

PFP

I ended completely forgetting about this. I'll post in a few hours when I'm done with work.

[Scripten]

Going on a trip tomorrow for a Tech Jam in Vermont. I'll be gone from 7am until 7pm est. Therefore, I will almost assuredly not be posting then.

Please let me know if I have any outstanding questions or whatnot aimed at me. These walls are massive and my head hurts tonight.

[Persus13]

Going on a trip tomorrow for a Tech Jam in Vermont. I'll be gone from 7am until 7pm est. Therefore, I will almost assuredly not be posting then.

Please let me know if I have any outstanding questions or whatnot aimed at me. These walls are massive and my head hurts tonight.

Sorry about the WoTs. Do you think you could post reads on everyone in the game at this stage?

[notquitethere]

TDS

THIS BLESSED DAY HAS ARRIVED, ONE DAY LATER!

Wonderful. And though you took the time to form impressions regarding the other players, you didn't find anything worth voting?


Imiknorris

NQT: The most important thing is a preliminary read on everyone, as well as material to question them over, such as why they tied the vote or why they didn't vote x or why they attacked y for voting x. Basically, reads and leads.

I can go along with that. Would you prefer people were also voting Varee, or are you happy having a non-lynching vote on someone at the end of the day?


Flabort

NQT: Yes, at this stage, I am becoming increasingly convinced that Persus is the best fit for scum. Do you think that Worldmaster is the best fit for scum?

I'm waiting on Worldmaster's response to me before I make any firm conclusions regarding his scumminess. Who do you think has received the least attention today? 

What is, in your opinion, the strongest kind of scumtell on day 1?

Ask me this again on Day 2. If I tell you now, scum may change their behaviour accordingly.


Varee

Looking back I kinda realise how bad of a job I did at scumhunting.......

So what are you going to do differently in this game?


Scripten

So, town v town makes a lot of sense right now.

I see... so why are you still voting Persus? You're initial vote on him was just asking where he'd been.


Persus

No, I would likely use my vote for pressure or to vote someone I find scummy but don't have a full case on to break a tie, if necessary. What do you assume about the scum?

I see, and is your vote on Flabort just pressure, or would you call it a proper case? Is Flabort the best fit for scum? I assume that the scum team will probably look to kill the most competent player tonight. If I'm doing my job right, I might not be alive tomorrow.


Deathsword, would be good to hear from you before you sneak your way through the day. I notice that if the extend hadn't gone through, you'd have carried an RVS vote on through until the end of the day unchanged...

[TheDarkStar]

TDS

THIS BLESSED DAY HAS ARRIVED, ONE DAY LATER!

Wonderful. And though you took the time to form impressions regarding the other players, you didn't find anything worth voting?

It's a list of playstyles, not reads. If you want reads, ask for reads.