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[Kilojoule Proton]

(I'm not sure about the supporters of the cyclic reincarnation plan, but so far, I've interpreted it as basically having some initial values set, so to speak, on birth on the other world.)

[gman8181]

Out of curiosity, are you just trying to antagonize random powerful beings or was there some alterior motive to that?

[Vgray]

"I think he objected to me possibly lying by omission."

[Andres]

"When reincarnation happens every memory and facet of personality and identity that that being had is lost. Only their raw soul is left which is nigh indistinguishable from every other soul of its race. Everything you liked about those people is effectively dead forever, as are they. I'll take my leave now."

(I was tired. I forgot that I have ethics in this game.)

(Choose one, jerk)

(You created a system that took a soul and stripped it down to the bare essentials, killing its personality and memories in the process, and recycling it like was some scrap piece of garbage. All I did was inform him of how the system worked. And yet I'm the unethical one.)

(I'm not sure about the supporters of the cyclic reincarnation plan, but so far, I've interpreted it as basically having some initial values set, so to speak, on birth on the other world.)

(Oh wow lawyers are gonna have fun with that! 'You see, your Honour, my client is innocent because he was genetically predisposed FROM BIRTH to kill people! Obviously it's the gods' faults for the murder of that family of five, not my client!')

"I think he objected to me possibly lying by omission."

"I'm actually trying to start a revolution against the current system (row row fight the powah!) of 'soul reincarnation' - which is more like 'soul recycling' to me - which I find to be unethical and morally upsetting. But yeah I guess what you said also applies."

[Kilojoule Proton]

(*Eats cooked starchy vegetable snacks*)

[gman8181]

I'm skeptical. There wasn't any serious ommission because what Yaos said is untrue. Individual souls are not indistinguishable. Having made a creation that takes advantage of just such a part of the reincarnation system, Yaos should know as much. Memories may be lost after reincarnation but they are far from losing their uniqueness. Furthermore, the very fact that souls can go to an afterlife while retaining memories and personality puts strain on the argument Yaos made.

If souls were completely undifferentiated from one another after death, would your little reincarnating angel work Yaos? Again, I'm highly skeptical given what I see.

[Andres]

I'm skeptical. There wasn't any serious ommission because what Yaos said is untrue. Individual souls are not indistinguishable. Having made a creation that takes advantage of just such a part of the reincarnation system, Yaos should know as much. Memories may be lost after reincarnation but they are far from losing their uniqueness. Furthermore, the very fact that souls can go to an afterlife while retaining memories and personality puts strain on the argument Yaos made.

If souls were completely undifferentiated from one another after death, would your little reincarnating angel work Yaos? Again, I'm highly skeptical given what I see.

"First, I'll respond by saying that while souls do keep everything when they go to an afterlife, they then proceed to lose everything once they leave said afterlife and reincarnate, or if they don't go to an afterlife at all and just reincarnate. That's why I had to specify that souls that go to the Human Plane stay there forever."
"As for the Duondio (I have GOT to come up with a better name), it is NOT a standard reincarnation. Not at all. It doesn't use the reincarnation system in place for other souls - it uses custom reincarnation cycle built specifically for that soul and even then it only keeps some of its personality traits, namely the desire to do good, the drive to help people with its powers (explained here,) and a predisposition to worshipping me due to being part Yaosian angel. Every other personality trait is generated normally."

[Vgray]

"If we're going to have this conversation, at least show yourselves to my poor prophet."

[Cptn Kaladin Anrizlokum]

Every other personality trait is generated normally.

But normally is not completely random. Normally they carry over from their previous life...

[Andres]

"If we're going to have this conversation, at least show yourselves to my poor prophet."

(I thought it was implied that I kinda reappeared once it became a conversation, rather than the mic drop moment it was initially intended to be.)

Every other personality trait is generated normally.

But normally is not completely random. Normally they carry over from their previous life...

"First, I said 'normally' instead of 'randomly' on purpose. Secondly, your first sentence is true. Thirdly, your second sentence is false because no, they don't."

[Vgray]

(Does that mean I have three other gods crowding my temple now?)

[Andres]

(Maybe we're all sitting in fluffy cloud heaven while our conversation takes place in the temple. We're gods so that makes sense.)

[Vgray]

"In any case, I thought I made it clear the inhabitants of my plane choose if they want to move on to the next world."

[Ambidextrous]

Kli takes a look at the state of Balance in the Bubble. Is there any trickery causing any warps or breakages that will cause the Bubble to become unstable?

[Kilojoule Proton]

Tick 33: Teamwork saves lives



Serac has initiated an eternal downpour over the region where the monster infestation is densest to wash away the blood they seemed to be using to summon more monsters.

Investigations of the creatures are ongoing, but the only interesting properties they seem to have are their mindlessness, high resistance to fire, and extreme ability overall. No particular weapon seems to be more effective on them as a whole.

Darruth has created the Archanjel Palatino, an angel with powerful support abilities, and attempted to inspire some mortals with the way of Goodness. Regrettably, it seems that the vast majority of mortals consider themselves sufficiently good.

Yaos has released a thousand Humanos Grandes and ten controller angels to assist in pushing back the monsters. While they perform quite well, their kill ratio is far below the expected requirement to survive the onslaught at all. Khaziraad has released a hall of warm war golems to fight the monsters. They survive for reasonably long times, but they kill fairly slowly. Dackstur has been sent to help defend villages around the site of monster spawning.

Lette and the Controlados have been sent to defend human settlements. The Seven Shiny Ones are fighting the monsters with meager success and evacuating people.

Grauel along with some of the braver, hardier Gruen have taken advantage of the seemingly endless food source to sate their hunger slightly. Testing has shown that consumption of the dead monsters produces a fairly easily anticipated boost to hardiness and a less easily anticipated decline in intelligence in Gruen.

Serac has locked in a gigantic ashen horse, a towering flamingo with external ribs, an enormous eyeless sheep, a great hairy slug, and a huge-eyed starling as the results of the megabeast-creation proposal. Possible additions to complete the list include the following:

• A towering, hairy theropod. It has thin wings of stretched skin and it has a regal bearing. Its heliotrope hair is short and even. Beware its poisonous sting! - Nature
• A gigantic, eyeless pheasant. It has two narrow tails and it emanates an aura of giving and kindness. Its pale chestnut feathers are patchy. - Sacrifice
• A gigantic, feathered crab. It has large mandibles and it has a bloated body. Its heliotrope feathers are fluffed-out. Beware its hunger for warm blood! - Jealousy
• An enormous mockingbird. It has a twisting, jointed trunk and it squirms and fidgets. Its lime feathers are long and sparse. Beware its poisonous vapors! - Depravity.

Angela has teleported away many survivors all over Keshan.

The Luminee have been granted tunneling knowledge. Unfortunately, it is useful only for hiding from the monsters, as it would take far too long to reach a dwarven fortress or a golem settlement even if the location were known. A Luminee Playwright weeps at the tragedy of a rival releasing a play on the current crisis first.

The Light has granted a quest to an adventurous Luminee, who has been renamed Crurcul the Destroying Light. He has received a special weapon from Fusil under the condition that he care for it enough to cause the birth and maturation of a weapon spirit. He has promised to produce many children for the weapon spirit for Fusil when that happens.

Darruth has sent the Seraphim out to spread Goodness, helped in providing training to assorted people, and marked the more eager followers as Palats for the purpose of receiving a blessing from the Archanjel.

Kujin has died of Essence loss. The cause and agent are still unknown.

Fusil has sent a caravan of Armu to deliver weapons and smiths to the Seraphim.

Yaos has sent the blank psymental angel to retrieve the Duondio from a family of beggars and creates a generic angel to fight the monsters. It is unknown whether the family's rejoicing at the removal of the toddler comes from the removal of a pest or the psymental angel's influence.

Kli has carefully examined the Bubble. There seems to be no trickery likely to cause the Bubble to collapse in the near present/future.

This update's constellations are the Dagger and Sword. The Slythan ice ring remains very prominent.

(Yaos: -3E)

Spoiler: Features (click to show/hide)

Spirit dimension:
Plane of Water and Bubbles   Serac
Plane of Night and Stars   Anath
Plane of Greed and Shinies   Azem
Plane of Humans and Ambition   Yaos
Plane of Order and Law   Cim
Plane of Randomness and Irony   Varee
Garden of Hunger   Grauel

Skyfeatures: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=144704.msg5731808#msg5731808 (maintained by Happerry/Anath)
Bestiary: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=144651.msg5779202;topicseen#msg5779202 (maintained by Andres/Yaos)

Unknown/Indeterminate:
Gigantic sky crab   The Light
Tykki, Angel of Arms   Fusil
Multiprism of Divine Light   The Light
Prophet of the Light   The Light
Magma well   Khaziraad
Ecumenical temple of Order   The Light/Luminee
School of Light   The Light/Luminee
Gremlins   Khaziraad
5 basic angels   Valkiss
5 basic angels   Azem
5 basic angels   Fusil
5 basic angels   Cim
5 basic angels   The Light
5 basic angels   Khaziraad
5 basic angels   Anath
Golden Dragon of Honor (5/5)   Fusil/Dar-MA-Gome
3 basic angels   Yaos
Kifo, Angel of DEATH

World 1:
Powered constellations   Anath
Intense aurora   Serac
Night/Star elves   Anath
Law of Cim copies   Cim
Mountwyrms   Azem
Tree of Balance   Kli
Luminees   The Light
Minio-ons   Varee
Gruen   Grauel
Golems   Khaziraad
Hummingbirds   Kli
Star/Night dragons   Anath
Gem dragons   Azem
Real Piece of Eight   Azem
Flea-on   Varee
Cave Noxen   Anath
Burrowers Beneath   Anath
Golden silk orb-weavers   Azem
Sorae   Serac
World Turtles   Serac
Wood elves   Joha
Template Humans   Azem
Dragons of Crystalline Light   The Light
1 Pantheon/race   Council
Termitians   Anath
Humanos Grandes   Yaos
Barrier Wood   Joha/Wood Elves
Breaker Knights   ? ? ?
Arrow of Light   The Light
Irrlichts   The Light
Burning Mirrors   The Light/Fusil/followers
Star squid   Anath
Arch-Lawyer   Yaos
Very Special Angel   Yaos
Lycae   Joha

World 2:
Powered constellations   Anath
Ice ring   Serac
Star/Night Elves   Anath
Beings of Serac   Serac
Law of Cim copies   Cim
Mountwyrms   Azem
Tree of Balance   Kli
Divine Library   Artisanii
Luminees   The Light
Minio-ons   Varee
Being Pantheons   Serac
Gruen   Grauel
Golems   Khaziraad
Hummingbirds   Kli
Night/Star dragons   Anath
Gem dragons   Azem
Second Piece of Eight   Azem
Flea-on   Varee
Cave Noxen   Anath
Burrowers Beneath   Anath
Golden silk orb-weavers   Azem
Artisanii's shrine/statue   Artisanii
Muses   Artisanii
Glowing armor of Light   Light
Guidance tablets   Light
School of Balance   Kli
Wood elves   Joha
Mantra   Artisanii
1 Pantheon/race   Council
Termitians   Anath
Irrlichts   The Light
Star squid   Anath

Both worlds:
Powered constellations   Anath
Night/Star elves   Anath
Law of Cim copies   Cim
Mountwyrms   Azem
Tree of Balance   Kli
Luminees   The Light
Minio-ons   Varee
Gruen   Grauel
Golems   Khaziraad
Hummingbirds   Kli
Star/Night dragons   Anath
Gem dragons   Azem
Pieces of Eight   Azem
The Devourer, Angel of Hunger   Grauel
Flea-on   Varee
Cave Noxen   Anath
Burrowers Beneath   Anath
Golden silk orb-weavers   Azem
Wood elves   Joha
1 Pantheon/race   Council
Termitians   Anath
Irrlichts   The Light
Star squid   Anath

Spoiler: Deities (0-*) (click to show/hide)

Cim the Lawgiver (Order, Law): 16/27, 7-8
Varee (Randomness): 21/22, 2-3
Fusil (Weapons): 9/21, 7-8
Azem (Greed, Trade): 29/29, 6-7
Anath (Night, Stars): 21/22, 6-7
Khaziraad (Architecture): 23/25, 4-5
Kli (Balance, Sacrifice): 23/23, 4-5
Grauel (Hunger): 12/25, 9-10
Serac (Oceans, Bubbles): 19/27, 4-5
The Light (Light): 23/25, 5-6
Artisanii (Arts, Inspiration): 24/23, 2-3
Yaos (Humans, Ambition): 4/20, 6-7
Joha (Life): 17/20, 3-4
Taol (Freedom): 17/20, 1-2
Neron (Ice): 20/20, 2-3
Darruth (Goodness): 6/20, 3-4

Dar-MA-Gome (Honor, Pride): 1(+4)/20, 0-1 (Sealed away)

Chyribylta (Fear, Ignorance): 20/20, 0-1 (Safe stasis)

The following players are in danger of being marked as inactive: MedicInDisquise/Artisanii, LostInNowhere/Joha, Illgeo/Taol

Spoiler: Council rules (0) (click to show/hide)

These are all subject to addition, removal, and change by you. They can effect changes in the game's core rules (mechanics), administrative laws (voting requirements, seniority privilegs, &c.) or the natural rules (light does not exist, gravity is repulsive, giant animals can fly like birds, &c.).
Administrative:
An active player is defined as a player who has posted within the thread within the last two (2) UTC days.

A bill must be supported by at least 50% of active players to pass if unopposed.

A bill must achieve 60% support in order to pass if opposed.

Players may flame the host if he has been inactive for at least two (2) UTC days.

Council resolutions will not be counted until at least a major tick has passed.

Council-produced creations are not to be tampered with without council approval. Failure to comply will result in the automated initiation of a trial.

03.01: Only deities supporting a proposal enter the Essence pool

04.03: Remove proposals stagnant for 3 ticks or double opposed to supported for 1 tick <0>

Starter Code of Conduct:
I. Thou Shall Not Cause Megadeaths Or Extinction Events
II. Thou Shall Not Seek the Death of Another God
III. Thou Shall Not Force Mortals To Worship You
IV. Thou Shall Not Force Mortals Not To Worship Other Gods
V. Thou Shall Not Break The Universe

Natural:
02.00.b: Created race(s) is not/are not all immortal <?>
02.01.a: Sapients and not sentients are the dominant mortals to be created <?>
02.02: Support reincarnation in general <0-1>
02.02.1: Support looped reincarnation (i.e. between two worlds)
02.04: Create a spirit and a corporeal realm <48/77, (6-7/11-13)>
02.04.1: Bifurcate corporeal realm <6-7 (0-1)>
03.06: Make constellations without needing council permission
02.01.a.2: Support free will for mortals <0>
03.04.1: 03.04 for first two planets <0>
03.00: Build 3 million sapient humanoids evenly split between Material World 1 and Material World
02.03: Create up to ~30 total immortal, godinalized servants <13-14 (3-4)>
02.04.3: Support further amendment to Valkiss' proposal <?>
03.06.1: Make magical constellations that influence magic on the worlds
03.09: Name the two partitions Keshan and Slytha
04.01: Create grand ecumenical temples for every race <High 3-4>
12.01: Anath's five-part starter code of conduct
18.01: Create monstrous flora and fauna <?>

21.00: Make a gas giant for each system <15-16 (2-3)>
24.00: Create the Plane of Death and Battle (or the Fighter Plane) (7-1/17) <1-2 (0-1)>

Spoiler: Council proposals (7) (click to show/hide)

31.00: 40% participation is needed to resolve a proposal instead of 50% (2-0/16)
+1 from Yaos
-1 from Cim

31.01: Autokilled proposals are resolved with zero-votes counted as Abstain votes (2-0/16)
+2 from Cim, Yaos

31.02: Create a karmic balance to encourage Goodness (1-4/16)
+1 from Darruth
0 from Cim
-4 from Fusil, Grauel, Azem, Yaos
31.02.1: Form a subcommittee to judge the intent of actions (1-4/16)
+1 from Darruth
0 from Cim
-4 from Fusil, Grauel, Azem, Yaos

32.00: Serac must destroy the Void temple or face punishment (1-0/16) [OBSOLETE]
+1 from Yaos

32.01: The Light's plans plan for the tower (1-0/16)
+1 from The Light

33.00: Teleport as many monsters as can be detected into the sun (1-0/16) <?>
+1 from Yaos

Spoiler: New Proposals (1) (click to show/hide)

33.00: Teleport as many monsters as can be detected into the sun (1-0/16) <?>
+1 from Yaos

Spoiler: 18.01 Monster ideas (closed barring dispute) (click to show/hide)

Array

Spoiler: 21.00 Gas giant ideas (Created; details phase?) (1) (click to show/hide)

21.00.1: Both gas giants are Jupiter-sized and have 30 major moons each (4-0/5) <+5 (+0-+1)> [PASSED]
+4 from Anath, Yaos, Taol, Yaos

21.00.2: 15 of each of the gas giant's moons should be barren and the other 15 should be made hospitable <6-8E>
+1 from Yaos

New players are no longer being added for the war minigame, although new players in general are welcome. The war stuff has been suspended due to lack of war (among players, anyway).