Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[x1uo3yd]

So I thought I'd try out DF again and play around on a map with a combination of volcano and shallow aquifers to try my hand at obsidian casting.

My dwarves built some temporary housing from wood and whatever lesser stones they could find and set upon building pump-stacks to bring water from the aquifer up to the rim level of my local volcano.  Forms were made from the same sorts of wood and stone, and the plan set into motion: to cast a large solid structure, from which a worthy natural-obsidian dwelling could be carved, with engravings depicting its creation upon the walls and floors.

Magma descended upon the form, filling the bottom layer just before the water came pouring down.  Thrice more the layers were poured, and no sooner was the fourth layer cool to touch than the miners set to work in shaping their new home. Only... there was one misgiving.  Instead of the solid obsidian megalith that they had toiled to create, only strata of their dreams were found, set between layers of ugly sand.  The walls could be smoothed, engraved, made to depict their adventures and toils, but the floors not so.  The ground beneath their feet was only something to kick around or cover.  Never would they find themselves trudging with their chins down to find the stories of their brethren lifting their spirits.

Seeing their work inferior to their aspirations, the dwarves tore down the mass of stone, reassuring themselves that the blocks and stones would make fine material, as they began to pour anew.  This time, the mud and grime would be stripped away with each added layer.  Each level would be smoothed anew before laying down the next strip of molten rock.  Alas, they found themselves once again with sand below their feet and nothing but more callus to show for their efforts.  Before a third vain effort, the dwarves implore the Mountainhomes to lend their wisdom of the magma-crafts.  How can one cast solid obsidian, with floors created of equal quality to the walls?

tl;dr What are the mechanics on casting obsidian floors (smoothable-engravable floors)?  I can't seem to get non-sand floors after pouring large 3+ tile thick slabs, despite trying both magma-water and magma-water-smooth layering procedures.  I'm sure my question ties into the natural-soil layer mechanics, but unusre if there is some simple procedure I am overlooking.

[neblime]

I believe this is caused by the water flowing over the top of it and depositing the sand/mud there, the only way I know of to get rid of it is build a floor on it unfortunately.  I'm not overly familiar with obsidian casting, is it at all possible to add JUST enough water to solidify all the magma and have no excess?

[Merendel]

Thats odd.   While I havent tried casting an obsidian monolith in .40.x versions I'd swear my obsidian tower back in .34.11 had obsidian floor tiles when I started to hollow out living spaces inside.  The ground floor should still be whatever material was there but upper levels should have obsidian floor not sand.

Maybe try building the thing on stilts and cave it in and see what happens?

I believe this is caused by the water flowing over the top of it and depositing the sand/mud there, the only way I know of to get rid of it is build a floor on it unfortunately.  I'm not overly familiar with obsidian casting, is it at all possible to add JUST enough water to solidify all the magma and have no excess?

Cant tell for sure what method he's useing from the story but yes its possible to drop exact amounts of water for casting.  Build a room way above the worksite to the exact dimensions of the cast.  Floor it with retracting bridges, fill the room with water and then seal the input then pull the lever to drop it on the magma.  should leave no leftover water to make mud.

[gunpowdertea]

Probably someone more knowledgeable will put that right but...
... wasn't the way floors and such are created when mining out changed in the new version? There was a rewrite to revert to the "natural" environment floor, so when mining out ore you will get floors that correspond to the material of the layer, not the vein. Do the sand floors appear in the same spots always? If so, that would be an indication for that.

[Tacomagic]

Hmm, sounds like it's time for... !!SCIENCE!!

I'll see if I can generate a good place to do some obsidian casting of my own and see what I can figure out.

[Nameless Archon]

As a quick hypothesis, given the description so far:

1. Cast towers are probably not impacted. There was no material at that level, so the obsidian floors appear.
2. underground cast areas are probably affected, as there's a "natural layer" on that z-level, leading to floors reverting after the casting/hollowing process.

[Tacomagic]

As a quick hypothesis, given the description so far:

1. Cast towers are probably not impacted. There was no material at that level, so the obsidian floors appear.
2. underground cast areas are probably affected, as there's a "natural layer" on that z-level, leading to floors reverting after the casting/hollowing process.

It may also matter how the floor is created.  I plan to dig out my cast obsidian in a number of ways to see if any of them change the outcome.

Still trying to generate a volcano close enough to both an aquifer and trees for testing this.

EDIT:  Ok, finally got one with all the prerequisites.  Time to magma!

[Loci]

In the v0.40.x branch, mining out a tile creates a floor of the layer type, not the tile type. For cast obsidian, you could argue that this behavior is a bug. Also, "sky" layers still have a layer material (as shown by DFHack's probe tool), so obsidian towers are likely to behave the same.

Casting a chunk of obsidian in a tile does create an obsidian floor in the level *above* (which remains obsidian as long as you don't cast or construct in that tile). This means you can create an obsidian tower with obsidian floors by casting it from the top down, not from the bottom up. That is, of course, a lot more work.

[ptb_ptb]

In related news: Brook surface = Rock.

If you channel out the surface of a brook, stone items are created just as if you were channeling out solid rock.

[ptb_ptb]

Is there no way (short of dfhack) to clean mud from floors?

[Tacomagic]

Is there no way (short of dfhack) to clean mud from floors?

Build a paved road and then remove it.  Pretty much the only way.

After a bunch of experimenting, I've basically found that obsidian works kinda like SMR right now.  Even if you have obsidian floor from casting the layer below, if you build any building on top of the obsidian and then deconstruct it, the floor reverts to the layer.

The only thing I haven't tried yet is to collapse a chunk of obsidian and then mine it.  My guess is that it'll act the same way, but it's worth a test.

[Max™]

I've had the !Fun! experience of learning that the sky has layer types.

Was doing infinitesky to get my trauma drop tower high enough for giblet production and lost a couple miners somehow.

Checked the layers with probe and noticed that besides there being biome types for the different sky layers, I think the second or third new level I added had a temperature of 0 urists, which caused the dorfs going through that layer to freeze to death almost immediately, to my chagrin. >.<

[ptb_ptb]

I think I have an idea, although I haven't tested it in anyway. I need to know something, though.

If you have magma/lava and you pour water on you get obsidian where the magma was, right?
What happens if you have water and you pour lava on top of it. Do you get obsidian over water or does the water layer turn into obsidian?

[EDIT] Nevermind, I just checked. You get lava over obsidian if you do that.

My idea is to cast the obsidian with no mining required afterwards.

For solid bottom layer, have water everywhere and pour just enough lava on top.
For the layers after that have floodgates everywhere you don't want obsidian, and water everywhere else. Then add lava. Dismantle floodgates afterwards. Hopefully placing / removing floodgates is _not_ enough to turn obsidian floor back to ordinary soil / stone.