Bay 12 Games Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

Poll

Should other religions be added to this thread?

No
Only Judeism
Only Islam
Yes to both Judeism and Islam

Pages: 1 ... 99 100 [101] 102 103 ... 185

Author Topic: Christian beliefs and discussion  (Read 190290 times)

MonkeyHead

  • Bay Watcher
  • Yma o hyd...
    • View Profile
Re: Christian beliefs and discussion
« Reply #1500 on: October 25, 2014, 08:30:11 am »

I wouldn't say deliberately designed to be unfalsifiable, more that unfalsifiable interpretations are all they can use without being ridiculed.

I think theistic faith has tended towards falsifiability simply as any arguments previously relied upon have been falsified and by necessity abandoned. Well, some at least. Some pretty insane ones still remain, kicking and screaming in the face of reason.
Logged
This is a blank sig.

Cryxis, Prince of Doom

  • Bay Watcher
  • Achievment *Fail freshman year uni*
    • View Profile
Re: Christian beliefs and discussion
« Reply #1501 on: October 25, 2014, 10:24:18 am »

that is changing to survive but I don't believe in actually evolving though
That is evolution though?

To an extent
I don't believe in an ameba turning into a fish into a lizard into a mamal into a monkey into a pre-human into a human
I do believe bird can change the shape of it's beak slowly so it can eat a different food
Or that insects can slowly gain imunity to pesticides
Just not that they can physically change into something more complex
Logged
Fueled by caffeine, nicotine, and a surprisingly low will to live.
Cryxis makes the best typos.

scriver

  • Bay Watcher
  • City streets ain't got much pity
    • View Profile
Re: Christian beliefs and discussion
« Reply #1502 on: October 25, 2014, 10:34:44 am »

Many tiny streams of physical alteration a great flood of change can become~
Logged
Love, scriver~

Helgoland

  • Bay Watcher
  • No man is an island.
    • View Profile
Re: Christian beliefs and discussion
« Reply #1503 on: October 25, 2014, 10:38:17 am »

To put the finger in the wound: Do you have a definition of "more complex"?
Logged
The Bay12 postcard club
Arguably he's already a progressive, just one in the style of an enlightened Kaiser.
I'm going to do the smart thing here and disengage. This isn't a hill I paticularly care to die on.

Cryxis, Prince of Doom

  • Bay Watcher
  • Achievment *Fail freshman year uni*
    • View Profile
Re: Christian beliefs and discussion
« Reply #1504 on: October 25, 2014, 10:41:37 am »

Many tiny streams of physical alteration a great flood of change can become~
For me it stops when the thing changing has to add on more chromosomes/more DNA to become the next thing
Until we find evidence of something that adds more chromosomes than it already has to itself and alters I won't believe that kind of evolution exists


To put the finger in the wound: Do you have a definition of "more complex"?

When the creature has to add more DNA to each of it's cells
Specificaly when it needs to add a whole new chromosome
I haven't found any research showing this happening in modern animals that's why I don't believe it
And please don't throw a 180 saying I have no proof on the bible things either because there is just as much if not much more proof of those things than evolution and I have my faith
Logged
Fueled by caffeine, nicotine, and a surprisingly low will to live.
Cryxis makes the best typos.

Graknorke

  • Bay Watcher
  • A bomb's a bad choice for close-range combat.
    • View Profile
Re: Christian beliefs and discussion
« Reply #1505 on: October 25, 2014, 11:08:39 am »

When the creature has to add more DNA to each of it's cells
Specificaly when it needs to add a whole new chromosome
I was so hoping you would say that.
Sourced from here.

EDIT: Cut off the list too early, my mistake.
« Last Edit: October 25, 2014, 11:15:18 am by Graknorke »
Logged
Cultural status:
Depleted          ☐
Enriched          ☑

Arx

  • Bay Watcher
  • Iron within, iron without.
    • View Profile
    • Art!
Re: Christian beliefs and discussion
« Reply #1506 on: October 25, 2014, 11:22:45 am »

That's very impressive and all, but how's it relevant to Cryxis's position?
Logged

I am on Discord as Arx#2415.
Hail to the mind of man! / Fire in the sky
I've been waiting for you / On this day we die.

Frumple

  • Bay Watcher
  • The Prettiest Kyuuki
    • View Profile
Re: Christian beliefs and discussion
« Reply #1507 on: October 25, 2014, 11:24:50 am »

Until we find evidence of something that adds more chromosomes than it already has to itself and alters I won't believe that kind of evolution exists
Yes? That's just intraspecies, but it's an explicit example of additional (or removed) chromosomes leading to physiological changes. Several (if not, perhaps, all) of the mechanisms behind chromosome addition or subtraction are known and observed.

If you're looking for some examples of observed speciation, including some that occur through change in chromosomal number, you can check here -- it's about a decade old, but that doesn't really mean much. The list starts about half way through, with explanations of what's going on in each, and the sources are at the bottom for your perusal.
Logged
Ask not!
What your country can hump for you.
Ask!
What you can hump for your country.

scriver

  • Bay Watcher
  • City streets ain't got much pity
    • View Profile
Re: Christian beliefs and discussion
« Reply #1508 on: October 25, 2014, 11:26:20 am »

It might be more relevant to point out that people are born with too few of too many chromosomes quite often, though.
Logged
Love, scriver~

TD1

  • Bay Watcher
  • Childe Roland to the Dark Tower Came
    • View Profile
Re: Christian beliefs and discussion
« Reply #1509 on: October 25, 2014, 11:30:18 am »

The link named "Yes" has that near the top.

Also, I believe there may be some evidence in the ribosomal layout of...something that suggest bacterial DNA got implemented into the general mix.

I may be remembering incorrectly, so if that rings any bells for any Biologists out there, please verify.
Logged
Life before death, strength before weakness, journey before destination
  TD1 has claimed the title of Penblessed the Endless Fountain of Epics!
Sigtext!
Poetry Thread

MonkeyHead

  • Bay Watcher
  • Yma o hyd...
    • View Profile
Re: Christian beliefs and discussion
« Reply #1510 on: October 25, 2014, 11:41:41 am »

Chromosome 2 in Human DNA might also be relevant to Cryxis misinterpretation of evolutionary biomechanics.
Logged
This is a blank sig.

Arcvasti

  • Bay Watcher
  • [IS_ALREADY_HERE] [FRIENDSHIPPER:HIGH]
    • View Profile
Re: Christian beliefs and discussion
« Reply #1511 on: October 25, 2014, 11:52:54 am »

Many tiny streams of physical alteration a great flood of change can become~
For me it stops when the thing changing has to add on more chromosomes/more DNA to become the next thing
Until we find evidence of something that adds more chromosomes than it already has to itself and alters I won't believe that kind of evolution exists


To put the finger in the wound: Do you have a definition of "more complex"?

When the creature has to add more DNA to each of it's cells
Specificaly when it needs to add a whole new chromosome
I haven't found any research showing this happening in modern animals that's why I don't believe it
And please don't throw a 180 saying I have no proof on the bible things either because there is just as much if not much more proof of those things than evolution and I have my faith

From what I remember, ameobas have MORE complex chromosomes and longer DNA codes then most other creatures[Not actually sure about this one.]. What I think you're getting at is that you don't believe in MACRO-evolution, but do believe in micro evolution? That's a pretty reasonable standpoint, especially compared to Young Earth creationism. Macroevolution doesn't have as much concrete proof behind it as Microevolution. You can demonstrate the latter with bacteria in a jar over a span of days. The former takes millions of years of accumulated tiny changes. Ameoba's turning into things is pretty far fetched. But just think of the timescales involved. If you had a bird peck out and carry away grains of sand one by one from a mountain for that amount of time, it ends up as a chasm deeper then Mariana's Trench and a sand pile larger then any mountain. Macroevolution is pretty hard to watch hapen, any more then you can watch continents or glaciers moving or measure your fingernails growing second by second. But, in the end, the result is a tremendous change.

EDIT: Why is everyone giving me interesting links? I was going to do some cleaning before I opened this thread.

* Arcvasti rolls a 1 on his will save to resist biology

Dammit.
Logged
If you expect to live forever then you will never be disappointed.
Spooky Signature
To fix the horrid default colour scheme, follow the below steps:
Profile> Modify Profile> Look and Layout> Current Theme> (change)> Darkling

Cryxis, Prince of Doom

  • Bay Watcher
  • Achievment *Fail freshman year uni*
    • View Profile
Re: Christian beliefs and discussion
« Reply #1512 on: October 25, 2014, 12:47:01 pm »

I don't currently have the time to read those sources though I will later


And when I said adding/subtracting chromosomes I meant in a way that turns the entire species into something complexly different, i.e. ameboa into a fish or fish into an amphibian or amphibian into mammal etc etc
Logged
Fueled by caffeine, nicotine, and a surprisingly low will to live.
Cryxis makes the best typos.

Arx

  • Bay Watcher
  • Iron within, iron without.
    • View Profile
    • Art!
Re: Christian beliefs and discussion
« Reply #1513 on: October 25, 2014, 12:50:48 pm »

Also, I believe there may be some evidence in the ribosomal layout of...something that suggest bacterial DNA got implemented into the general mix.

I may be remembering incorrectly, so if that rings any bells for any Biologists out there, please verify.

Yep, that sounds very correct to me. I think you have more ranks in Biology than me, though.  :P
Logged

I am on Discord as Arx#2415.
Hail to the mind of man! / Fire in the sky
I've been waiting for you / On this day we die.

cerapa

  • Bay Watcher
  • It wont bite....unless you are the sun.
    • View Profile
Re: Christian beliefs and discussion
« Reply #1514 on: October 25, 2014, 01:08:52 pm »

And when I said adding/subtracting chromosomes I meant in a way that turns the entire species into something complexly different, i.e. ameboa into a fish or fish into an amphibian or amphibian into mammal etc etc

First google result has an explanation of how the number of chromosomes can change. http://scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/2008/04/21/basics-how-can-chromosome-numb/

Also, I suspect you might have an odd understanding of evolution based on the use of the term "entire species".
Logged

Tick, tick, tick the time goes by,
tick, tick, tick the clock blows up.
Pages: 1 ... 99 100 [101] 102 103 ... 185