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Should other religions be added to this thread?

No
Only Judeism
Only Islam
Yes to both Judeism and Islam

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Author Topic: Christian beliefs and discussion  (Read 195140 times)

Cptn Kaladin Anrizlokum

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Re: Christian beliefs and homosexuality
« Reply #165 on: September 19, 2014, 04:58:25 pm »

How does non-sin suffering fit into this? How do hurricanes, stillbirths, and ebola reflect God's nature?
So here is something interesting that I believe could be true, and kind of fixes problems like this.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

But does it really matter? I believe that you should be a good person. That's what matters most. Other things are not as important.
« Last Edit: September 19, 2014, 05:02:39 pm by Cptn Kaladin Anrizlokum »
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Cthulhu

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Re: Christian beliefs and discussion
« Reply #166 on: September 19, 2014, 05:14:45 pm »

That's not really a god I'm interested in worshiping.  I don't discount that maybe there is something like that but it doesn't really have any bearing on my existence.


Whatever there is, if there's something, I don't see it being something that needs, cares about, or probably is even aware of human worship and obedience.  One thing I've navel-gazed about and kind of want to try writing in this creative writing class I'm taking if a prompt suits it, is a kind of Spinoza-esque setup where the Divine Mind is an emergent property of the mechanical structure of the universe.

Like, you've got a lump of wet organic tissue and constant electrical activity of the billions of stringy things composing it corresponds, in its totality, to human thought.  In sort of the same way the positions and motions and interactions of the universe (from superstrand to subatomic) at some  inscrutable level corresponds to divine thought.

I don't believe it but it's a fun idea to think about.
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penguinofhonor

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Re: Christian beliefs and discussion
« Reply #167 on: September 19, 2014, 05:25:56 pm »

I would read that sci-fi story.
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Loam

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Re: Christian beliefs and discussion
« Reply #168 on: September 19, 2014, 06:06:11 pm »

What if i see a man pointing a gun to a random good individual, about to shoot him, and its apparent that a dialogue wont do any good nor delay the execution and i got a gun. does shooting the potential killer means i fail to respect his right to life and therefor i am a sinner? does not shooting him means i fail to respect the potential victim right to life and therefor i am as just a sinner?

What if i see a boulder rolling in the direction of some good random guy and by jumping to its path, i can save that poor lad life on the expense of my own. am i a sinner by not jumping to its path? (Failing to respect their right to life) am i a sinner by jumping to its path? (Failing to respect my right to life)

What if some pedophile serial killer just got killed by one of its victim's dad and upon hearing about it i was extremely happy because from my perspective, he had no right to continue living. is the Dad just as a sinner as the pedophile? am i just as sinner as the dad because i wished that pedophile to be dead?

What if my boss extremely annoyed me and i wished with all my heart that he'd get run by a truck. am i a sinner?

Killing another human being is always sinful, even in self-defense or defense of another.
HOWEVER, there are three parts to any choice: action, intention, and circumstance. In this case, the action is sinful, but the intention is noble, and the circumstance (in this case, the lack of non-violent resolution) acts to justify the action. What you have in sum total is something which is neither moral nor immoral, but is ethical (my terminology). In short, you won't go to hell for it, but it's still not "good."

The second part of that and the second case are a bit more fuzzy. Because you don't directly and purposefully cause the death of either person, you aren't taking away their right to life. That said, in order to be totally moral (not necessarily totally ethical) you would have to do whatever was in your power to help them: that's fundamental to Christianity, the selfless helping of others.

Wishing death on others is also sinful, as it degrades their human dignity: the right to life is inviolable and can never be revoked, no matter what someone does (this is why Catholicism is against the death penalty). However, feeling happy that justice has been done (in this case, that a criminal received his due) is natural; and while even the death of a horrible person should never be celebrated, feeling good that he's gone isn't something anyone would blame you for.

As for the dad being "just as much" a sinner as the pedophile, bear in mind that there are no varying degrees of sin: you're either for God or agin' Him, essentially. But the circumstances and the gravity of the offense can mitigate it. Depending on the circumstances, I'd have to say the dad would have committed a mortal sin, though still somewhat mitigated because it was in reaction to a previous offense. Still, Christ tells us to forgive those who hurt us, and revenge killing is just about the polar opposite of forgiveness. It's a hard pill to swallow, I grant, but it's what we're called to do.


I believe that you should be a good person. That's what matters most. Other things are not as important.
Essentially. As long as you follow your conscience - provided your conscience is not intentionally malformed - then even if you do something *technically* sinful, you won't be held fully accountable. Maybe some time in purgatory, who knows; but everyone can expect some time in purgatory.


That is a funny joke. Although, I take it more in the sense of "Stop worrying so much about proscriptive morals; God is concerned with so much more than that."
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Phmcw

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Re: Christian beliefs and discussion
« Reply #169 on: September 19, 2014, 06:14:44 pm »

Quote
That is a funny joke. Although, I take it more in the sense of "Stop worrying so much about proscriptive morals; God is concerned with so much more than that."

I really, really don't think that you can begin to grasp what we'll charitably call the intention of a God. I said charitably because anything transcendental is boud to function differently than us.

You're next to God what a dwarf of df is next to you.

That's why I really think Toady have done the most significant artwork of the last century, at least. He literally created the opposite of God's world :  a world compared to whose inhabitant we are transandental beings. And what would you say to one of your dwarf that he could understand?
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Orange Wizard

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Re: Christian beliefs and discussion
« Reply #170 on: September 19, 2014, 06:31:05 pm »

"Pull the lever."
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Lyeos

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Re: Christian beliefs and discussion
« Reply #171 on: September 19, 2014, 06:47:11 pm »

"Pull the lever."
"Dammit, not another mandate!"
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4maskwolf

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Re: Christian beliefs and discussion
« Reply #172 on: September 19, 2014, 07:11:48 pm »

"Make thirty sets of goblets NOW!"

Flying Dice

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Re: Christian beliefs and discussion
« Reply #173 on: September 19, 2014, 07:15:16 pm »

I've absolutely zero interest in getting involved in yet another argument regarding religion (more than enough of those in meatspace, thank'ee), but I'm going to drop a round of applause for making it a dozen pages without getting the thread locked.
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Loam

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Re: Christian beliefs and discussion
« Reply #174 on: September 19, 2014, 07:15:50 pm »

That's why I really think Toady have done the most significant artwork of the last century, at least. He literally created the opposite of God's world :  a world compared to whose inhabitant we are transandental beings. And what would you say to one of your dwarf that he could understand?
You may have a point. I certainly wouldn't run up a dragon to grab an old loincloth.
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Baffler

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Re: Christian beliefs and discussion
« Reply #175 on: September 19, 2014, 07:18:09 pm »

And what would you say to one of your dwarf that he could understand?

[q] -> [a] -> [P]
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TD1

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Re: Christian beliefs and discussion
« Reply #176 on: September 19, 2014, 07:20:59 pm »

PTW, and to mention the joke that is known as Queen James Bible.
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Gnorm

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Re: Christian beliefs and discussion
« Reply #177 on: September 19, 2014, 07:22:40 pm »

PTW, and to mention the joke that is known as Queen James Bible.
I don't think that such a perversion should be mentioned here.
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4maskwolf

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Re: Christian beliefs and discussion
« Reply #178 on: September 19, 2014, 07:24:57 pm »

PTW, and to mention the joke that is known as Queen James Bible.
I don't think that such a perversion should be mentioned here.
Au contraire, I believe that anything goes, as long as you don't set out meaning to insult someone or put them down or break any forum rules.

TD1

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Re: Christian beliefs and discussion
« Reply #179 on: September 19, 2014, 07:25:40 pm »

I PTWd before I read through most of the thread. Only a page or two in at the moment, and it seemed to be about Christians and Homosexuality.

The torturous combination of the two is the Queen James Bible.
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